Should we be suspicious of Renarin?

[FlashWrogan he/him]

Just because it says it, doesn't make it true. The blood sickness and the fits could be unrelated, I haven't done reread in weeks, is there any scenes where renarin has fits? Does it mention the timings of them?

 

There is no onscreen "fit" and I don't recall him ever mentioning the timing. However there is the instance of Dalinar and Renarin riding into a barracks just in time for a highstorm. Dalinar wakes up to find a concerned Renarin and soldier's holding him down. I don't remember for sure, but there may be other instances of Renarin being present when Dalinar wakes up. I think if Renarin had fits during highstorms as well, he wouldn't be able to keep it a secret. That would certainly come up in discussions about Dalinar's visions.

[SirShemmington VI]

There is no onscreen "fit" and I don't recall him ever mentioning the timing. However there is the instance of Dalinar and Renarin riding into a barracks just in time for a highstorm. Dalinar wakes up to find a concerned Renarin and soldier's holding him down. I don't remember for sure, but there may be other instances of Renarin being present when Dalinar wakes up. I think if Renarin had fits during highstorms as well, he wouldn't be able to keep it a secret. That would certainly come up in discussions about Dalinar's visions.

You raise a good point.

[BlairJ he/him]

I guess my real question is, will he ever get a shardplate?  I know it is implied that he will get one and you almost have to feel that he will based on Dalinar's claim to get him one, but I have my suspicions.  I think that THIS, could be a major factor to consider when discussing our "suspicions" of Renarin.   Here are a couple of thoughts I have about all of this.  Significant spoilers do follow. If you do not have Way of Kings considered, I strongly suggest staying in the chasm.

 

• First of all, Dalinar could become very preocupied in Words of Radiance.  He is trying to save his country, court one beautiful ex sister-in-law, become good at politics, and lest we forget, will probably have a struggle to stay alive as one intense oathstoner is coming to get him (though I have a theory that this will actually be Kaladin's fight to begin with).  Anyways, with all of that being said, I don't know that Dalinar will actually be going to war again, at least not in the traditional sense.  Even if one of his men does happen to kill someone with Shardplate, it is unlikely that he will claim that for himself (to give to Renarin).  His is a far cry more honorable than Amaram, and I think the only one that has the power to get a shardplate-though tough without his own shardblade-besides Kaladin(personal opinion obviously).  The way I could potentially seeing that playing out, Kaladin actually gets a shardplate/blade, but finally takes one for himself. 
• Second, Renarin is, as mentioned before, a guy that could go either way.  He has a lot of good in him.  He loves his family, especially his father and brother, but with love and admiration, often jealousy finds itself into the equation.  I think there was mention of a little envy in WoK already, but I could be mistaken on that.   With that being said, I see this going one of two ways and this comes to why I am saying that the shardplate has a great impact on how Renarin could turn out.  So, without further ado, here are the scenarios that I propose could happen:

1. He gets a Shardplate, becomes the hero.  Dalinar or Kaladin are able to get a Shardplate, and he has a huge impact on the series, going from essentially useless, to a major role in the book.
2. He gets a Sharplate and goes Theon Greyjoy (if you do not get the reference, see A Song of Ice and Fire).  Maybe he is able to get a shardplate without the assistance of his father.  If I were him, I would be a little angry.  His father gave away his own blade and basically gave up fighting in wars himself. This will lead to him coveting power, obtaining a plate/blade and well......you know the rest.
3. He never gets a plate but becomes a powerful politcal leader.  I have my suspicions about Adolin (the nerve of this BlairJ guy!) and maybe Adolin does something terrible (who could put it past the quick-to-action young man in lust) and Renarin in fact takes over in his father's stead while Dalinar is working on saving the world.  This gives him the power he needs, but there will always be the storyline about the shardplate.  I am not sure what this will result in.
4. He never gets a shard plate and this causes great animosity.  I think this is probably one of the most likely scenarios.  

 

I think Renarin plays a huge part, for good or bad, but he will have to wait his turn while we focus on the immenent Szeth/Dalinar war.  Many have thoughts that Kaladin and Shallan will be one of the romances that we see in this book.  I think that we will see a surprise relationship triangle between Renarin, Shallan, and Kaladin that will add much more to their story lines and connect these characters in a deep way that will cause the Kholin tribe to have a falling out with their honor guard and more contention between Shallan and Jasnah.

