an unconventional use of hemalurgy

[Alumínio]

Eu me peguei pensando, minha capacidade de fazer meu trabalho é minha maneira de chegar ao raciocínio [capacidade lógica (inteligência)] combinada com minhas experiências (memórias), então, se alguém conhecesse o BindPoint certo, poderia, com uma ponta de cobre, roubar as capacidades de um cirurgião? a habilidade política de um parlamentar ou a capacidade de negociação de um empresário?

[Trusk'our]

1 hour ago, Alumínio said:

I found myself thinking, my ability to do my job is my way of arriving at reasoning [logical ability (intelligence)] combined with my experiences (memories), so if someone knew the right BindPoint, could they, with a copper tip, steal a surgeon's capabilities? the political skill of a parliamentarian or the negotiating skills of a businessman?

In the Cosmere, muscle memory, skill, and language seems to be tied to one's Spiritual aspect, while actual conscious memories are part of the Cognitive Aspect. Hemalurgy doesn't deal with the Cognitive Aspect or Physical Aspect (technically, that is; it's use can affect those parts of the Hemalurgists, but only in an indirect way by affecting the Spiritual Aspect).

Warbreaker spoilers;

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/66/#e3165

ccstat

Vasher uses Awakening in a very interesting way, off-stage, to modify the memories of the girl he rescues. Can Hemalurgy do the same thing if used carefully?

Brandon Sanderson

*long pause* No, I don't really think that it can. Nobody has asked that before, but just looking at the way the magics work, I don't think that is something that Hemalurgy is capable of doing.

Now, I think that you could use H-duralumin to take actual muscle memory and give it to yourself, but memories wouldn't be taken.

Yumi spoilers;

Spoiler

from this story we learn that highly Invested beings have their memories stored throughout their whole being, which seems to include their Spiritual Aspect. I think that if you were to spike beings that were really, really Invested you could take some memories along with whatever else you took, but most beings just aren't going to be that highly Invested.

Now, there should still be a way to steal memories via Hemalurgy, but it's a bit convoluted: 

1. Implant four or more Hemalurgic spikes into the person you want to steal memories from. Two of the spikes must provide F-copper and F-aluminum.

2. Use superpowered Emotional Allomancy (probably via A-duralumin) or lots of F-duralumin to hack into their Spiritweb and control them. This may require time to break them, and will likely be very traumatizing to the victim.

3. Force them to Blank their Identity and store the memories of your choice.

4. Retrieve the F-copper granting spike from the person and give it to yourself so you can tap their memories.

Probably not easy to pull off, but the mechanics should work. It also would be evil, so there's that too.

Edited October 22, 2023 by Trusk'our

[Alumínio]

30 minutes ago, Trusk'our said:

No Cosmere, a memória muscular, a habilidade e a linguagem parecem estar ligadas ao aspecto espiritual da pessoa, enquanto as memórias conscientes reais fazem parte do aspecto cognitivo. A Hemalurgia não trata do Aspecto Cognitivo ou do Aspecto Físico (isto é, tecnicamente; seu uso pode afetar essas partes dos Hemalurgistas, mas apenas de forma indireta, afetando o Aspecto Espiritual).

Spoilers do Warbreaker;

  Ocultar conteúdo

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/66/#e3165

cstat

Vasher usa Awakening de uma forma muito interessante, fora do palco, para modificar as memórias da garota que ele resgata. A Hemalurgia pode fazer a mesma coisa se usada com cuidado?

Brandon Sanderson

*longa pausa* Não, eu realmente não acho que possa. Ninguém perguntou isso antes, mas só de olhar como a magia funciona, não acho que isso seja algo que a Hemalurgia seja capaz de fazer.

Agora, eu acho que você poderia usar H-duralumínio para pegar a memória muscular real e dá-la a si mesmo, mas as memórias não seriam tiradas.

Spoilers de Yumi;

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com esta história aprendemos que os seres altamente investidos têm as suas memórias armazenadas ao longo de todo o seu ser, o que parece incluir o seu Aspecto Espiritual. Eu acho que se você cravasse seres que estavam realmente, realmente investidos, você poderia levar algumas memórias junto com qualquer outra coisa que você levasse, mas a maioria dos seres simplesmente não será tão altamente investida.

