Lifts'Awesomeness she/her Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 So Szeth....I must say I both greatly LOVE and DISLIKE him....he is just so...he is a pushover. No gumpshun. That being said I cannot wait to see his character developement as he (hopefully) develops some personality. He is a complex character i know, the Great Sanderson would give us nothing less. Though I am not sure how much I will enjoy him being the focus of Skybreaker. I have a hard time letting go of having Shallan and Kaladin being the main focus, they have been just so much fun to get to know. I know that they will, ofcourse, still pop up in the next book from time to time. I am just not certain if I will enjoy it as much being mainly focused on Szeth. This being said I greatly trust the Great Sanderson, but I would love to hear input on how others think book three will progress conserning Szeth. 3
Quiver he/him Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 Hm... maybe one of the mods should see about moving this to the Words of Radiance forum; spoilers and all that. Though... eh. I don't have much of an opinion on Szeth; I thought he seemed fairly interesting in Way of Kings, but in Words of Radiance... less so. We didn't see as much of him, and that might have been a factor in it... but... In WoK, he seemed reasonably in control of himself; enough to resent what he was doing. In WoR he seemed... significantly more insane than I was expecting. I'm curious to see his chapters, particularly seeing how he deals with being inducted into the Skybreakers, the issue with hsi Oathstone, the Stone Shamans etcetera... but he's not my favourite character, nor the more interesting to me. That said, WoR's ending basically broke him, so it might be interesting to see him be built back up.
Eerongal he/him Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 Hm... maybe one of the mods should see about moving this to the Words of Radiance forum; spoilers and all that. Yep, moved to the WoR forum.
Chrono she/her Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 You know, Szeth is kind of a mixed bag for me. At first I thought his character was cool. Then in Words of Radiance, I was kind of... I dunno, I guess I just figured he was lame because of all of his whining about his past. Then at the climax of Words of Radiance, I felt very sorry for him since he was very obviously insane and angry about what had happened. Overall, I'm excited at the new chance he gets in Skybreaker. Unlike others here, I wasn't really bothered with how Brandon brought him back (though I agree with others that the character revival count was just too dang high in this book). I'm just waiting to see if he's still just as insane as before or if he actually has a grip on reality, so to speak. 2
Lifts'Awesomeness she/her Posted July 10, 2014 Author Posted July 10, 2014 Agreed. I wasn't all that shocked at him coming back, in the very begining of The Way of Kings, the radiants kept mentioning about the mulitple times they had died only to come back fight and die again. That eternal hell being the reason they abandoned the world. It would be cool if Szeth could be redeemed, but considering things I doubt it. Shoud be interesting, though most of the book being about him "rediscovering his purpose" sounds a little annoying.
Dellexe he/him Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 What I'm most interested about Szeth and Stones Unhallowed is how him having Nightblood is going to affect his level of craziness. Maybe Nightblood has learned some things and can help him a bit, but I'm slightly horrified (in a good way) of Szeth listening to "Can I destroy that? Is that evil? Can you just let me destroy them?" all day. 2
Edgedancer he/him Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 To quote myself: Szeth was aware that what he did was wrong. He is a bit like the villagers from Wit´s story in WoK, with just one difference. He never belived that there was some kind of "king" that had all the blame. Yes, he blames both his master and his victims but he knows that he isn´t absolved from his crimes. What excuse does Szeth have? He dosen´t think he is doing the right thing. He dosen´t think that it isn´t his responsibility. He dosen´t think it is a necessary evil, as for example Mr. T. views his own actions. He dosen´t think that it is okay to kill his victims in any way. He dosen´t even take some kind of pleasure in it. What is left? The Stoneshamans told him to do it. That is all. He is dedicated to his doctrin beyond insanity, but that dosen´t make it the right thing. There is some kind of twisted strenght here and I´m not certain if coward is the right word for him, nonetheless what he did was wrong and can not be justified. Given that he did it for his own religion and can not stand the possibility of all he did being wrong, see him fleeing from Kaladin, one could call his actions selfish in the same twisted way one could call them strong. All in all I think this makes Szeth a villain, that manages to be both tragic and repulsive at the same time. The fact that this whole time he was right and with that his "punishment" entierly pointless just makes this all around worse. Think about it, if he had some confidence in himself he could have been one of the greates heroes in this story, instead he became a monster. So, overal I´m not fond of him as a person, he is however an interesting character. Plus, he now got Nightblood, which means his sections in the third book must be awesome. 6
Lifts'Awesomeness she/her Posted July 10, 2014 Author Posted July 10, 2014 yes I agree, very nice responce. He is going to certainly be a fearsome thing to behold.
