Conquestor

Speaking of suspicious... What are you going to do with that Fell Sword? Also, I wouldn't mind a Fell Sword and I would be happy to use it as basically a Second exe by the village next cycle. It would also help prove that I am indeed a son of Feanor. This would also do the job of proving you to be Feanor since Melkor can't make those swords. Also, I agree that Dan was unlikely to be the conversion target. In fact, I think Melkor is unlikely to want Dan has his partner since his role is actually less useful for him in the long run. He might be the target purely for that reason, but honestly I would rather try to luck out on a sailor, Noble, or Orator. Sailor is a whole extra life is super nice and Noble/Orator allow for Lynch survival over multiple cycles, hard to beat that. JNV seems sus to me because after me and Shining got off of him and I tried to convince people to save Dan, he tried to convince me to kill Shining because of their vote switching, which I don't believe to be AI for them. It was chaotic, they are new, and are just trying to make the right choices. While JNV hasn't done much, other than his rules analysis and a couple other small posts. I would like to hear more about their reads if nothing else. I am very slightly leaning Melkor on Archer, but I'm unsure. I also don't think TUN is Melkor just for the reason that he put himself out there at the beginning for no reason. He could've just posted the rules analysis, much like JNV, and not added anything else other than commentary here and there. As for Araris... Well, he seems to be flying under the radar and not putting themselves out there, like at all. They voted for TUN last cycle, who most people were suspicious of and haven't done anything yet this cycle.

Yes I am a noble, but I was trying to hold off on that so I could help hide more useful roles. I am sorry Wizard, you just didn't do anything and I felt pretty good about Dan being vil. It would also make sense that Shining is also a noble which means that he can't be Melkor. I would bet on that because I don't think there are starting items... at least I didn't start with one. That EoD was so chaotic and @Kasimir it was SymphonianBookworm who claimed to be Feanor, not Shining. Speaking of which. @dannnnnnex Did you get your promised item from Symphonian? I agree that the fact that there was no kill is ominous... too ominous. I agree with your personal ordering of likeliness. I do want to do a little more thorough of a run through though. The world of Conversion: I could really see him convert if he was Araris or Dan because they were on the chopping block and any last minute actions could have spelled their doom. The other option is that he was really lonely and wanted a teammate/worried about future action blocks. Melkor submits his conversion target and hits Finwe. If this is the case then it is likely they will get killed at the end of this cycle from the Melkorkill. The only other way that Melkor could fail in his conversion is if he hit someone that Fingolfin whispered to. I would also expect this person to die at the end of the cycle to the Melkorkill just in case it is Finwe. Melkor submits his conversion target and hits literally anyone else. They join his team and we can begin to look for e/e interactions. In this world I could see Mat, Shining, Archer, Devo, Symphonian, Kasimir, JNV, and TUN. This is because Melkor wouldn't want his convert to have a chance of dying in the three way tie. The world of the Melkorkill: Doesn't exist. Now that I've gone through the options, I think that it is most likely that Melkor spent his action crafting so that he can play mind games with us and see what we do. This would also give himself item actions. Even more diabolical, he could've smithed something and gave it to someone! This way he could gain the trust of a player.... maybe. I'm just going to say this and hopefully help someone much more experienced than I am. I am a Noble, but I am also a Son of Feanor. Given that there is only 1 conversion. I wouldn't be entirely surprised if Melkor actually had another role such as Noble, Sailor, or Orator. This would greatly balance out having only one conversion in my own eyes. Also, if Melkor was a Orator, he would have 4 role actions he would have to choose from and if he had to prove himself to use the action... he couldn't have done anything else. Among other things. There seems to be only one Orator because there were four non voters and only one of them was moved. Given that there are only 11 roles and that there are 12 of us, I question whether there is only one Orator or if there are more... @Fifth Scholar What happens when two Orators target the same person to try and move their vote?

SAVE DAN! PLEASE!

Wait... Save Dan! Vote for Wizard's weird votes! @dannnnnnex Vote for wizard as everyone else has left the JNV train! @Matrim's Dice I think you thought that Wizard was being weird and I think we Actually, yes, I could go for that, but they are super new and so I would like to hear more from them.

