maxal she/her Posted August 2, 2014 Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 I am growing increasingly interested into what happened 10 years ago. Let's summarized: 10 years ago, Vasher arrived in Roshar and put himself under the service of Dalinar Kohlin as an Ardent swordsmaster. His main deed so far on Roshar has been teaching Adolin to become such a good duelist. 10 years ago, Dalinar's wife died of unknown causes in unknown circumstances. And just this afternoon, I found out that 10 years ago, Dalinar was nearly crushed by jealousy and nearly killed Galivar for stealing Navani... Now, I was under the impression this event happened much before that, before Dalinar's weeding to shshshshsh, but turns out I was wrong. It seemed that, even through his supposed happy weeding to the women he supposedly loved, Dalinar still had many thoughts for Navani... Dalinar could remember the jealousy on that day some ten years ago, when the itch to attack Galivar - the only worthy opponent he could see, the man who had won Navani's hand - had nearly consumed him. Now we call all argue that 10 years ago is a lose term and it may mean 11 years or 9 years ago, but I find it strange so many key events are said to have occurred about 10 years ago. It can't all be coincidence. Something happened 10 years ago and I believe all of these events are linked, somehow. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Hoodie Mistborn he/him Posted August 2, 2014 Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 10 is a key number in Roshar: 10 Orders of Radiants, of Voidbinders, 10 Heralds, 10 Essences. It could be something happened, but I'm not so sure that it will be anything. I thought Zahel has been on Roshar for 12 years, not 10? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiver he/him Posted August 2, 2014 Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 Was Dalinar motivated just by the Navani issue though? It sounds more like some extension of the Thrill; urging to combat, and Gavilar being 'the only worthy opponent', with Navanni being an example of what makes him worthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxal she/her Posted August 2, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 Was Dalinar motivated just by the Navani issue though? It sounds more like some extension of the Thrill; urging to combat, and Gavilar being 'the only worthy opponent', with Navanni being an example of what makes him worthy. Doesn't the 10 years strike you as too coincidental...? The Thrill manifest itself while someone is in a combat situation. Unless Dalinar was overtly fighting Galivar at the time, I fail to see how it could have urged him to murder his brother... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Star Posted August 2, 2014 Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 Quite obviously, Vasher was Dalinar's wife, died protecting Renarin, and was returned on Nalthis. ... I should probably stop now... 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxal she/her Posted August 2, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 Quite obviously, Vasher was Dalinar's wife, died protecting Renarin, and was returned on Nalthis. ... I should probably stop now... LOL. Seriously, I have this crackpot theory Dalinar, instead of Galivar, accidentally murdered his wife and went to the Nightwatcher to erase the memory of his deed.... :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AerionBFII he/him Posted August 3, 2014 Report Share Posted August 3, 2014 (edited) It would be bad if the series lasted 10 years.... WOK 2010....WOR 2014....SKYBREAKER 2016....ESHONAI 2018....HPW 2020 Edited August 3, 2014 by WEZ313 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swimmingly he/him Posted August 3, 2014 Report Share Posted August 3, 2014 That...sounds like a realistic timeline, actually 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Star Posted August 3, 2014 Report Share Posted August 3, 2014 WOK 2010....WOR 2014....SKYBREAKER 2016....ESHONAI 2018....HPW 2020 The waiting... the insufferable waiting!!! It's been so long since I read an SA book that my page-flipping arm is getting flabby! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer he/him Posted August 3, 2014 Report Share Posted August 3, 2014 It would be bad if the series lasted 10 years.... WOK 2010....WOR 2014....SKYBREAKER 2016....ESHONAI 2018....HPW 2020 The Everwaiting comes. The true Desolation. The years of rereads. 16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kadolin Posted August 4, 2014 Report Share Posted August 4, 2014 The Everwaiting comes. The true Desolation. The years of rereads. LOL. Yea at least 10 years more to finally complete the series (planned 1.5-2 years for each book). We be much older and still speculating.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheese Ninja he/him Posted August 4, 2014 Report Share Posted August 4, 2014 Where are you gettting 10 years for Vasher from? Q: When you were planning Zahel being Vasher, how long did you do that?A: Vasher was in the 2002 version of WoK by name. I only changed him to the new name after I finished this entire draft. Because I was like, oh he'd probably go under a pseudonym. So he's been in Roshar 12 years our time. That quote is only talking about the time between when Brandon first wrote Vasher into Way of Kings Prime and when Words of Radiance came out. 12 years difference. It doesn't tell us anything about the time inside the series, Vasher could have been there for 5 years or 500. