Tamriel Wolfsbaine Posted May 31, 2022 Posted May 31, 2022 I was thinking about lightweaving the other day and if a character with the surge of illusion was blind. Shallan weaves light based on her drawings and her image in her head. I have an old friend who is blind and I remember him building a "gun" out of legos. Obviously he knew what he wanted it to be and we all went along with it but there was nothing about that jumbled mess of lego blocks that looked to be an actual gun. I was thinking initially that lightweaving would be horrible on a blind person because they wouldn't necessarily have any basis for what they wanted to make. However it got me to thinking about what they could do (which frankly anyone with illusion magic could probably do). If you could only picture darkness in your mind and then you were to project that into the world around you could you cause others to need to experience blindness? I wont lie a part of me thinks about Daredevil knowing how to fight in the dark and then projecting a cloud of blackness around him forcing all of his enemies to suddenly be surrounded by a thick darkness or even if you just coated the world around you with blindingly bright light... Would this consume more stormlight at a faster rate than other lightweaving? Is it the amount of space your illusion is taking up that determines how fast stormlight is used up or is it complexity of an illusion? Would plastering the world around a person in bright light or pitch black be considered more or less complex of a challenge than putting on a disguise or sending out your spren to imitate you? Also would you be able to hide your own stormlight glow in a room that you just layered jet black paint over everything in?
Frustration Posted May 31, 2022 Posted May 31, 2022 I would imagine that instead of using light based Illumination, blind individuals are more likely to use sound based lightweaving. 2
The Wandering Wizard he/him Posted June 1, 2022 Posted June 1, 2022 Well if the person can lightweave they won't be blind anymore as stormlight heals all wounds, but it would be curious if a person would stay blind like Words of Radiance spoilers Spoiler How kaladin kept his scar.
Treamayne Posted June 1, 2022 Posted June 1, 2022 (edited) While not directly related to blindness, I found this WoB that implies that Lightweaving would still work, but may work slight differently 1 hour ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said: I was thinking about lightweaving the other day and if a character with the surge of illusion was blind. <snip> Would this consume more stormlight at a faster rate than other lightweaving? Is it the amount of space your illusion is taking up that determines how fast stormlight is used up or is it complexity of an illusion? Would plastering the world around a person in bright light or pitch black be considered more or less complex of a challenge than putting on a disguise or sending out your spren to imitate you? Probably if you tried to fill a whole room, but a clever application** could probably consume the same or less Stormlight (depending on if complexity increases the rate of Stormlight expenditure) **Codex Alera Spoiler Spoiler Such as when Amara crafts her WindVeil over only the horseman's head - a the Lightweaving of darkness could be done only around an opponent's face. Bonus points for adding white noise to cancel sound - so they can neither see nor hear. Quote Also would you be able to hide your own stormlight glow in a room that you just layered jet black paint over everything in? Lightweavers can already hide their glow by crafting any illusion: From the Coppermind Quote Because the illusion automatically feeds off the Surgebinder, the glowing effect common to the Surgebinders as the Stormlight leaks out of their bodies does not happen, as excess Stormlight is instead fed to the illusion 1 hour ago, Frustration said: I would imagine that instead of using light based Illumination, blind individuals are more likely to use sound based lightweaving. Well, another interesting implication is that Kriss describes the Surge of Illumination as "The Surge of Light, Sound, and Various Waveforms" and this WoB Spoiler Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) [Discussion of Lightweavers manipulating other forms of electromagnetic radiation] But the ultimate form (That Brandon said would be too much to be practical both in needed stormlight and application) would be the control of Gamma Radiation. If this could be harnessed, Lightweavers could literally become mini nukes, or death guns. The biggest downside to making Gamma radiation would be the damage the lightweaver would most likely suffer. So gamma radiation is impractical but its a fun thought experiment. The best part of this whole speculation was how excited Brandon was about my train of thought. I don't know if anyone had brought up this train of thought before. But he was happy to remind me that things will get pretty interesting when Lightweavers discover lasers and start using them in combat. Which makes me think that if a blind Lightweaver really experimented with sound illusions, could they work with radiowaves (A sound illusion that propagates much further than ordinary sound)? Maybe have an easier time imagining/creating IR/UV? 12 minutes ago, The Wandering Wizard said: Well if the person can lightweave they won't be blind anymore as stormlight heals all wounds, but it would be curious if a person would stay blind like Words of Radiance spoilers Reveal hidden contents How Kaladin kept his scar. Well, just like the Lopen/Rysn pairing, healing blindness would depend on how they view themselves. Edited June 1, 2022 by Treamayne Formatting
Tamriel Wolfsbaine Posted June 1, 2022 Author Posted June 1, 2022 12 minutes ago, The Wandering Wizard said: Well if the person can lightweave they won't be blind anymore as stormlight heals all wounds, but it would be curious if a person would stay blind like Words of Radiance spoilers Hide contents How kaladin kept his scar. I imagine someone blind from birth would likely be hard pressed to be healed even by stormlight. It would be such a part of their identity and as you mentioned with kaladin it appears your self perception has at least a little bit to do with how fast stormlight can heal you / if at all.