@JNV Look, don't do it for the self save! Here... TUN hasn't done anything today but wizard has made weird plays and has given no explanation, so I say we vote for him! Don't just murder Dan! Wizard All those that want Dan to live, join me!

While I agree they are good points and that Archer could very well be Archer. Is there anything particular about JNV that you find weird? This leaves JNV and probably Dan tied for the exe with Archer pulling some weird vote manip that will result in Dan dying. Given wizard's current voting weirdness. I'm happy to place my vote on them next cycle, but given the fact that JNV is up for the Lynch and hasn't said anything is kind of interesting.

Da[n=?]ex 3 - Archer, Wizard, Bookworm, Conq 1 - Kas JNV 2 - Conq, Shining TUN 1 - Araris Araris 1 - Mat Wizard 1 - Da[n=?]ex I feel like the Dannnnnnnex bandwagon has two very big negatives, one that it came out of nowhere and with very little reasoning, and two that it came from people who weren't in danger. For me that means that if it were anyone in the bandwagon, that it would be Archer because I don't see Melkor throwing himself out there for no serious reason. I guess unless he thought that Da[n=?]ex is Finwe for some reason? Either way, the votes don't make sense for Dan (which is what I'll be referring to Dannnnnnnnex to from now on) to be Melkor, or Wizard/Bookworm. Also, it seems like we have a bunch of single votes, which I don't think is particularly helpful. Also.... I have so many conflicted feelings about this. If you are Feanor though, I wouldn't mind a shield or a Fell Sword or maybe even both.

RP @Kasimir Already voting for me, eh? I see how it is. Yet, I am not getting a bad vibe from you, so I'll leave it be. It's nice to see you back! I was sad when you left our Alcatraz game! Anyways, on to current discussion... I have to agree that it is interesting that Melkor lost his first turn immunity it is even more interesting to me that he has only 1 conversion, which means that whoever Melkor is, they are going to want to use it very wisely. Honestly, I would spend at least 2 cycles smithing a helm or trinkets/killing people and then going for the convert, unless we somehow found him by happenstance by that point. I believe that both of these are due to the fact that the village has been having... trouble lately. I mean, Devo and Vorros took on a fully powered village, by themselves and won! That combined with the facts that the village roles in this game are much less powerful and that Melkor gets to choose his teammate gives the Elims a pretty decent chance. I think that we can agree that Melkor isn't going to convert someone that's under the hot seat just because they want their teammate to last. Whether they choose someone who's neutral or Vil leaned by most people, is much harder to guess and is likely to be based off of playstyle. Also, getting a read on Melkor is going to be darn near impossible, because we aren't looking for a coordinated team, we're looking for a single person right now. Melkor's only goal right now is pure survival so we just have to find the person with "the most to live for". This currently brings to my mind TUN, Devo, and JNV. TUN because he posted about how he is going to post about something that is usually elim behavior from him but it doesn't mean anything this time. I really only slightly think he could be Melkor, Devo, well he pretty much screams survival and having more that one shield wouldn't do anything for him since you have to activate it as an action and thus it would make more sense to smithy a bunch of shields and hand them out to many people. I however think that this is a little too out there, but then again, that seems to be Devo's elim strategy, so I wouldn't put it past him to do this. I would vote for him, but... JNV, the rules analysis was kind of all over and more like a recommendation on how to play the different roles that one might have. This makes me slightly suspicious but what really draws my attention is that the post feels rushed. Like they wanted to get it out and make it seem like a big deal so that they wouldn't be considered for exeing. This one is more of gut feeling, so I'll probably end up moving my vote to Devo or TUN, but JNV's post is just a great way to hide in the chaos.

I liked playing with you two as well! Sorry for getting you killed at the start though! Near the end I should've realized that you were village but I thought you were going to make a last minute move to try and save yourself... Oh well. We'll get them next time!

Ah thanks Mat! You did a good job as well! I just wish that we got Devo! That was well played Devo, you are a master Elim and I hope to see you on my team next time, whatever side I may be on. Also, You did great TUN! It was a fun game all around.

I will also be hopping in! I will join as Sethryn son of Nyrthes, the Rememberer. I didn't do as much role play last game so I'm excited to really jump in on it this game!

Well I figured that out! I was just wondering if there was anything else I needed to be aware of.

