Kaladin vs. Adolin

[Benjibooboo]

This is my first post. I have been lurking on here for a while and thought it was about time I joined.

I wanted to convey some thoughts after reading the last few chapters released.

Adolin, whether due to his resentment of the way he was spoken to during the pershendi fight, or whether he generally gets a bad vibe, seems to hold some animosity toward Kaladin. In turn Kaladin thinks Adolin is "cocky" and "spoiled". Now we know that both characters are pretty decent guys. We also can deduce that both characters will probably become fully fledged radiants. (Obvious with Kaladin, and Adolin has now started to lose the thrill during his duels, just like Dalinar has with plateau assaults, indicating a lean more toward the radiant methodology of fighting only for morally sound reasons).

I think Brandon is teeing these two up to become best buds. Kaladin is now wishing to practice with someone of great skill and who better than the dual master himself Adolin? (I would love a scenario where Adolin beats everyone in duals, then somehow insults Kaladin and instigates a dual and is surprised by the outcome.)

I think it is likely that they will both eventually come to deeply respect one another (probably in a situation where one is forced to help the other because it's the right thing to do and therefor sets light to a great friendship) and may both participate jointly in the defense against Seth.

Am I on my own in thinking these two look like becoming best buds? I also think that the relationship could be sparked via an incident involving renarin. This would fit nicely into Kaladins own brotherly history.

[PorridgeBrick]

I also hope that the two become close friends. However, Adolin better not be on the path to Radianthood. With Jasnah, Dalinar, Renarin, and Elkohar all possible Surgebinders, the Kholins are way too packed as it is. Besides, I really don't want a story where every major character has to have magical abilities, and I doubt Brandon would do that to us.

[Arondell]

Besides, I really don't want a story where every major character has to have magical abilities, and I doubt Brandon would do that to us.

 

Well looking at the Mistborn series almost every major character had magical abilities.  I'm trying to think of a major character that didn't and having a hard time thinking of anyone.

[Benjibooboo]

Well here's the thing, we know that with a desolation coming we are going to need a bunch of radiants. From what we have seen Adolin seems a lot more honorable than most so it would kind of make sense to have him join Kaladins order. I think most of the POV characters will develop abilities. Given the extreme battles ahead they need everyone they can get.

[+eveorjoy]

Adolin isn't broken enough to be a surgebinder. His life has been too normal. He's a bit spoiled and through his father has taught him to work hard he has also given him a lot. He is golden son of the Kholin house. Now he could have something happen that breaks his soul and thus makes surgebinding possible, but for now, I don't think so.

[Benjibooboo]

Also, for me I would love Adolin to develop abilities. That last dual was badass. Couple his natural fighting skill with some wind running skills and he may be the most exciting character to watch during battles.

[Benjibooboo]

Adolin isn't broken enough to be a surgebinder. His life has been too normal. He's a bit spoiled and through his father has taught him to work hard he has also given him a lot. He is golden son of the Kholin house. Now he could have something happen that breaks his soul and thus makes surgebinding possible, but for now, I don't think so.

Hate to say it but......Renarins death would have that effect

[Lorna]

Hate to say it but......Renarins death would have that effect

 

Don't say that!

*cries on Feathers' shoulder* I think more souls would be broken than Adolin's

Edited February 1, 2014 by Lorna

[carlucill]

I would rather Renarin become a Radiant than Adolin.

Edited February 1, 2014 by carlucill

[+eveorjoy]

Don't say that!

*cries on Feathers' shoulder* I think more souls would be broken than Adolin's

 

Renarin could die, but I have my doubts. WoB is that he has a spren. Why give him a spren, which opens many possibilities for him as a character and then just kill him off? It could work, but it would be a waste.

 

Actually, I think Adolin is more likely to die than Renarin, because his death would affect the reader more and he would be easier to write out of the story. I like Adolin, a lot. I like him even through he is giving the stink eye to my boy Kaladin. None the less in Book one he felt like a function of Dalinar's arc. He might come into his own and expand as a character in his own write. He might have tragic arc that ends in WoR with his death.

 

Also, Dalinar's death would be enough to break Adolin. I wouldn't like it, but I could see Dalinar dying in WoR.

 

Personally, I don't think any of them will die, but if Brandon did kill them off he would do so in a way that was fulfilling to the story.