Treamayne Posted June 1, 2022 Posted June 1, 2022 1 minute ago, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said: I imagine someone blind from birth would likely be hard pressed to be healed even by stormlight. It would be such a part of their identity and as you mentioned with kaladin it appears your self perception has at least a little bit to do with how fast stormlight can heal you / if at all. Also, I think applications of Lightweaving would differ between somebody sightless from birth, and somebody who used to be sighted. To quote your previously referenced Dardevil: Quote I know what green is, I wasn't born this way.
Frustration Posted June 1, 2022 Posted June 1, 2022 10 minutes ago, Treamayne said: Which makes me think that if a blind Lightweaver really experimented with sound illusions, could they work with radiowaves (A sound illusion that propagates much further than ordinary sound)? Maybe have an easier time imagining/creating IR/UV? Well radiowaves are just lower frequency lightwaves, but maybe perception would make a difference? 1
Treamayne Posted June 1, 2022 Posted June 1, 2022 9 minutes ago, Frustration said: Well radiowaves are just lower frequency lightwaves, but maybe perception would make a difference? That's where I was going - experimenting with sound might lead to the idea of "Sound over Distance" - which might lead to a Fabrial that could receive Lightwoven Radiowaves
Returned he/him Posted June 1, 2022 Posted June 1, 2022 (edited) I'd imagine they still have the ability to do visual Lightweaving, though probably not through visual art focuses like Shallan uses. It's strongly implied that other Lightweaver focuses may include things like written descriptions and other types of art, perhaps sculpture or something more tactile. Vathah just imagines how he wants to present himself, and the illusion comes together alright. In the same way that Shallan's drawings don't need to include things like every pore on Sebarial's face for her illusions to perfectly include them a blind Lightweaver may not need to have a complete image, or even a specific visual image at all, but their Connection to what they want the image to express might still produce a serviceable visual illusion. The amount of Stormlight required seems more like an issue with the oaths a person has sworn than specifics of the illusions they create. I don't think we have any examples of Shallan's lower-quality illusions needing more Stormlight to sustain, though we have few such examples to work with. Edited June 1, 2022 by Returned
Cavani Kholin Posted June 2, 2022 Posted June 2, 2022 On 01/06/2022 at 0:20 AM, Tamriel Wolfsbaine said: If you could only picture darkness in your mind and then you were to project that into the world around you could you cause others to need to experience blindness? I think that you are thinking of blindness in the wrong way. Close one eye. You can still see, out of the other, but there is no ‘black’ in your vision. Being blind doesn’t mean you see black. You just see nothing. It’s similar to asking, ‘what do you see out of your elbow’. There’s no black, there’s simply nothing. That’s the way blindness usually is. Despite this, it doesn’t really affect the rest of your argument. As well as that, they probably could project out the blackness, but I think a better way would be to make a ‘black box’ that blocks out the light. Just 6 thin screens, surrounding you and your opponent. I think that would block out sunlight and have essentially the same effect, with far less stormlight 1
Tamriel Wolfsbaine Posted June 2, 2022 Author Posted June 2, 2022 6 hours ago, Cavani Kholin said: I think that you are thinking of blindness in the wrong way. Close one eye. You can still see, out of the other, but there is no ‘black’ in your vision. Being blind doesn’t mean you see black. You just see nothing. It’s similar to asking, ‘what do you see out of your elbow’. There’s no black, there’s simply nothing. That’s the way blindness usually is. Despite this, it doesn’t really affect the rest of your argument. As well as that, they probably could project out the blackness, but I think a better way would be to make a ‘black box’ that blocks out the light. Just 6 thin screens, surrounding you and your opponent. I think that would block out sunlight and have essentially the same effect, with far less stormlight Yeah I guess my thought in black is simply that that is what I view as being nothing. When I wrap my face with a black cloth I see nothing but darkness. That said, I do like the idea of instead of painting the entire world as black, creating a box that light cannot enter. That does seem like it would be far more efficient.
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