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxal she/her Posted August 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2014 Where are you gettting 10 years for Vasher from? That quote is only talking about the time between whttp://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/14220-10-years-ago/#entry165656hen Brandon first wrote Vasher into Way of Kings Prime and when Words of Radiance came out. 12 years difference. It doesn't tell us anything about the time inside the series, Vasher could have been there for 5 years or 500. I always understood he had been serving under Dalinar for 10 years. I dunno where I got that though, so it may be I got mislead. I just thought all these events occurring in roughly the same time frame may be linked, somehow, especially since I think there is something fishy with Dalinar's wife. Going to the Nightwatcher is a huge event and it is not a trip ones takes lightly. I somehow doubt it was just to erase his pain from losing his wife, I think there is more to it than we think (and no I don't buy the Renarin theory, I think he has nothing to do with it). I believe Dalinar did something horrific, so horrific he sought to have it erase. I also believe all those events may be the key to unravel the whole mystery, but I go also be completely wrong here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoser he/him Posted August 5, 2014 Report Share Posted August 5, 2014 (edited) FWIW, Dalinar seems evasive when he is describing his whereabouts during the events involving Moash's grandparents. Dalinar said, "Elhokar was crown prince then, commanded to rule over Kholinar and watch the kingdom while his father organized our first camps here in the Shattered Plains. I was ... away at the time." My guess is that that may coincide w/his trip to the Nightwatcher, as the Nightwatcher is what Dalinar has seemed most evasive about. I'll need to check on the information we have about the timing of his trip to the Nightwatcher to see if it fits. IIRC, Dalinar claims to know his curse and blessing. If the blessing was forgetting he murdered his wife, then he wouldn't know what it is. Of course, if the Nightwatcher gave him a different blessing, he might not realize his original intent. He would have to wonder why he went, which he doesn't seem to be doing. Edited August 5, 2014 by hoser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxal she/her Posted August 5, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2014 FWIW, Dalinar seems evasive when he is describing his whereabouts during the events involving Moash's grandparents. Dalinar said, "Elhokar was crown prince then, commanded to rule over Kholinar and watch the kingdom while his father organized our first camps here in the Shattered Plains. I was ... away at the time." My guess is that that may coincide w/his trip to the Nightwatcher, as the Nightwatcher is what Dalinar has seemed most evasive about. I'll need to check on the information we have about the timing of his trip to the Nightwatcher to see if it fits. IIRC, Dalinar claims to know his curse and blessing. If the blessing was forgetting he murdered his wife, then he wouldn't know what it is. Of course, if the Nightwatcher gave him a different blessing, he might not realize his original intent. He would have to wonder why he went, which he doesn't seem to be doing. Yeah I always figured he went to the Nightwatcher during the Moash episode... which happened 7 years ago (roughly) so about 3 years after her death... It does not make sense to wait 3 years to go seek the Old Magic to simply erase the pain of losing someone.... It seems like a long time to wait. And what about his sons? How can they both be so clueless about those events? Their father leaves for weeks for a strange trip and no one notices or asks about it? They didn't ask to come along? I am starting to think the blessing may have to do wit Galivar and the curse was forgetting his wife.... Perhaps he asked to be cured of this jealousy he had towards his brother and was cursed in forgetting about his wife... To gain love for a close person, you need to lose love from another? Or something along those lines... It came right when Galivar and Dalinar went to discover the Parshendi.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LloydSev Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 (edited) Here is my theory: Dalinar went to the Nightwatcher and received the following: Blessing: Erase the pain of losing his wife Curse: Lose someone he cares about (his brother) As it is said that the blessing and curse are related Edited December 17, 2014 by LloydSev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oudeis he/him Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 Where is it said that the blessing and curse are related? Remember one guy got a bunch of nice cloth, and his curse was to see the world upside down. Also, there's WoB that Curses are all neurological conditions. Having your brother stabbed through the chest with a two-by-four isn't a neurological condition. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze1616 he/him Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 I am growing increasingly interested into what happened 10 years ago. Let's summarized: 10 years ago, Vasher arrived in Roshar and put himself under the service of Dalinar Kohlin as an Ardent swordsmaster. His main deed so far on Roshar has been teaching Adolin to become such a good duelist. 10 years ago, Dalinar's wife died of unknown causes in unknown circumstances. And just this afternoon, I found out that 10 years ago, Dalinar was nearly crushed by jealousy and nearly killed Galivar for stealing Navani... Now, I was under the impression this event happened much before that, before Dalinar's weeding to shshshshsh, but turns out I was wrong. It seemed that, even through his supposed happy weeding to the women he supposedly loved, Dalinar still had many thoughts for Navani... Dalinar could remember the jealousy on that day some ten years ago, when the itch to attack Galivar - the only worthy opponent he could see, the man who had won Navani's hand - had nearly consumed him. Now we call all argue that 10 years ago is a lose term and it may mean 11 years or 9 years ago, but I find it strange so many key events are said to have occurred about 10 years ago. It can't all be coincidence. Something happened 10 years ago and I believe all of these events are linked, somehow. Vasher has been on Roshar 12 years, not 10. Though he may have been in Dalinar's employ only 10 years. Also, the quote you provide does not strike me as Dalinar saying that Gavilar's "theft" of Navani's love is why he had the itch to attack Gavilar. It feels more like a side note, an aside Dalinar makes to himself given current events, not past ones. Moreover, Dalinar has stated that after losing Navani he later found love, and that he did in fact love his wife, even though he can't remember her. Perhaps that statement is "proof" of when Dalinar visited the Nightwatcher? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvoraen Posted December 17, 2014 Report Share Posted December 17, 2014 (edited) Where is it said that the blessing and curse are related? Remember one guy got a bunch of nice cloth, and his curse was to see the world upside down. Also, there's WoB that Curses are all neurological conditions. Having your brother stabbed through the chest with a two-by-four isn't a neurological condition. Another thing about the 'blessing'/curse situation I've been wondering about: Who said the blessings are strictly magical in nature? I've been wondering if that story about receiving cloth is even accurate or a complete fabrication, simply because we don't know if the Nightwatcher is paid tributes (which is where said cloth could have come from previously). I don't think it was created on the spot, in other words, but again this assumes that who-knows-how-many-handed story is even truthful rather than made up. There's also the idea that the Curses may have a purpose later on too, since they linger just as much. Would be... problematic... if the Nightwatcher's blessings and curses let the Unmade do even nastier things to a person. Edited December 17, 2014 by dvoraen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LloydSev Posted December 18, 2014 Report Share Posted December 18, 2014 Where is it said that the blessing and curse are related? Remember one guy got a bunch of nice cloth, and his curse was to see the world upside down. Also, there's WoB that Curses are all neurological conditions. Having your brother stabbed through the chest with a two-by-four isn't a neurological condition. I missed that WoB, so that throws my theory out entirely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheese Ninja he/him Posted December 19, 2014 Report Share Posted December 19, 2014 Question: Nightwatcher's curses all appear to be neurological in effect, are the boons limited in any particular manner? Answer: Yes. I don't know if all curses are necessary neurological in nature, and even if they were, there's certainly a magical aspect to them. That guy (Cheese Ninja) asked a leading question, but the "Yes" was probably just to "are the boons limited in any particular manner?" Is there another WoB that I'm not aware of? Also, I'll reiterate that Brandon's "Vashar has been on Roshar for 12 years." comment is about how Vashar was in WoK Prime back in 2000/2001, and also in Words of Radiance in 2014. Basically, he's saying that it was not a late decision to include a tie-in character from Warbreaker, but that his existence was determined before Warbreaker had even been written. Vashar could have been on Roshar for anywhere from a few years to a few hundred years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Hoodie Mistborn he/him Posted December 19, 2014 Report Share Posted December 19, 2014 I don't know if all curses are necessary neurological in nature, and even if they were, there's certainly a magical aspect to them. That guy (Cheese Ninja) asked a leading question, but the "Yes" was probably just to "are the boons limited in any particular manner?" Is there another WoB that I'm not aware of? Also, I'll reiterate that Brandon's "Vashar has been on Roshar for 12 years." comment is about how Vashar was in WoK Prime back in 2000/2001, and also in Words of Radiance in 2014. Basically, he's saying that it was not a late decision to include a tie-in character from Warbreaker, but that his existence was determined before Warbreaker had even been written. Vashar could have been on Roshar for anywhere from a few years to a few hundred years. We do know the upper bound to Vasher's arrival on Roshar should be max of about 300 years given what is currently know about timeline and chronology. Lower bound has to be 10+ years since he trained Adonlin as a child/young adult and Adonlin is something like 23. he would have required time to situate himself on Roshar and be accepted to the Ardents before being placed high enough to train a high prince's children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dahak he/him Posted December 28, 2014 Report Share Posted December 28, 2014 And what about his sons? How can they both be so clueless about those events? Their father leaves for weeks for a strange trip and no one notices or asks about it? I assumed it was a quick side trip when he went on that state visit to Azir [The one on which he didn't get to explore the Purelake.]. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecatinthehat Posted December 28, 2014 Report Share Posted December 28, 2014 It would be bad if the series lasted 10 years.... WOK 2010....WOR 2014....SKYBREAKER 2016....ESHONAI 2018....HPW 2020 That...sounds like a realistic timeline, actuallyI find it too much optimistic, though. It could be, for example: The Way of Kings — 2010 Words of Radiance — 2014 Stones Unhallowed — 2017 volume 4, part I — 2020 (split for publication after failing to invent a new bookbinding method) volume 4, part II — 2022 volume 4, part III — 2024 Highprince of War, part I — 2027 Highprince of War, part II — 2029 Highprince of War, part III — 2032 ( ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AerionBFII he/him Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 I find it too much optimistic, though. It could be, for example: The Way of Kings — 2010 Words of Radiance — 2014 Stones Unhallowed — 2017 volume 4, part I — 2020 (split for publication after failing to invent a new bookbinding method) volume 4, part II — 2022 volume 4, part III — 2024 Highprince of War, part I — 2027 Highprince of War, part II — 2029 Highprince of War, part III — 2032 ( ) Not to mention the second part, eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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