Edited February 1, 2014 by eveorjoy

[bartbug]

Have you read the mistborn trilogy? Or the Wheel of Time? Brandon has said, in regard to the ending, that he had to let the characters make their own choices and that he couldn't protect them from the consequences. With things like the Everstorm approaching, where a normal Desolation leaving nine out of ten dead, I can't imagine anything but massive casualties. I'm thinking along the lines of Walking Dead, maybe.

[+eveorjoy]

Yes, I read both of those series. Every death was satisfying and served the story well. At this point the only characters I would truly be shocked to see die are Shallan and Kaladin.

 

Adolin, Renarin, and Dalinar could all die in WoR and it would work, I just don't think they will yet.

 

Edit: And if Kaladin died at the end of the series that would be fine. I have no issue with character death. I thought Vin and Elend's death in "Hero of Ages" was beautiful. But if you kill the character who is driving the story forward then that is the end of the story. It would be like killing Vin in Mistborn. There would have been no trilogy without Vin.

Edited February 1, 2014 by eveorjoy

[bartbug]

Yeah, I hear you. For me, Kaladin's invincible until end of book 5, if only because there supposed to be two, whole halves of the series. Those deaths, each one of them, I thought was absolutely perfect. When I finished Hero of Ages, I had to sit down and think about how neat and complete the absolution was. Yes, it wasn't 'perfect' for the characters, but it fit the story. And by the way SA is shaping out to be, me thinks that it's going to be a bloodbath, if only because we have a Szeth who we know is coming.

I agree that too many characters cannot die until a certain point in the story, and we haven't reached that point yet. But given how WoR turns out, we could be really close or really far.

 

EDIT: What I meant before, is I'm thinking mostly Bridge 4 or some of the crewmembers of The Wind's Pleasure. I gaurantee you tears will be shed when they die.

Edited February 1, 2014 by bartbug

[DocHoliday]

I also hope that the two become close friends. However, Adolin better not be on the path to Radianthood. With Jasnah, Dalinar, Renarin, and Elkohar all possible Surgebinders, the Kholins are way too packed as it is. Besides, I really don't want a story where every major character has to have magical abilities, and I doubt Brandon would do that to us.

 

 

Well here's the thing, we know that with a desolation coming we are going to need a bunch of radiants. From what we have seen Adolin seems a lot more honorable than most so it would kind of make sense to have him join Kaladins order. I think most of the POV characters will develop abilities. Given the extreme battles ahead they need everyone they can get.

Something you need to consider Porridge is that philosophy and attitude, are very often very similar amongst family members. If the driving patriarch or matriarch of a family insist on something being the foundation of a family, it usually will be.

So the Kholins being Honorable, is not unusual or out of placed, even for magic.

 

Adolin isn't broken enough to be a surgebinder. His life has been too normal. He's a bit spoiled and through his father has taught him to work hard he has also given him a lot. He is golden son of the Kholin house. Now he could have something happen that breaks his soul and thus makes surgebinding possible, but for now, I don't think so.

WHY does everyone feel that Spiritual damage is requisite for magic? 

[+eveorjoy]

I remember reading somewhere that Kaladin will have another flashback sequence in the second Stormlight Arc, but I could be wrong. If that is the case I think he would be around in book 6 too so the readers remember who he is after the long break between books 5 and 6.
 
Who well, we will see what happens.
 

WHY does everyone feel that Spiritual damage is requisite for magic?

From the back cover of WoR. Bold text changed by me,
 

 

It is the nature of the magic. A broken soul has cracks into which something else can be fit.  Surgebindings, the powers of creation themselves.  They can brace a broken soul; but they can also widen its fissures.

Edited February 1, 2014 by eveorjoy

[DocHoliday]

I see, I hadn't seen that. Wonder what Ym, Lift, or Jasnah are broken from. If they're broken at all. I think it may be more of a metaphor. 

 

Honestly, being Honorable in RL is costly usually. It is almost never beneficial to the individual, because they are usually socially minded rather than selfishly motivated.

So an individual acting with the interests of others might be considered broken, as they can allow things like self sacrifice. Which mother nature might find slightly defunct.

[+eveorjoy]

I see, I hadn't seen that. Wonder what Ym, Lift, or Jasnah are broken from. If they're broken at all. I think it may be more of a metaphor. 

 

Honestly, being Honorable in RL is costly usually. It is almost never beneficial to the individual, because they are usually socially minded rather than selfishly motivated.

So an individual acting with the interests of others might be considered broken, as they can allow things like self sacrifice. Which mother nature might find slightly defunct.