Agora, ainda deve haver uma maneira de roubar memórias via Hemalurgia, mas é um pouco complicado: 

1. Implante quatro ou mais pontas hemalúrgicas na pessoa de quem você deseja roubar memórias. Dois dos espigões devem fornecer cobre F e alumínio F.

2. Use alomancia emocional superpoderosa (provavelmente via A-duralumínio) ou muito F-duralumínio para invadir seu Spiritweb e controlá-los. Isso pode levar algum tempo para quebrá-los e provavelmente será muito traumatizante para a vítima.

3. Force-os a apagar sua identidade e armazenar as memórias de sua escolha.

4. Recupere o pico de concessão de cobre F da pessoa e dê-o a si mesmo para que possa acessar suas memórias.

Provavelmente não é fácil de fazer, mas a mecânica deve funcionar. Também seria mau, então tem isso também.

First of all, this macabre idea of yours of stalking a person to be able to control them, maybe this will even end up being a way of "interrogating" a future scadrial

Anyway, I understood what you meant and I was upset, I wanted to find different ways to use hemalurgy, not just to steal powers itself, but I have no idea how to hack this magical system

[Trusk'our]

45 minutes ago, Alumínio said:

First of all, this macabre idea of yours of stalking a person to be able to control them, maybe this will even end up being a way of "interrogating" a future scadrial

Yes, the Cold War of Era 3 will probably induce such brutal tactics.

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https://wob.coppermind.net/events/34/#e1782

Questioner

So, because we have Worldhoppers like Hoid, Khriss, and Nazh, and I think that I've heard that era 4 will be more science fiction.

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, era 4 is science fiction.

Questioner

So, will we ever have a chance to see characters from one world in the cosmere go to another world in the cosmere?

Brandon Sanderson

So, there's a couple of things that I need to explain to you guys in this one. First is that Mistborn, I pitched to my editor, way at the beginning, as a series where a fantasy world slowly became a science fiction world. So we would pass through a modern era, where things are like our world, and then we pass on to a science fiction era, because I'd never seen that done before. I'd never seen someone take epic fantasy and then build from the events in the epic fantasy, like religions and philosophies, and then tell another story set in a more modern and contemporary world. And then in the science fiction one, the magic will become the means by which space travel is possible. So we're in the middle of that. Wax and Wayne is an interim, I'm calling it era 2. There's an era 3 which is 1980s, cold war, spy thriller Mistborn. Then there is an era four, which is science fiction, unless I slip in a cyberpunk, near-future science fiction, which I might do. So there might be five, we'll see. I've warned people of that. The last Mistborn series, whichever era it ends up being, is the last thing of the cosmere chronologically. So, it's a long ways off. All the other series have to finish before I can do that.

The other thing that people have to understand is that all of these worlds are connected in something we call the cosmere. It is mostly, right now, just easter eggs. It's important to me that people don't go, "I can't read Mistborn until I've read Elantris," or whatever. No, each series is about that series. There's easter eggs connecting them, but you don't need to know it. It's just fun to find out; you can find it all out after the fact.

Are we going to see people traveling between the planets? Yes, you will see space travel between the planets. You have seen it already. One of the stories in the anthology comes from that era, but it's on a planet that doesn't yet have space travel. Sixth of the Dusk takes place chronologically near-end of the cosmere sequence. So yes, you have seen it, and you will see more of it. In Sixth of the Dusk, there are ones they call the Ones Above who have visited and these are people from a planet that you have seen, I won't tell you who, who are visiting.

On the bright side, this means we'll probably see some more uses of Hemalurgy!

45 minutes ago, Alumínio said:

Anyway, I understood what you meant and I was upset, I wanted to find different ways to use hemalurgy, not just to steal powers itself, but I have no idea how to hack this magical system

Sorry about that, it's something that happens a lot on the Shard (used to happen to me all the time. Still does, I suppose, I just have gotten used to it and have adapted to come up with better arguments to prove my points) about that. Hemlaurgy is a confusing system, but you'll get a better hang on cracking some of its secrets in time.

Keep it up friend, there are no failures, only potential lessons 

[.....]

 

Quote

 

Argent

Can you get a Hemalurgic spike for writing skill?

Brandon Sanderson

Hemalurgy is a lot more varied than what it's been used for so far.

Shadows of Self Chicago signing (Oct. 12, 2015)

 

so I assume that means you can steal skills(also my reaction to this was where dose brandon live I need an interview for "research purposes" (it involves spikes)I mean books.  )