[Theory] The Fused Must be Created From Singers with Previous Connection Bonds to Sentient-Type Spren

[teknopathetic he/him]

Now it may just be a fluke that Leshwi knew a Radiant-type True spren so well in the past, but what if it isn’t a coincidence? What is Leshwi isn’t an odd case in caring for a Sentient-Type Spren in the past. 

We know that Odium has never made any more Fused since the original set. I used to assume Odium did not want to make more fused as that might weaken him, but what if Odium cannot make more Fused because there were no longer any Parshendi with the proper connections.

Would it be possible that Odium can only make Fused out of Singers who either had a currently had a Sentient-type spren bond, or those who had a previous connection to the surges given by sentient-type spren?

So my theory is that Odium created the Fused out of the Singers who lost their Sentient-Type True Spren connection after the spren had abandoned them  

Obviously this bond was not exactly like a human nahel bond, but there is some sort of proto-relationship here

This also may explain why some Fused brands are rarer than others. It is that there were fewer of that type of spren around for any Singer to have been bonded with in the past (much like Inkspren currently for Radiants)  

Based on Leshwi believing her spren had been alive post fusing, I think after the Spren left the Singers, Odium was able to create Fused out of the connection that was left behind. Odium cannot make new Fused until he has Parshendi with intelligent-type spren connections to the surges again  

Edit:

Possible Example:

1) Some Parshendi before the humans arrived could shape the earth, dip items to form tools, and sing into existence large buildings. Perhaps this was granted by some sort of association with Peakspren. Perhaps only one surge-equivalent was granted, as we know humans were seen as better bondholders by the spren.

2) The Peakspren are then lured away to human leaving the Parshendi unable to use the "surges" as it were. There may be some Parshendi that could still find spren, but many Parshendi are disaffected and upset about the spren leaving to go be with humans. Whatever the relationship at first with humans, it seems that nahel-surges are not the first thing to happen. Nahel-Surges form later in the war as far as we know. 

3) Odium connects these Peakspren-Parshendi and creates the Parsheni that can slide through Earth. Odium can do this due to the previous connection these Peakspren-Parshendi had to a surge granted by the Peakspren. 

4) The spren are extremely offended by what that the Parshendi have done, and the spren decide not to bond with Parshendi anymore. The spren likely keep this promise until Venli appears. 
 

 

Edited November 7, 2023 by teknopathetic

[Sophrosyne he/him]

Thinking about it this makes a good bit of sense. Clearly something is different about the Singers that eventually became the Fused and a nahel bond, a sentient-type spren bond that grants surges, is low hanging fruit for that difference. That might just be the plan for Dalniar as Odium’s champion If he managed to keep enough Bondsmithing to force Radiant to become Fused… very scary things follow that. But regardless of that It worries me that if this is correct every radiant Parshendi or human is in real danger should they lose their bond for whatever reason.

But it leaves a few questions in my mind.
Where did the second surge go?
Possible answer: Maybe only being one shard he can only supply one surge? I don’t lov this thought but it’s good enough I suppose.
What did Odium do to the connection?
I know that those cracks in the soul make control easier and supplying power possible think it’s also confirmed that the Fused are kinda like pseudo-Odium spren and when they are taken into another Parshendi they override their thoughts and forms but how?

[alder24]

12 hours ago, teknopathetic said:

Now it may just be a fluke that Leshwi knew a Radiant-type spren so well, but what if it isn’t a coincidence? What is Leshwi isn’t an odd case in caring for a Sentient-Type Spren in the past. 

We know that Odium has never made any more Fused since the original set. I used to assume Odium did not want to make more fused as that might weaken him, but what if Odium cannot make more Fused because there were no longer any Parshendi with the proper connections.

Would it be possible that Odium can only make Fused out of Singers who either had a currently had a Sentient-type spren bond, or those who had a previous connection to the surges given by sentient-type spren?

So my theory is that Odium created the Fused out of the Singers who lost their Sentient-Type connection after the spren had abandoned them  

This also may explain why some Fused brands are rarer than others. It is that there were fewer of that type of spren around for any Singer to have been bonded with in the past (much like Inkspren currently for Radiants)  

Based on Leshwi believing her spren had been alive post fusing, I think after the Spren left the Singers, Odium was able to create Fused out of the connection that was left behind. Odium cannot make new Fused until he has Parshendi with intelligent-type spren connections to the surges again  

I'm not sure that Ture Spren were ever bonded to Singers - we know that they refused to grant Surges to Singers, which would make more sense if they weren't bonded. But as seen by Syl in WoR, spren can deny their knight access to Surges, so this might be what had happened. However Leshwi claimed, and Blended confirmed, to have done something terrible to True Spren, a betrayal that made Spren turn away from them towards humans. What was it we don't know yet.

