strmblsd he/him Posted March 17, 2024 Posted March 17, 2024 So hoid and nomads torments are different in some ways I've heard. What are the differences and why are the different. Do you think it could be based on perspective like the oaths for radiants and because hoid has had his for so long he can think in specific ways to allow stuff?
Treamayne Posted March 17, 2024 Posted March 17, 2024 3 hours ago, strmblsd said: So hoid and nomads torments are different in some ways I've heard. What are the differences and why are the different. Do you think it could be based on perspective like the oaths for radiants and because hoid has had his for so long he can think in specific ways to allow stuff? Here are the WoBs addressing this: Spoiler Quote Brandon Sanderson Let's talk about the Torment for a second. Hoid would not call what has happened to him a Torment. Hoid, by holding a Dawnshard, was made permanently unable to cause physical harm to other beings. Eating meat makes him nauseous (if he is somehow able to eat it, and a lot of the times he just can't). That is because of the nature of the Dawnshard that he held actively warping and changing his spirit. He would not name it this. Nomad has named what has happened to him, a Torment. This is not a term that you can universally apply as a magical aspect of something. This is Sigzil saying "this terrible thing happened to me". And indeed what is happening to Sigzil is on a level beyond what happened to Hoid. So therefore perhaps other arcanists would say, "Yes, these are an aspect of holding a Dawnshard and Torment is the right way", but that word is loaded. That word has meaning, and someone is naming it this. You are not gonna run into a large set of people- there are only four Dawnshards- and you're not gonna run into a large set of people that have held one, so there may be no consensus even in-world to what these are called, and if they are Torment or blessings or what they are. Holding a Dawnshard will warp your soul. It's so much Investiture, it is so powerful, that you cannot hold one even briefly without it having a permanent effect upon you. Secret Project #4 Reveal and Livestream (March 29, 2022) Quote eillerebyhk Do all Dawnshards come with a Torment? Brandon Sanderson Not necessarily. It depends on your definition of Torment, and it depends on some other context. Matt Hatch "Some other context." Love that. Brandon Sanderson Yes. As you find out more about the Dawnshards, that will become more clear. Secret Project #4 Reveal and Livestream (March 29, 2022) Basically, you're right. Nomad has a Torment because he views what is happening based on being a Dawnsliver to be a Torment. 3
alder24 Posted March 17, 2024 Posted March 17, 2024 3 hours ago, strmblsd said: So hoid and nomads torments are different in some ways I've heard. What are the differences and why are the different. Do you think it could be based on perspective like the oaths for radiants and because hoid has had his for so long he can think in specific ways to allow stuff? Not perception. Nomad calls it the Torment because he thinks it's something terrible and Hoid doesn't, however this doesn't affect what the Torment is. What matters is how long they hold the Dawnshard. Hoid held it for much longer than Nomad and that changed him even more, thus his Torment is different. But Nomand had different circumstances, which matter too. Their perception plays some role in determining what's a harm, or a weapon, or even meat. But this isn't purely perception based - Nomad constantly tried to cheat the system but the system kept updating, preventing him from doing it again. And Hoid can't Skip like Nomad, or at least in the current time. There will be a certain event that allows Nomad Skip, but we don't know if Hoid can do that as well in the future or that's something Nomad-exclusive (he didn't Skip in Yumi so probably he can't). TSM ch 34: Quote Pain started to prickle across his arms and legs. He was so low on Investiture, it took longer than normal to heal. Fortunately these were the easy kind of wounds to survive with his particular talents. Terrible burns didn’t directly impact his core organs or his skeletal structure. The body knew what to do, and his warped soul—for all he hated the part that prevented him from defending himself—fed on Investiture to restore him, bit by bit. His master, who had held the Dawnshard far longer, could never die. Nomad was far from that level. Spoiler Questioner Hoid's ability to hurt Kelsier, is that due to his perceptions and beliefs or those of an external entity? Brandon Sanderson It's going to be a bit of both but more his perceptions and beliefs. This is how a lot of things work in the Cosmere, particularly if you're where they were. Starsight Release Party (Nov. 26, 2019) Spoiler Questioner Can Hoid eat Soulcast bacon? Brandon Sanderson Yes. He could probably eat lab-grown meat if he knew it was (or magic-grown meat). He probably could. His psychology will be influencing this, right? Which is why I say "probably." But the magic would allow it. Billy todd If somebody lied to him about the nature of the meat, could he eat that? Brandon Sanderson No. Well, okay, if they lied and said it was Soulcast, yes, then he probably could. Questioner 2 It's based on his perception. Brandon Sanderson It's based on his perception, yeah. JordanCon 2021 (July 17, 2021) Spoiler Voidblessed27 Can Hoid “Skip” like Sigzil? Brandon Sanderson RAFO. He hasn't been able to in the past. You have not seen him able to do so in the books that you have read. If we take the current Cosmere timeline as being where basically Stormlight is, with maybe the Wax and Wayne books. That's where we are in the real timeline of the Cosmere, without the glimpses of the future that some of these books are providing. Hoid has no idea how to do this. [...] Secret Project #4 Reveal and Livestream (March 29, 2022) Spoiler Questioner Is there a specific reason as to why Hoid cannot Skip, but Nomad can? Brandon Sanderson Yes, there is a specific reason for that. I'll get into it someday. Let's just say the Skipping started because of a certain event, that probably I won't write a book to talk about, but you will get an answer to that someday I hope. So it's a RAFO, but a RAFO with a little bit of a promise. Dragonsteel 2023 (Nov. 21, 2023) 1
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