Aeshdan Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 Alright, here's my idea. Points as follows: 1. The Shardblades and Plate were originally the symbols of a Radiant's oath. 2. The glow that we see in Pre-Recreance Shards is a visible sign of Honor's favor, possibly indicating that he fuels the Plate/Radiant as much Light as needed without having to use gems. 3. At the Recreance, the Radiants broke their oaths. 4. This is why the Plate and Blades stopped glowing and now need gems. (Honor is no longer fueling them). 5. This is also why Syl hates the Sharblades (they are now symbols of broken oaths, exactly opposite her nature.) 6. If Kaladin ever gets ahold of Plate and Blade, they will presumably start glowing again (though maybe only once he's taken all five oaths) 7. What do you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj26792 Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 We have no evidence that they ever didnt need gems, thats a theory, that Im not sure I agree with, also the shard blades still don't need gems, just the plate. The rest of it sort of fits I suppose although whats your explanation for Syl not hating Plate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcanist Lupus Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 We have no evidence that they ever didnt need gems, thats a theory, that Im not sure I agree with, also the shard blades still don't need gems, just the plate. The rest of it sort of fits I suppose although whats your explanation for Syl not hating Plate? Do we have any evidence that Syl doesn't hate Plate, or do we just lack evidence that Syl does hate Plate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj26792 Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 When shes telling Kaladin that Dalinar is better for having gotten rid of his blade, she specifically says 'thing' singular, she doesnt mention the plate, if she didnt like the plate she wouldnt have said singular thing and would also have mentioned the plate afterwards when Kaladin asked what thing she meant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcanist Lupus Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 When shes telling Kaladin that Dalinar is better for having gotten rid of his blade, she specifically says 'thing' singular, she doesnt mention the plate, if she didnt like the plate she wouldnt have said singular thing and would also have mentioned the plate afterwards when Kaladin asked what thing she meant. Good point. But at that point, Dalinar was only giving away his Blade (although he said he planned on giving it away), so that may have skewed the conversation a little bit. I see it either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyRioter Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 did he mention he was going to give away the Plate when Kaladin was around, I don't think he did? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wispsy Posted December 12, 2011 Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 I believe they just elf stormlight really well, stocked up on a load which is why their eyes are faintly/almost glowing it leaks but only at a barely noticeable level, perhaps they power the shardplates not the other way round Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeshdan Posted December 12, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 12, 2011 Point of clarification: My theory will still hold if the glow isn't stormlight. I merely stated that the glow was a mark of Honor. It seemed likely that the Knights hadn't needed gems for fuel, based on what i read elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiveAM Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 I'm of the opinion that it seems irresponsible to jump to the conclusion that Plates previously didn't need gems. There just isn't evidence of that. In Dalinar's visions, the differences in the Plates of the Radiants and the Plates now that he mentions are: (1) the glow, (2) the glyphs (the description says "etched" into the plate, not part of the glow) (3) the summoning/un-summoning nature of the helms. He does NOT mention anything else different, if the Radiants' Plates didn't require gems, then wouldn't have mentioned something? He sees the Radiants' armor when it is worn AND when they being taken off too. He also looks at the Plates closely enough in both the first vision and the Recreance vision to comment on the glyphs, etc. To me, there is NO evidence supporting the lack of gems used in the Radiants armor, and everything else points to the gems being there, except for it being explicitly mentioned, but why would he mention that? "The Radiants' Plates are different, they glow, there are glyphs, but they have gems..." This kind of thought doesn't make sense at all. Also, I agree in the thought that Syl is only aversive to the Blades, not the Plates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj26792 Posted December 13, 2011 Report Share Posted December 13, 2011 The other major problem with Radiants plate not needing gems is how they would have worked out how to modify it. If the gems are there its a fancy fabrial, if they aren't the people who have the armour would have no understanding of how it worked and as such no idea how to modify it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeshdan Posted December 14, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 As I said above, my theory still holds if the Plate needs gems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiveAM Posted December 14, 2011 Report Share Posted December 14, 2011 I don't think so but Syl doesn't comment on Sadeas does she? For most of the book he only has the Plate so that could have made a more clear distinction. Maybe in book 2 with Renarin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b4dave Posted December 15, 2011 Report Share Posted December 15, 2011 The Stoneward woman had gems in her Plate. I don't think that having gems in the plate makes them fancy farials though. Gems are used to hold Stormlight, it seems to me like they would have gems associated with their order on them to store Stormlight, much like Vin carried around vials of metal in Mistborn. I could be decorative storage for when they need a bit of power. