Jult

Yeah. I hesitated on bringing him up since this is the Stormlight board. But since he's already been mentioned... (Big Mistborn Era 1 Spoilers):

We aren't shown the agreement that Kor drew up in its entirety, but I don't think it only limited how power could be granted. It was described as restricting all interactions with the mortals. The whole point of the agreement was to limit the damage they did to Roshar. I'd be surprised if it didn't include some rules about just directly smiting Rosharans. There are also some lines here and there that might imply the original agreement between the participants in the Shattering involved some stipulations around attacking mortals. Also, even if it wasn't part of the agreement, abusing your power is probably a good way to get all of the other Vessels mad at you.

I do and I can! I will say the bit I highlighted sounds as if there's more to it than the contract alone. But Frustration is right. It's largely the contract protecting Hoid.

That's what I thought when I first read it, but when I did a second look it never said one way or the other. I personally still think she left, but she could still be on Roshar. Yeah it's not completely clear what her plan is, but it could involve leaving Roshar. Even if it does though, she decided to implement it on Day Nine of WaT. So, she didn't have much time to get offworld. Not saying she couldn't. But it would have been tight. Giving some more thought to the Heralds breaking. I do not trust that they all have good intentions (looking at you, Battar). Could one of the Heralds "break" on purpose as a form of sabotage?

As soon as you said "everyone" was locked in their current situation, my brain went "except BAM". I agree with you that she is most likely to make the first big move. My guess is Honor will push back on any attempts by Taravangian to harm BAM. It really didn't like it when Tanavast betrayed her. There are some other smaller parties to consider as well: -Axindweth is presumably in custody. She likely has allies who might come for her. -The Nightwatcher is around somewhere and I suspect Cultivation left some instructions for her. -The spren societies (like the Honorspren at Lasting Integrity or the Cultivationspren in the Ring) may have something to say about all the recent activity. The creation of Retribution, the new Oathpact, the departure of Cultivation, and the curious case of the Unoathed (especially Notum) all seem like they'll really shake up spren society. -Rysn is floating around with a Dawnshard right within Retribution's reach. She went into hiding with the Sleepless but I doubt we've seen the last of her.

When the Cosmere RPG first released, I did a bit of a dive into abilities that seem Order-specific. They (mostly) aren't outright stated to be Resonance abilities. But they were still interesting to dissect. Checking it out could help with your theorizing:

I'd bet on yes. Navani was able to split the illumination given off by Towerlight into the colors that corresponded to Stormlight and Lifelight. She herself admitted that this was different from actually splitting the Lights: But I think her experiments at least imply that un-mixing them is possible. She compared the behavior to two emulsified liquids. Like forcing oil and water to mix. Most emulsions can be separated in some way.

As a big part of that uptick, I thank you. I strongly agree. I often see people associating Renarin's visions with the fact that Glys is Enlightened. And, while that probably has some impact on it, I do think Fortune has always been part of the Truthwatcher toolkit to some degree. Brandon has mentioned that Truthwatchers are more closely linked to the Spiritual Realm than the other Orders (except Bondsmiths). Which I think supports this idea as well. While we are on the subjects of the Double Eye and Truest Surges... Something else that bothers me about the Double Eye is there's some asymmetry to Honor's truest surge and Cultivation's truest surge both being on the right side. Might just be me, but my brain really wants them to be in mirrored positions. Which got me wondering if the Surges that do mirror them (Tension and Illumination) have anything to do with H+C. And it's almost just the opposite. I'm a little tempted to throw up the idea of Illumination being Honor's "falsest" Surge or some other catchier name. Basically, the Surge least aligned with Honor's Intent. I doubt Liespren resonate well with Honor. Similarly, that would make Tension Cultivation's "falsest" Surge. Which is a tougher sell to me.. I guess you could say Tension makes things less susceptible to change. And Peakspren are probably the least fluid of the True Spren. I'm sure this has all been said before somewhere. But maybe there should be some implied axii along the diagonals of the Double Eye to represent alignment with the Shardic Intents?

