AquaRegia

It's a very good question. I don't have any good answers, but it did remind me of something I noticed recently when rereading the very first scene of WoK: Kelek sees piles of bodies, some human, some not... and blood - red, orange, purple. OK, red = human, orange = singer. WHOSE PURPLE BLOOD WAS THAT? Apparently there was a 3rd species involved in the fighting immediately before the breaking of the Oathpact? One that, for Kelek, was unworthy of mention, yet has not been seen on Roshar since? Could that explain why humans could never finish off the singers?

My 2006 paperback says "Mistborn" in the cover. "Mistborn" on the spine. "Mistborn" on the top of every odd-numbered page. The only places the words "The Final Empire" appear is the copyright info and the title page, and who looks at that? At the very least, it's certainly a bit misleading. Kind of like how that film that was originally titled "Star Wars" eventually became "A New Hope". Oh, @tilionvevfet, welcome!

Well, I just joined (post-RoW) because my wife is getting tired me talking about nothing but the Cosmere and I needed another outlet. Does this mean people actually talk with their mouths instead of typing? Ugh, no thank you.

My wife will vouch for me deserving a place in this group.

Interesting ideas, I disagree with two specific parts: From a strictly "narrative" perspective, Brandon has spent 4 novels building a full backstory for Taravangian. I find it EXTREMELY unlikely that all that will go down the drain in book 5. Much more likely, to me, is that TOdium spends book 5 learning and growing, and heads into the back 5 as THE BIG BAD. Sja-Anat couldn't enlighten Radiant spren during the past 4000+ years simply because there weren't any around in the Physical realm. Once they started reappearing (only in the past 20 years, and in very small numbers), she began looking. There are WoBs noting that she is only interested in sentient spren who are WILLING to be changed, and that, so far, Truthwatcher spren have been the only willing ones.

@GroundPetrel this makes a ton of sense, thanks. Certainly depression and isolation feed each other in a vicious cycle for LOTS of folks. Q: Can one have SAD on a planet with no real seasons? LOL AMEN. Truer words were never spoken!

It's an interesting question. At this point, it would appear that he made a deal with himself... but if the "rules" of such deals are solid enough to bind Shards (or, at least, the consequences are real enough, even for Shards, to compel adherence), then I'd say he's still bound by the deal. Odium did say that breaking his word would allow Cultivation to kill him, and T later noted explicitly that he is still bound by the contract made with Dalinar. A related question: why would Taravangian WANT to abrogate the agreement? He's still himself, with the same personal motivations. I don't see any reason why he would want Kharbranth (i.e., his own family) to come to harm. I get that he's going to have some serious internal conflicts as the Intent of the Shard starts working on the personality of the Vessel (protect vs destroy, hatred vs compassion, action vs planning)... but in the specific case of Kharbranth, it seems like both interests align.

@Eri it's interesting you see Kaladin as an extrovert. My sweetie and I were discussing him and she sees him as an introvert who has learned how to "play a role", in this case, the military leader. I find I agree. I'm definitely more introverted, yet I was a successful high school teacher for many years; I was able to play the "role" of the high-energy people person in order to get my job done, even though it wasn't really who I was... and of course I was exhausted at the end of every day and needed serious alone time to recharge. I think the wedding party scene in RoW is illustrative: Adolin, the true extrovert, knows EVERYONE and enjoys learning everything about them. Kaladin, the introvert, knows all about the people under his command... but is unaware of who's getting married, or even that it was a wedding party. P.S.: I was today years old when I learned that "extravert" and "extrovert" are both acceptable spellings!