 

These are all just guesses and thoughts and course, will all be completely wrong.  

 

/end bold statements

[Meg]

He gets a Sharplate and goes Theon Greyjoy (if you do not get the reference, see A Song of Ice and Fire).  Maybe he is able to get a shardplate without the assistance of his father.  If I were him, I would be a little angry.  His father gave away his own blade and basically gave up fighting in wars himself. This will lead to him coveting power, obtaining a plate/blade and well......you know the rest.

Interesting thoughts, indeed. Renarin's future is more than open I think.

But I don't think he "goes Theon Greyjoy". There are very different preconditions. Theon had been a protected person by Eddard Stark and his family. IIRC he was treated well but never really felt at home there. Again IIRC he never did support Robb or his siblings as Renarin does with Adolin. There was envy and jealousy from the beginning he had to stay with the Starks. Therefore I don't see any reason to draw a parallel between Theon and Renarin.

This, too, because I don't want Renarin to experience what Theon had to later on. I think, too, that's not the way BS will proceed. Though we see violence (Szeth, the fights on the Shattered Plains) there is not such a sadistic, really bad and more then absurd violence in TWoK as it is shown (much too much) in ASoFaI.

And I don't think (always believing in the good in men) that Renarin never would betray somebody, especially his family, that way as Theon did.

 

 

edit: typo (I realized when I saw BlairJ's quote) 

Edited March 17, 2013 by Meg

[BlairJ he/him]

And I don't think (always believing in the good in men) that Renarin never would betray somebody, especially his family, that way as Theon did.

 

I completely agree with this.  My personal hope is that Renarin will actually get a sharplate and become a good guy! 

[FlashWrogan he/him]

I guess my real question is, will he ever get a shardplate?  I know it is implied that he will get one and you almost have to feel that he will based on Dalinar's claim to get him one, but I have my suspicions.

 

I think you are forgetting something.

 

Dalinar:

"Tomorrow, once you name me Highprince of War, I will give my Plate to Renarin to fulfill a promise. I’ve already given away my Blade to fulfill a different one."

[BlairJ he/him]

Thank you for recalling that flash! I had completely forgotten.

[hoser he/him]

There is no onscreen "fit" ...

I think he does have one or two onscreen "fits".  The one I particularly remember is when Navani is doing the huge prayer glyph.  There is another apparent "fit" described in chapter 52 after the Recreance vision.  They seem to involve trembling legs, sitting down and holding his head. 

Edited March 18, 2013 by hoser

[FlashWrogan he/him]

I think he does have one or two onscreen "fits".  The one I particularly remember is when Navani is doing the huge prayer glyph.  There is another apparent "fit" described in chapter 52 after the Recreance vision.  They seem to involve trembling legs, sitting down and holding his head. 

Ah, my mistake. They were minor enough that I didn't remember

[BlairJ he/him]

I remember the "fit" during the vision, but I am trying to remember the one that happens during the giant prayer glyph.  I will have to look that up.  

[Yados]

I've mentioned this in the past, but I'm definitely suspicious of Renarin. However, because we've seen so little of him, those reasons are mostly thematic. Compared to characters like Kaladin and Dalinar, Renarin seems to go against theme (much like Shallan). 

 

For one, in a book where the two main, heroic characters give up Shards, it's worth noting that the only three who gain Shards by the end are Amaram, Sadeas, and Renarin. This is not good company for Renarin to maintain, narratively. 

 

Many of the themes in Stormlight also revolve around taking up responsibility and sacrificing for others to be worthy of power. There's a whole magic system where people have to make vows to protect in order to use power. Conversely, Renarin is just handed his power from his father with the expectation that it will fix his problems. That's no good.  

 

We've also had the lingering notion through Syl that Shards are "bad."  If there was going to be a focus that depicted the change that Shards might have on an individual, Renarin would be a good candidate. Maybe having just the plate makes someone lust for the blade? Maybe that's something that changed Sadeas? How would we know? We've never got too close a look at someone with just one before or even someone who has only recently obtained Shards. Maybe it changes a person. We don't know at this point.