 

Could be. When I read the back blurp for WoR I thought of how Mistings and Mistborn had to be snapped to gain their powers. One event was enough. I think Kaladin could surgebind before he became a slave. Tien's death would have been enough. Ym's interlude suggests he has a criminal past. Lift grew up on the street, so any number of things could have happened to her. She seems very focused on food. Yes I know she invests from the food she eats, but she most likely starved before she became a surgebinder. As for Jasnah, I don't think she was raped as some have assumed (that would be really cliche) however something has happened to her. There is some trauma from her past that is the source of her issues with men. It could be nothing more than a robbery. That would be enough of a victimization to cause spiritual damage.

[TJK99]

Adolin isn't broken enough to be a surgebinder. His life has been too normal. He's a bit spoiled and through his father has taught him to work hard he has also given him a lot. He is golden son of the Kholin house. Now he could have something happen that breaks his soul and thus makes surgebinding possible, but for now, I don't think so.

I don't disagree with you that its unlikely his soul has been broken, but a possible event that might have caused this in the past is his mothers death.

[Natans]

I don't disagree with you that its unlikely his soul has been broken, but a possible event that might have caused this in the past is his mothers death.

Dalinar death will be enough to break his soul

 

I like him but let be sincere folks he is doomed, old warrior dying is a common trope ;(

 

Thinking about what broke Renarin soul ? His health condition ?

Edited February 1, 2014 by Natans

[Looter]

I also hope that the two become close friends. However, Adolin better not be on the path to Radianthood. With Jasnah, Dalinar, Renarin, and Elkohar all possible Surgebinders, the Kholins are way too packed as it is. Besides, I really don't want a story where every major character has to have magical abilities, and I doubt Brandon would do that to us.

You know I have been thinking about this and one thing that kinda makes me think maybe the Kholins will get a lot of surgebinders is the simple fact of it might be related to why the Parshendi had Gavilar killed.  If something he did was serious enough to start this desolation it could also be related to the Kholins being so central to the storyline.

[+eveorjoy]

I don't disagree with you that its unlikely his soul has been broken, but a possible event that might have caused this in the past is his mothers death.

 

In Mistborn Marsh Snapped because of his Mother's death and Kelser did not. He snapped later when his wife was murdered. Not everyone is broken by a parent's death. I don't think Adolin was broken because, well... he acts like a young stupid kid. That isn't a bad thing. Many normal twenty year old men act the same way. Go check out a fraternity on a college campus to prove this. It just proves he is normal. That doesn't mean he didn't love his mother. It might mean family was so supportive of him through that time that such an event didn't break him. Dalinar is an awesome dad to even his niece and nephew. I could see him helping Adolin get through that event. Or maybe the Old magic had something to do with it.

 

I do think the blood sickness is the reason Renarin is broken.

[Colby Jack]

I'll say this, if either Kaladin or Adolin was a chick, I'll so sh... I mean, I can so see them in a... Uh, maybe I should post this in another account.

[Aether]

I do think the blood sickness is the reason Renarin is broken.

I think it could be, at least indirectly. I do not think a major event is necessary to break a soul. I am open to the idea that it can be a gradual thing as well, such as being back-talked and belittled his entire life outside of his family. In Renarin's particular case, I do not think this have had any major lasting effect on his soul, but it could on other people.

[+eveorjoy]

I think it could be, at least indirectly. I do not think a major event is necessary to break a soul. I am open to the idea that it can be a gradual thing as well, such as being back-talked and belittled his entire life outside of his family. In Renarin's particular case, I do not think this have had any major lasting effect on his soul, but it could on other people.

 

Well, maybe not the sickness itself, but that fact that it makes him physically weak. Considering he is the son of a hero in a warrior culture, I'm sure there have been many times he was emotionally kicked down and trod upon by his peers. Renarin hides his emotions, most likely so when people degrade him to his face he doesn't want to show them how much it hurts.

 

I hope we get Renarin's POV in WoR. That would be interesting.

[Natans]

Well, maybe not the sickness itself, but that fact that it makes him physically weak. Considering he is the son of a hero in a warrior culture, I'm sure there have been many times he was emotionally kicked down and trod upon by his peers. Renarin hides his emotions, most likely so when people degrade him to his face he doesn't want to show them how much it hurts.

 

I hope we get Renarin's POV in WoR. That would be interesting.

 

He looks like sad fella, and have confidence issues but this is enough to have broken soul ? I think that his mother death and Dalinar curse could be related to this. Something is a little off here. For once I don't think that the son of a highprince like Dalinar could have such bad life.