This theory has a merit, I think it would make more sense if Odium fused Singers with the spren they were bonded with, making them into literal Fused. It would also be in line with Odium wanting to make Dalinar into Fused, as he is bonded with the Stormfather. However if that was done to True Spren, this betrayal would certainly be on par with Recreance, which is something Blended said it didn't happen, RoW ch 87:

Quote

“Humans are not from this land,” Blended said. “You are invaders, and bonds with you are not natural. Be careful what you say—you will encourage us to return to the singers. They betrayed us long ago, but never on the scale of the humans.”

 

[teknopathetic he/him]

The fact that Leshwi says “they’ve forgiven us” in reply to Venli having a True-Spren bond implies that true-spren bonds had happened in the past. 

[alder24]

14 hours ago, teknopathetic said:

The fact that Leshwi says “they’ve forgiven us” in reply to Venli having a True-Spren bond implies that true-spren bonds had happened in the past. 

I agree that's one possibility, but I simply point out that we don't know for certain, and the other possibility, that they had relations without being bound, is almost as likely as Dawnsingers being bonded to True Spren. Also when Venli practiced the Surge of Cohesion in Urithiru, it is implied that ancient Dawnsingers didn't use Radiant Surges (obviously they didn't exist back then), and didn't bond with True Spren (True Spren bonding with people is a new thing). RoW ch 67:

Quote

She saw them. Ancient people, the Dawnsingers, working the stone. Creating cities, tools. They didn’t need Soulcasting or forges. They’d dip lengths of wood into the stone, and come out with axes. They’d shape bowls with their fingers. All the while, the stone would sing to them.
Feel me, shaper. Create from me. We are one. The stone shapes your life as you shape the stone.
Welcome home, child of the ancients.
“How?” Venli asked. “Radiants didn’t exist then. Spren didn’t bond us … did they?”
Things are new, the stones hummed, but new things are made from old things, and old peoples give birth to new ones. Old stones remember.

 

Edited November 4, 2023 by alder24

[teknopathetic he/him]

10 hours ago, alder24 said:

I agree that's one possibility, but I simply point out that we don't know for certain, and the other possibility, that they had relations without being bound, is almost as likely as Dawnsingers being bonded to True Spren. Also when Venli practiced the Surge of Cohesion in Urithiru, it is implied that ancient Dawnsingers didn't use Radiant Surges (obviously they didn't exist back then), and didn't bond with True Spren (True Spren bonding with people is a new thing). RoW ch 67:

 

I completely agree that whatever the relationship was between the Singers and True Spren was different than a Human Nahel Bond

However, we do know that the spren were more attracted to the bonds that spren could have with humans over the bonds they had with Singers. I think this implies there must have been something similar going on. 

Venli’s conversation with the stones says that Nahel Bonds with Parshendi are new, but that new things come from old things. That to me implies there was some sort of relationship going on in the ancient past. 

Edited November 5, 2023 by teknopathetic

[Zapata]

On 11/4/2023 at 8:33 PM, teknopathetic said:

I completely agree that whatever the relationship was between the Singers and True Spren was different than a Human Nahel Bond

However, we do know that the spren were more attracted to the bonds that spren could have with humans over the bonds they had with Singers. I think this implies there must have been something similar going on. 

Venli’s conversation with the stones says that Nahel Bonds with Parshendi are new, but that new things come from old things. That to me implies there was some sort of relationship going on in the ancient past. 

We know that humans as a whole feel their emotions more strongly than singers do, since singers rarely draw spren. This is what frustrated Listener scholars who tried to attain more forms in the Eshonai/Venli viewpoints. So already this appeals more to the spren. 

I believe that the Dawnsingers would take True Spren into their gemhearts and attain forms of power that granted one surge each. (This is why the Heavenly Ones betrayed Lezian and Raboniel during the battle; they all have personalities that would draw Honorspren, and so would not hurt defenseless people) This would also be why the Fused believe that Adhesion is not a true Surge; because "Adhesionform" would only be granted by Bondsmith Spren, and they did not ever enter a gemheart. Perhaps human bonds were more attractive than Dawnsinger bonds because humans don't have gemhearts.

Humans arrive and start to draw emotion spren and True spren more readily than the Dawnsingers do, and they begin expansion out of Shinovar.

The Dawnsingers approach Odium in order to stop the humans' expansion.

Either this drives the spren out of Dawnsinger gemhearts, and Odium reconnects them with their previous Surge by turning them into Fused, or Odium corrupts the spren in their gemhearts to Fuse the Singer and spren.

Whatever Odium does drives all True Spren away from the singers until Eshonai bonds Timbre.

Edited November 7, 2023 by Zapata

[Eahlendell]

Reading these comments made me think that the dawnsingers would have been around in the time of Adonalsium. We know he created the Rosharan System. Imagine spren and singers in a symbiotic system. Honor and cultivation turn up, new forms of spren appear. I imagine odium could sell the idea of fusing with your spren being a Good thing.