The answer to that question seems obvious to me: Cryptics are also called Liespren. They are drawn to lies. We've heard Pattern admiring - even worshipping - lies, dozens of times. And Shallan? Shallan has THE. BEST. LIES. Oh no!!! A beautiful hypothesis killed by an ugly fact? I think not. I think we HAVE to accept that Shallan is indeed still bonded to Testament as a deadeye Shardblade: At first, I was unsatisfied by the "Testament was elsewhere" explanation; Maya was ALWAYS with Adolin, every time he went to Shadesmar. But Ico, the Reacher captain in OB, does make that comment about deadeyes walking off the deck, wading through the ocean of spheres, trying to find the human that carries their corpse. And we were told that the Honorspren had been collecting and "caring" for deadeyes in Lasting Integrity, which is where Testament showed up. So I guess it's a possibility I can accept. I don't think there can be any question at this point that Shallan used Testament to kill both her mother and Tyn, and that she is now bonded to both Pattern (alive) and Testament (as a deadeye).

Thank you so much, EVERYONE, for all your fantastic responses! I laughed at many (especially the punches), and understand all of them. I you all! What I heard from @Eri was "Kaladin seems to have all the same problems I do... but he ends up as a rich, powerful, famous, popular superhero, and I'm still a piece of crem. What does that say about me?" I think that's an understandable feeling. But it's also possible to say "here's a person like me who made it... so maybe I can too." Sometimes attitude is everything.

Posting an opinion from another topic that seems relevant here: I have years of personal experience: someone in my life deals with both repression of childhood trauma and Dissociative Identity (I don't even like the term "disorder" here, it's an amazingly effective coping mechanism). Please try to be thoughtful and respectful. What you are saying can be taken as "it's uncomfortable for me to have to read about this VERY REAL thing that some people go through". It's fine to say "I'm uncomfortable," as long as you realize that doesn't give you the right to criticize or judge other people's experiences. I find it extremely inclusive and empowering to see "heroes" in fiction who are not only not perfect in every way, but struggle with REAL problems that have not been represented before in fantasy.

This feels right to me as well; it's about INTENT. I will not be surprised when, at some point in the future of the series, the TENTH LIGHT (no coincidence there) somehow provides the final solution to Roshar's conflicts: 1. Stormlight 2. Anti-stormlight 3. Lifelight 4. Anti-lifelight 5. Voidlight 6. Anti-voidlight 7. Siblinglight (S+L) 8. Warlight (S+V) 9. Somethinglight (L+V) 10. The TENTH LIGHT (S+L+V)

A. Welcome to the 17th Shard - glad you are here. B. I don't have any guesses as to whether this will happen... but it is a super cool idea. Conversely, if it DOES go down like this, I'm going to pissed off that you spoiled it for us LOL It is canon (somewhere, don't ask me where) that the Heralds did borrow each other's Honorblades sometimes. I don't recall if having two at once was specifically addressed.

I very much doubt TOdium will die in the next novel. What I see is BS giving a fully-fleshed-out backstory and motivation for what will be the Biggest Bad in the Cosmere for many books to come. Odium is now one of only two Shards (the other being Harmony) for which we have any direct knowledge of their Vessel as a human pre-Ascension. He's spent significant parts of 4 novels showing us Taravangian as a person... I just don't see that narrative work being thrown away so easily. Odium will not defeat Cultivation, nor will he be defeated by her... at least, not in book 5. They will work to find ways to deceive and manipulate each other, yes, but neither wants a direct confrontation. I see books 1-5 setting up TOdium as a fully-formed and terrifying adversary for books 6-10. I'm really wondering what ongoing effects we will see of Cultivation having touched Taravangian; does she still have a Connection to Odium's Vessel, and if so, what are some ways that might play out? I'd guess the boon/curse thing is no longer directly relevant, but she did have a hand in rewriting his spirit web... I believe that fact will become very important at some point.

No further factual information to add, just my feeling that no power in the Cosmere can prevent Sword-Nimi from waking up hungry soon enough.

I love this, thank you Lunu! This will be my very comforting headcanon (unless something better comes along). I can buy this. I've also seen speculation that Lift's communication abilities may stem from her Edgedancer oaths - "I will listen to those who have not been heard."