 

BS has written many characters who, having little to no power, come into great power. It's almost always been a positive change for them. However, he even stated in the footnotes for Hero of Ages that, were Mistborn longer, he would have toyed with making Spook a villain. Stormlight is plenty long. Maybe Renarin is the opposite character. The person who gains power after having none for so long and, instead of becoming the responsible leader, finds he has a taste for it. 

 

We don't know enough right now, but the set up is all there.

[Tarontos he/him]

I've mentioned this in the past, but I'm definitely suspicious of Renarin. However, because we've seen so little of him, those reasons are mostly thematic. Compared to characters like Kaladin and Dalinar, Renarin seems to go against theme (much like Shallan). 

 

For one, in a book where the two main, heroic characters give up Shards, it's worth noting that the only three who gain Shards by the end are Amaram, Sadeas, and Renarin. This is not good company for Renarin to maintain, narratively. 

 

Many of the themes in Stormlight also revolve around taking up responsibility and sacrificing for others to be worthy of power. There's a whole magic system where people have to make vows to protect in order to use power. Conversely, Renarin is just handed his power from his father with the expectation that it will fix his problems. That's no good.  

 

We've also had the lingering notion through Syl that Shards are "bad."  If there was going to be a focus that depicted the change that Shards might have on an individual, Renarin would be a good candidate. Maybe having just the plate makes someone lust for the blade? Maybe that's something that changed Sadeas? How would we know? We've never got too close a look at someone with just one before or even someone who has only recently obtained Shards. Maybe it changes a person. We don't know at this point.

 

BS has written many characters who, having little to no power, come into great power. It's almost always been a positive change for them. However, he even stated in the footnotes for Hero of Ages that, were Mistborn longer, he would have toyed with making Spook a villain. Stormlight is plenty long. Maybe Renarin is the opposite character. The person who gains power after having none for so long and, instead of becoming the responsible leader, finds he has a taste for it. 

 

We don't know enough right now, but the set up is all there.

It was only the shard blades nothing is ever said about shard plate being "Bad"

[BlairJ he/him]

True and I am not 100% convinced that shard blades are actually bad. I have a theory that Syl has a bad experience from her past that maybe even she doesn't remember yet...

[FaeMofo]

There's also the theory that Odium somehow corrupted shardblades and plates, which may lead to Renarin becoming villainous even though his intentions may be good.

EDIT: Ignore everything I just posted I just looked above and saw the matter has been breached

Edited March 21, 2013 by Unnamed Narrator

[Bigtones he/him]

Renarin has always been the "poor guy" kinda character that will show his worth in later books.

 

His interest in fabrials and gemstones has always had me thinking that he will make an amazing discovery regarding Shardplate and Shardblades...maybe even "create" them for which side I do not know, but we'll have to continue reading to find that I suppose.

[Observer]

If he figures out how to MAKE shards? Unlikely as that is, that could be catastophic...

[Azul he/him]

In regards to Renarin's 'blood weakness'

 

The article on Tor about how sprens have affected the advance of medicine on Roshar.  It suggest that while people dont really understand things like germs and what causes a lot of sickness they can see how the spren react (you can see that washing your hands chases away rot spren).   Add this to old ideas you would see in our world about leeching and blood letting and his 'blood weakness' could be anything they don't really understand. 

 

I also noticed that his fits sound a bit similar (viewed from the outside) as those Dalinar has sometimes when the Thrill is on him.

 

He felt a sudden stab of powerful revulsion, a sickness so strong that it made him gasp. He slipped, partially on a patch of blood, but partially because his knees grew suddenly weak.

 

If whatever is effecting Dalinar to make him feel sick sometimes while in the Thrill has always effected Renarin then him training to be a warrior would be near impossible and could lead to them labeling it some 'blood weakness'.

 

Though why he would have a fit after the vision..  ;p

[Cabbage]

I'm going to agree with others. Renarin will most likely end up being compensated for his weak body with a talent elsewhere. Though it would be very awful turn of the story. Either way. Since Adolin and his father have their own POV chapters it's very likely that Renarin will end up with some of his own.

 

On a last note. I'd be very annoyed if Renarin ends up stabbing Adolin in the back of pure jeolosy. No, I think Sanderson will have to work quite hard on Renarin to please me.