Guest Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 I upvoted Edgedancer's post. It pretty much summarized what I think of Szeth. Overall, I am not excited to have him as the main focus of book 3. I liked well enough as a villain, but I found reading his POV tedious. I have no sympathy for him either as I believe his obstinacy to hold on to an order given to him by his superiors supremely annoying. Blind obedience is not something I respect nor value. Had he had any spine or any personality, he would have screwed his oath stone and go be his own man. Albeit, it may still happen, but considering the evil he has done, if he gets to be a real Skybreaker, I will utterly disappointed.
Aleksiel Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 if he gets to be a real Skybreaker, I will utterly disappointed. But... He was accepted into this Order by the original Skybreaker! How much more real can one get? You think it's better for a spren to recognize the person, but what they tried to achieve is copy Nalan.
hoser he/him Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 I have three issues with Szeth, but I guess that Brandon needed him to do things for the plotting. Whatever he was punished for. If he had the strength of his convictions, then don't accept the punishment. If he is not convinced, then don't tell the Shamanate they're wrong. Letting himself get talked into continuing his murder spree by Taravangian without checking the facts. In the climactic battle, there is a pitched battle with Voidbringers. He could not have missed that. Either he was with the Alethi already and he would have heard about it or he flew in and would have seen the Voidbringers. Either way, he knows that the Voidbringers were back and the Shamanate were wrong in their sentence. The final attack on Dalinar makes no sense. That said, he seems interesting and with his rebirth his actions should make more sense. I'm sure Brandon will create a fascinating story. 2
Guest Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 But... He was accepted into this Order by the original Skybreaker! How much more real can one get? You think it's better for a spren to recognize the person, but what they tried to achieve is copy Nalan. Does he have to be chosen by a spren? The Orders existed before they were linked to the Heralds so I doubt the Herald have a say as to who can joined them. The Highspren are the ones judging who is worthy and I have a hard time thinking one of them would chose Szeth. Then last thing you want for a Skybreaker, is an utter fool who obey false laws and lashes out killing innocents. What Nale calls "Skybreakers" are not real Skybreakers. I'd like to believe the real ones would not go fishing for some long past unpunished crime, without any process, just so to have a justification to kill people who have obviously repented. Based on this, I would say that no, Szeth is not a Skybreaker. Maybe he will be, I hope he will not, but this is up to Brandon.
Aleksiel Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 Does he have to be chosen by a spren? The Orders existed before they were linked to the Heralds so I doubt the Herald have a say as to who can joined them. The Highspren are the ones judging who is worthy and I have a hard time thinking one of them would chose Szeth. Then last thing you want for a Skybreaker, is an utter fool who obey false laws and lashes out killing innocents. What Nale calls "Skybreakers" are not real Skybreakers. I'd like to believe the real ones would not go fishing for some long past unpunished crime, without any process, just so to have a justification to kill people who have obviously repented. Based on this, I would say that no, Szeth is not a Skybreaker. Maybe he will be, I hope he will not, but this is up to Brandon. The pre-Recreance Skybreakers wanted to be recognized by Nalan according to in-world WoR, though it's not the most credible source, but is all we have unfortunately. The highspren wanted to copy Nale's Blade, so to me he's the one who gets more saying in who's a Skybreaker since he is the role model. Though the Heralds have no Oaths, but the Oathpact, so may be you're right. However, I think of Nalan and his minions as the modern days Skybreakers. I have three issues with Szeth, but I guess that Brandon needed him to do things for the plotting. Whatever he was punished for. If he had the strength of his convictions, then don't accept the punishment. If he is not convinced, then don't tell the Shamanate they're wrong. Letting himself get talked into continuing his murder spree by Taravangian without checking the facts. In the climactic battle, there is a pitched battle with Voidbringers. He could not have missed that. Either he was with the Alethi already and he would have heard about it or he flew in and would have seen the Voidbringers. Either way, he knows that the Voidbringers were back and the Shamanate were wrong in their sentence. The final attack on Dalinar makes no sense. That said, he seems interesting and with his rebirth his actions should make more sense. I'm sure Brandon will create a fascinating story. Yeah, I never quite got the first one. If you're sure, you're sure no matter what others say. If you aren't, why don't you keep your mouth shut? Hope this will be answered soon in the next book. About the other two I think Szeth was just too crazy after years of being Truthless. Suddenly learning you've lived in a lie and no longer having an excuse for all you've done can't be easy, he was in some sort of denial. Though that excuses him for believing Vargo (T did a good job hiding he was bothered I guess). Szeth had completely lost it when he attacked Dalinar. He went back for him after Kaladin was chasing him through the storm, clearly surgebinding. He needed Kal to tell him he was a Radiant as if Szeth couldn't see for himself - Szeth simply didn't want to. Too may years had passed. I think it would have been different if Gavilar had surgebinded, then Szeth wouldn't have insisted on continuing his madness, because he wasn't that crazy back then.