So hard to say. Wax, the whole "Gentleman of the Roughs" / "Scoundrel of the City" thing is great. Wayne, I wish I could be as laid back, personable, and happy as he is (and I'm bad at hats, too). Steris, her crazy list-making, socially awkward autism-spectrum flight-loving bad self. Marasi, bright-eyed, bushy-tailed, and gender-role challenging. MeLaan, Sazed... sigh, they're all like old friends. Sorry, can't pick one!

My impression is that Shallan never had a name for her first spren. She was so young as to be unsure what was happening... unaware that the entity which became a shardblade was a being separate from herself. I think Brandon has done a MASTERFUL job with Shallan, showing in a very organic way how our memories are fluid, imperfect... ESPECIALLY memories from childhood. We knew she didn't remember things, was repressing things. Then comes a realization, bringing a clearer picture... but eventually THAT gets shattered by another breakthrough, and the picture changes again. And all the while, everything is wrapped in feelings of guilt, shame, and self-hatred. From what I've seen, this is very much how the recovery and integration of traumatic childhood memories often happens.

The Pursuer Defeated One is a great example. He clearly has no trouble understanding what Kaladin is saying, and he does speak. He JUST arrived on Roshar after 4,500 years on Braize. There is no possible way he'd know any modern Alethi. And the "Fused speak with Connection" thing doesn't wash for me. If that were true, they wouldn't need translator forms like Venli's. Raboniel is explicitly shown LEARNING Alethi - at first she needs Venli as a translator; later she speaks with a thick accent; by the end she's fluent. I just re-read the conclave of The Nine chapter. Moash is there - he not only understands what's happening, but addresses the group (with an accent). So apparently he can speak Fused now. Lift has learned flawless idiomatic Alethi in a few months. Am I the only one who feels that learning a new language on Roshar is just way too easy? LOL My wife keeps saying "relax, it's just a story," and I get that. The story is more important than the details. But BS has always been SO GOOD at maintaining the detailed consistency of his worlds... if there is a magical explanation for it, at least tell me. I don't like this feeling of being let down in this! *stomps foot and holds breath*

HAHAHAHA You can do anything you want and I totally think you should start rolling your "r"s!! I love regional dialect discussions, so I'll keep going forever. Feel free to say "OK I'm done" at any time and I won't be insulted. I found this: I was initially afraid MY dialect wouldn't be represented, as they start with people from Florida and North Carolina... but once you get to the California and Massachusetts examples, that's what I'd say. Also the distinction between the auto English and auto Aussie ones is subtle, but good. But apparently people like ME are in the minority on this. To me, that short "a" sound, as in "bat" is quite distinct from a short "e", "bet". The word "air" sounds the same as the word "err" - a short "e" sound. For you, I guess Sara rhymes with Terra. But for me, "carrot" does NOT rhyme with "kerrit", and maybe that "arr" sound I use is simply not in your dialect at all, which happens a lot - I can't roll my "r"s - that sound isn't used in my language so I never learned how to do it. I just realized: NAMES are the best place to find this sound. For me, Harry ≠ hairy. Barry ≠ berry. Larry ≠ fair-y. But again, I'm in the minority. /rant

I have no difficulty imagining that Kelsier, whatever other plans he has, will be itching to administer some payback for the Cognitive beatdown he received from Hoid in Secret History. *sticks fingers in ears and squeezes eyes shut* "Mommy, Daddy, stop fighting!"

Kelsier tried to fight Hoid only after Hoid was condescending and deliberately insulting. It's been a while since I re-read Mistborn, but I recall Kelsier's prejudices abating considerably during his months with Vin... and I don't see him as being any more hateful than Kaladin (with his "storming lighteyes") or more violent than Dalinar. I'm aware of the Thaidakar connection, and while I agree it doesn't look good, we don't really know what his goals are at this point. Nobody is the villain of their own story, right? In any case, they can BOTH deserve a punch. YES. Kelsier vs Hoid, The Rematch. I'm so in. And if you are dealing with all that stuff... well, dang. I'm in your corner. Keep your chin up, you're worth it.