You're welcome. Another fun fact you may find interesting: using multiple Honorblades, bonding multiple spren, or some combination of the two would potentially give you access to new abilities by mixing Surges that aren't normally mixed.

You're referring to this WoB, I believe: And this artwork for Shards of Creation: Brandon said in the WoB that he hadn't 100% made up his mind on Skai but was leaning towards she/her. My guess is he changed his mind.

Actually, Kaladin manifested his own Honorspear when re-forging the Oathpact. So, I think he doesn't really have a connection to Jezrien's old blade. Nale actually was bonded to a spren in addition to holding his Honorblade. Brandon has said that this makes you a bit stronger, but probably by less than you'd imagine: Yes. Brandon has even said you could get access to all 10 Surges at once if you collected the right Honorblades. I think we saw this a little with Szeth. I don't fully recall which ones, but I think he used some of the Honorblades in WaT - despite being a Skybreaker.

Ah well there goes that theory. I guess it's Cultivationspren after all. Thank you for finding the quote. Your point about them being in the center of the Double Eye is definitely interesting, and as the WoB you included says, their powers are different in ways that are similar to how Bondsmith powers are different. So there does seem to be something special about them, but it doesn't sound like being pure Cultivation is it. And thanks to you as well. Yeah, I'm definitely going to keep looking for oddities related to Mistspren/Truthwatchers, but it looks like I was chasing the wrong lead. I would assume Cultivation consented to letting her spren be bound. The oaths were kind of her idea anyway. I'm not sure if this is the same section PanLin was referring to but it might be. WaT 113: Looking at this now, it almost feels like direct manipulation of Tanner and Rayse from Kor. She gave them two options for meting out powers, and one was obviously designed to appeal to Honor. Another thing worth noting from that chapter is that Kor also enters this agreement. I feel like it's often characterized as a pact between Honor and Odium that she just happened to be there for. But it's her pact too.

I always viewed Rayse's targeting of Aona and Skai as convenience more than anything else. He was looking for Ambition first and just happened upon them breaking the agreement that the Shards made and settling the same planet. It gave him an excuse to attack them without provoking the other Shards. A tactic that worked based on Edgli's response (OB Epigraphs 37, 39-41) and the fact that no one came after him. It's probably why he went to Roshar too. Kor and Tanner also broke the rules. So, he would have been "justified" in removing them. Don't forget his goal was to take out all of the other Shards. I don't think he had a special interest in removing Devotion in particular - he just found himself in a position where he knew he could get away with it.

I've seen this idea before. And I do like it quite a bit. However, I think it's hard to reconcile with the Tanavast quote alder24 put above: If the Unmade were the cityspren, I feel like it would have been nearly impossible to hide their creation from Tanavast. Unless Tanavast just really wasn't paying attention. Master_Moridin makes a good point too. There are a few hints that the Unmade aren't all spren. I think alder24's idea of the Ancient Spren already having similar tones to H+C because all Investiture aligned to one of the Shards at the time of the Shattering is the best idea for getting around this. Side note: I feel like sometimes we conflate tones and rhythms in these discussions. Being able to actually hear these things would be nice.. Describing sounds is hard.

There was originally going to be more to their position on the chart, but Brandon felt he was getting too into the weeds: My feeling is that, despite him not committing to it, there's still something important about Truthwatchers compared to the other orders in his head. They might be. I know the Enlightened Cryptic and Inkspren that we saw in WaT had Honor in them. But I think that's because normal Cryptics and Inkspren were made by Honor. If Mistspren are the one variety that Kor created by herself, then normal Mistspren would have no Honor. And neither would enlightened ones. See but I would interpret this bit: to say that one of the Radiant spren is purely of Cultivation (though their ability to use Stormlight admittedly raises some questions). I think that variety will be very important. Because it should be safe from Retribution's influence even without the protection of the Oathpact. Which might be a point in favor of Cultivationspren, since most of the Mistspren we know are corrupted. But I can't shake the idea that Mistspren matter more. I remember this! I'm pretty sure it was the start of my descent into this Mistspren rabbit hole.