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj26792 Posted December 15, 2011 Report Share Posted December 15, 2011 Its not neccesarily a fancy fabrial, but that it is what the people of Roshar seem to think it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wispsy Posted December 15, 2011 Report Share Posted December 15, 2011 Errr they probably are just fancy fabrials I mean they hav fabrials that can block a shardblade! Only other thing in the known world that can do that is shardplate xD it's just a fabrial made by god right! Gods have head starts when it comes to knowledge of what's can be done with their powers... Compared to normal people xD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fiveAM Posted December 15, 2011 Report Share Posted December 15, 2011 Errr they probably are just fancy fabrials I mean they hav fabrials that can block a shardblade! Only other thing in the known world that can do that is shardplate xD it's just a fabrial made by god right! Gods have head starts when it comes to knowledge of what's can be done with their powers... Compared to normal people xD Maybe fabrials are based on Plates and the topaz and heliodor in Dalinar's vision is just really the gems and doesn't do anything but hold stormlight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wispsy Posted December 15, 2011 Report Share Posted December 15, 2011 Ah sorry I wa talking about the shardplates, shoulda clarified, altho the topaz/heliodor were put together with intricate metalwork which could just be used to hold it togeter but if it was purely for stormlight she could just used gems in the normal way, you know, just a gem, personally I suspect they were entwined around each other in a specific way for a specific reason (healing people) but don't really have any evidence. One note about shardplate always/not having gems inside, they can be regrown with stormlight from a single tiny piece, one could assume that if they didn't originally need gems they would not have the firttings for them when regrown. We don't see it happening but when people are thinking about Regrowing it it is never mentioned they will need to also find a skilled craftsman to put some gem slots in right, that would seriously add to the hassle and limitations and would probably be mentioned with it, instead of just ye I got a piece of plate I can just feed it stormlight and it can be used again! Surely people that do work on shardplate would be few and far between xD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeshdan Posted March 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2012 Here's the theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeshdan Posted May 6, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 Since everybody's ignoring this: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voidus Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 (edited) One note about shardplate always/not having gems inside, they can be regrown with stormlight from a single tiny piece, one could assume that if they didn't originally need gems they would not have the firttings for them when regrown. We don't see it happening but when people are thinking about Regrowing it it is never mentioned they will need to also find a skilled craftsman to put some gem slots in right, that would seriously add to the hassle and limitations and would probably be mentioned with it, instead of just ye I got a piece of plate I can just feed it stormlight and it can be used again! Surely people that do work on shardplate would be few and far between xD Actually I think that the fact that even a tiny shard can be fed stormlight is pretty substantial evidence that the Plate did not have dedicated slots like other Fabrials, they can be fed Stormlight simply from nearby sources, perhaps the Glyphs on the Plate was a sign from honor providing a constant feed of Stormlight to the Plate and the gems on the inside were for the Radiants since Plate seems to block infusion of Stormlight, probably also explains why Szeth doesn't wear Plate, he's not as adept at utilizing Stormlight and needs more so he can't be blocked from it by Plate, that as well as the it blocking his movement thing. I would definitely support this theory with these minor adaptions. Edited May 6, 2012 by Voidus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoser Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 One problem we are struggling with seems to be that the blades are obvious signs of Honor's favor and used by the blessed Radiants. Why does Syl disapprove of Dalinar's blade? I do not believe that the blades or plate have been altered, as the technology is beyond any but possibly the Radiants. I don't think Odium would have changed the blades without it being obvious. Similarly to the opening post, I believe that the Syl's disapproval comes from the blades being used for slaughter without the ethical restraints of a five-oath radiant. As the characters advance as Radiants, I believe they will use the blades without Syl having a problem. As to why the items stopped glowing at the Recreance, it could also have been that the Nahel bonds were dissolved at the same time the oaths were abandoned. I think the abandonment by the Radiants is an adequate reason for the glowing to stop. Even if the Radiants had kept their oaths, the armor and blades might have stopped glowing when abandoned. $.02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeshdan Posted May 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2012 I think the abandonment by the Radiants is an adequate reason for the glowing to stop. Even if the Radiants had kept their oaths, the armor and blades might have stopped glowing when abandoned. $.02 I would sort of agree with you. I think that laying down the Blades and Plate was itself a breaking of the Oaths, in that it renounced the powers and duties the Shards originally represented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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