Shaggai Posted July 10, 2014 Posted July 10, 2014 I have three issues with Szeth, but I guess that Brandon needed him to do things for the plotting. Whatever he was punished for. If he had the strength of his convictions, then don't accept the punishment. If he is not convinced, then don't tell the Shamanate they're wrong. Letting himself get talked into continuing his murder spree by Taravangian without checking the facts. In the climactic battle, there is a pitched battle with Voidbringers. He could not have missed that. Either he was with the Alethi already and he would have heard about it or he flew in and would have seen the Voidbringers. Either way, he knows that the Voidbringers were back and the Shamanate were wrong in their sentence. The final attack on Dalinar makes no sense. That said, he seems interesting and with his rebirth his actions should make more sense. I'm sure Brandon will create a fascinating story. 1. His honor and his religion compelled him to follow the wishes of the Shamanate. I suspect that he didn't have any real proof that the Voidbringers were coming, but had visions or some such. He would, of course, have wished to warn the Shamanate, at which point they would have declared him Truthless. 2 and 3. He was basically insane at that point. Everything he thought was true was crumbling around him, and he was desperately clinging to anything that told him that he had had to kill all of those people. 1
Fatebreaker he/him Posted July 14, 2014 Posted July 14, 2014 (edited) I love Szeth. There are many reasons, but the main one is simple: He is a BADASS. Plain and simple. The prolouge for WoK, badass. Death Wears White, Badass. The fact that he's partnering with Nightblood, the funniest weapon of unmatched destruction in the cosmere(and another personal favorite character of mine), BADASS! Also I agree with what Nalan said at the end of WoR. Szeth is not weak, he is unbelievably strong. It's a very twisted strength but strength none the less. I also feel sorry for him. Not only did being chained to the oathstone and such suck, but then learning that it was all for not and that his religion was wrong, I mean, dang. So to summarize, Szeth is an awesome, complex, and a BADASS. I can't wait for Stones Unhallowed. (Pardon my language, but it's hard to find an appropriate synonym for badass) Edited July 22, 2014 by Fatebreaker 3
Left he/him Posted July 14, 2014 Posted July 14, 2014 I'm really excited to learn more about the Shin in general so I'm pretty cool with Szeth getting the flashbacks. We've seen what he's become, what I really want to learn more about why he became that way. I just see it being incredibly interesting. Probably more so than Kaladin's.
TousenShadowForged he/him Posted July 18, 2014 Posted July 18, 2014 His return was good i feel like he will make a big impact on the story
Mckeedee123 he/him Posted October 31, 2014 Posted October 31, 2014 I'm really not sure if what Nalan told Szeth at the end of WoR mellowed him out (gave him a real purpose) or further unhinged him. Nightblood could also be a good or bad influence. After all, the chronology between Cosmere books is muddled, and Brandon has hinted in the Warbreaker annotations that Nightblood understands more than Vasher thinks. We could be looking at a Nalan-influenced Nightblood crazed for the opportunity to help Szeth get revenge, or one that's surprisingly lucid and manages to coax Szeth back to sanity As for Szeth's inner conflicts, I'm convinced that Szeth just needs to be his own man (or Shin, as it were), and stop being a tool up for grabs for every evil guy in Roshar. He's a good guy, he just has a sense of duty that's totally out of place. A truly redeemed Szeth would be great to see.
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