@Bearer of all agonies welcomes new sharders in the “Introduce yourself” forum with the question “who is your favorite character?” This got me thinking… it’s impossible to pick one, because there are so many different ways someone can be a favorite. But what if we break up some of the individual criteria? Then it might make sense. So I made a thing: List the Stormlight character you 1) would like to be friends with most 2) feel is most believable in terms of motivation 3) enjoy reading about most 4) find most confusing/intriguing 5) find makes you laugh the most 6) would like to punch in the face 7) personally relate to most 8) feel is emotionally most realistic 9) shamelessly crush on the hardest 10) is most like someone you know IRL Here are mine: 1) would like to be friends with most – Sigzil. I like nerds, hate liars, and everybody needs a straight man. Also Rock, duh. 2) feel is most believable in terms of motivation – Taravangian. 3) enjoy reading about most – Lift, hands down. Love every scene, can’t wait for more! MORE LIFT PLEASE 4) find most confusing/intriguing – Szeth. Love him, NEED to know WTF happened, hope his broken brain can be fixed somehow. 5) find makes you laugh the most – 4-way tie: Lopen, Nightblood, Chiri-Chiri, that one ardent who just wants to read trashy romance novels. 6) would like to punch in the face – Wit. He needs to get off his ass. Also I’m still mad about how he treated Kelsier. 7) personally relate to most – WANTED to say Navani, but not gonna lie, it’s Sebarial. Smart enough to be fat and lazy in a war for the end of the world? He’s like my spirit animal. 8) feel is emotionally most realistic – Raboniel. Every new wrinkle makes her MORE believable. 9) shamelessly crush on the hardest – almost said Syl (I mean manicpixiedreamgirl amirite) but honestly? Rysn. She’s smart, adventurous, and has matured quite a bit. 10) is most like someone you know IRL – Teft. I know a lot of people trying to recover from addiction. The struggle is real. HATE my picks? Tell me why and let’s talk about it! Give us YOUR picks, and we’ll tell you why you’re crazy!

Great question, so many interesting ideas here! I'll attempt a multi-quote extravaganza to add mine. I immediately figured it was "He Who Quiets", and I still think that... although the musings about the 10th name of the Almighty are VERY tantalizing. I don't think the title implies an assassin, despite Moash's bloody initiation. How many people has Moash killed? 4? Jasnah's killed more than that. And more to the point, Moash's new MO seems to be psychological - getting in your opponent's head, pushing them to give up WITHOUT a fight. That's got more of a "He Who Quiets" vibe to me for sure. Not that murder is frowned upon or anything. This had not occurred to me, and I LIKE IT. I had been thinking it was Raboniel, but El makes more sense. The fact that it was Leshwi who GAVE the title to Moash has me wondering whether she thought El was out of the game permanently... and this would make her consternation at the news that he has again returned much more believable. R-Odium demonstrated in Oathbringer that whatever his faults, racism isn't one of them. He's happy to use anyone, human or singer, to accomplish his goals. Besides, I've never gotten the impression that these titles come from Odium anyway - more likely the Nine. Heck, Leshwi has enough authority to bestow a title on Moash, so they can't be divine. Sure, El and Odium had a disagreement a few thousand years ago; apparently Odium not only came around to El's point of view (humans ARE useful tools), but saw fit to allow El to again return to the fight. I also find it unlikely the "Voice of Lights" news has been widely distributed. But as we know, Brando Sando has a long history of surprising us, so I'm not making any bets.

Welcome @Daycrow. I also agree with MANY of your prefs: I love and am amazed by the Stormilght Archive, but nothing beats MistbornE2 for the feels. Star Trek the Original Series will never be equaled, if only because it did SO MANY things that had never been done on TV before. I thought the first reboot film was fantastic; I was a bit disappointed that the later two devolved into action (only) movies, but still enjoyable. Star Wars, yes, White Sand, yes. I'm also a musician. And you hunger for Sanderson conversation? You have come to the right place. Glad you are here!