Forged Herald

How is rejecting to be a Herald foolish? Rejecting an eternity of torture sounds pretty rational.

It's right after Szeth forswears his oaths.

I disagree. She doesn't have to argue loyalty, she has to refuse to argue and just trust. I know it's antithetical to who she is, that's why she lost.

Fen didn't want to negotiate with Odium at all, it was Jasnah who agreed to the debate. The mayor problem with Jasnah is that in arguing with Odium she undermined all the trust Fen had in her. Fen is the Queen of Theylenah and Jasnah has to trust her allies to make the right choice. Loyalty and trust go a longer way than logic and arguments. Even if he lays out how Jasnah had plans to murder Fen, she just has to say: "I now trust in you to make the right choice"

How is what you said any different from what I said. Jasnah thought she was going that her arguments were better than Odiums and that was enough to win the debate. She didn't think it was going to devolve into personal attacks and she didn't consider the fact that Odium knew a lot more things than her. If she knew as much as Odium, she could have won by saying: "You aren't trustworthy, you destroyed your own home (Karbranth)". But Jasnah thought she could outargue Odium and that was never an option. The other way for Jasnah to win the argument would have been to say: "I refuse to argue with you: I trust Queen Fen to amke the right decision." But she didn't do that either. She thought seh could argue her point better than an almost all-knowing beeing and that simply outarguing Odium would be enough to convince Fen.

I absolutely agree. But I don't mind Tress and Yumi (I actually enjoyed both very much) and I had no problem with their style (I thinj¡k it suited Yumi a lot). But the inconsistency drives me mad sometimes and completely breaks my immersion. As many have said, I believ it's the editors job and I don't know if it is because of the ack of time or becasue of "fear" of contraticitng Brandon, but the editors are not doing a good job in some aspects. The story is still really enjoyable and it isn't half as bad as some of the worst examples of good story, bad writing (like Dune), but I feel it could be way better with a little more editing and revision.

I disagree, they don't sound like bridgemen either and bridgemen weren't precisely Alethi posh.

I thought about Spanreeds. I agree that they allow instant communication, but only for a small part of the population and only peer to peer. Also people like Kaladin or Adolin can't read, so I don't think language would advance nearly as fast as it does today (and even if it did, it feels like too great of a change anyway).

I agree it isn't medieval, and it never felt medieval (excepting Syl at some points). But it definitively felt classic (maybe more Three Musketeers vibe than something really medieval), like you said somewhere in 18th-19th century. But the last book felt a lot like 21st century YA, and thats what felt really jarring to me. I get language evolves, but the change felt to brusque for just a year or two in a society without internet. I don't think it's justified, even when Brandon tries to explain it in-book.

I didn't write all the examples down, but there were some that stood out: Aladin calling May his "ex" is the one that jarred me the most. From courting to dating to "ex". Obviously the modern swearing (even if it's explained in book) interjections like a f*cking Herald using the word "basically" in the middle of a sentence. I don't care about modern language in characters like Wayne or Hoid, but when characters change the way they speak (like Szeth's unique way of talking) it's a great loss. Also it's not just modern language. I don't remember when, but there was a really obvious latin word that also stood out to me like a sore thumb.

Honor wants to respect it. It doesn't know why but Taravangian doesn't want to antagonize Honor

There are a few key things. The main problem with Jasnah, IMO, is she actually tried arguing with Odium. There is no winning in such a discussion, no amount of arguments is going to make you more convincing than a being that is mostly all-knowing. Jasnah thought she was going to outsmart T-Odium, but that wasn't going to happen and that hybris is what brought her down. She should have said: "I'm not arguing with you, I trust Queen Fen to make the right choice". I know Odium had a backup plan, and Thaylenah would probably have fallen anyway (and Queen Fen would be dead) but it would be the way for Jasnah to win (even if she looses Thaylenah). Also, I loved that Odium didn't argue Philosophy: he just attacked Jasnah personally. Arguments and logic don't really matter when trying to convince someone (the same happened with Kaladin and Nale but Kaladin saw how he couldn't argue logic with Nale). Lastly it is kind of ironic how surrendering to Odium allowed Thaylenah to get commerce but they literally lost sunlight. I don't know how good a deal it was, but it definitely wasn't worth it. She was willing to take that leap of faith. Jasnah, with all her arguing, undermined it. If Jasnah had simply said: "I trust Queen Fen to do the right thing" she would have taken the leap. Odium would probably still have won because of the Deepest ones, but trying to argue was what brought Jasnah down.

The combination of two Shards doesn't have a fixed outcome (Harmony Discord). Also I don't think that the combination of Honor and Cultivation is necessarily life (maybe Civilization?)

I don't remember all that well, because, as I said, I don't really like era 2 as much and haven't reread anything, but I remember distinctly Wayne eating Chouta and at least one Horneater. There where more implications about Rosharan refugees, but I don't remember the details.

My impression (with this book and most of Mistborn era 2) is that editors are not really doing their jobs. I don't know if it's lack of time (because of the insane output) or if they are more afraid to question Brandon, but there definitely are many scenes that would require a work around. Also style is starting to become a little too inconsistent between TWoK and WaT. As you said, everything about Shallan and Kaladin can be tossed out the window and a lot of parts could be made smoother (enhancing the book and, in the process, saving dozens of pages). Story is great, world is astonishing, but editing is subpar.