Considering the long list, I wouldn't mind signing up for a QF. By the time my slot comes up, I should have plenty of practice in SE. Also, what does signing up mean/entail? Also, @The Unknown Novel. I think that you posted that in the wrong thread...

Just because I accepted it doesn't mean I wasn't going to go down without a fight!

I apologize to everyone... Especially Mat, Devo, and Sart. Mat I'm still not sure about you, but I guess that some of my stuff was coming out of left field. That same apology goes out to Sart. I wasn't meaning to sound crazy. Part of it was me trying to defend myself and the other was me actually showing off where I thought Mat was making wrong points. I know that everything I said can't be true and a lot of it was just theory. In the end though, most of what we say in these games is theory anyway. Also I apologize @Devotary of SpontaneityI need to be more careful, I did the same thing with Luckspren. I've known I was going to die since the last night cycle, so I accepted my death then. I just thought that I'd get my last few points across. Well, Mat I just don't know about you, but I feel pretty confident about Devo, so I guess I'll put my dying vote there. Does anyone have any last questions for me?

That is completely fair and something that I do myself. I just have to wonder why half of the people that are voting on me are saying that. @The Unknown Novel Does sealing/warding block weaves (except for lightning)? Also, can the Forsaken have a warder. I would assume so, otherwise that would clear so many people, but who knows. I would also assume that Seal would block weaves since every weave except for lightning is non-lethal. Also, there is nothing wrong with checking, but how does that make it so I'm the Forsaken? You and Devo really haven't mentioned or talked about each other at all. The most I got was that you didn't like his D1 vote and so have been neutral about him. He defended himself on why he did that vote and then you two discussed warders and how they work. It just seems like, despite the fact that he is one of your supposed top options, you haven't put much of a case out there for him. It mostly relies on me being an elim, which if you are one, you know that I am not. My guess is that you two will either turn on each other next cycle or try and lynch Xino. You guys just about never mention each other! Uh, he's a brand new player and was trying his best to help the village? I revealed way more important stuff in a pm to a seasoned player for help in my first ever game. I just didn't really know what to do with the info I had or with my role in general. It would've worked out to if Joe didn't get converted... Anyways, the point is that it's not unreasonable that he would share those with you. It's just a little convenient that stuff turned out the way it did... As far as I am aware, there is no other way for warder actions to fail than to be role blocked or the person that you are targeting to be sealed. You just worded your first post this cycle weirdly and so I'm making assumptions from that. Also, why role claim now? Why not wait till later? I'm going to quote you from D2 when I suggested that what you did might be a ploy... Ah, you’d be surprised The risk taking aspect though is a turn off for me, you’re right about that. But plan wise sounds like a fun challenge tbh But yeah it’d be a dumb ploy to do a 1-1 trade at this stage in the game The way that I am reading this, and go ahead and correct me, is that you would take this kind of risk, but only later in the game and more specifically, that you would typically wait another turn. I was assuming that the elims would push to lynch me either this cycle or the next, it would just be too tempting. Really? Out of nowhere? Didn't I talk about you being an elim lean for me N1 and suggested how you could be the forsaken? Also, Devo has been in my neutral camp almost all game, it's not uncommon for people to move out of neutral, at least I thought so. You didn't make a huge case. Yes you called him out for a possible slip up, but as far as I'm aware, until you posted the results of Shining's trace, no one was voting on him except you and the cycle was 6 hours from closing when you did post the results. No one was going to lynch Vorros yet until you posted the results, so it could've been a distancing tactic. I also have a hard time with your e/e thing. I'm not very good at finding/seeing it, so would you mind posting some examples of where me and vorros have been the playbook e/e? You also went pretty well out of your way to not talk about the two trains, almost like you were afraid to tie yourself to one of them. You even said that you didn't have elim points for either one of us and so you voted somewhere else. You actually said less about the trains D1 than Vorros did. Also, if refusal to talk to or about each other is e/e behavior, then my earlier point about you and Devo makes sense according to your own statements. Also, I wouldn't say his first post was a casing... it was more of an opportunistic vote than anything else. Yes, he pressed hard on Illwei, but that just might be his play style. He picks someone to kill cycle one and then focuses on them. It is a good point though and I don't have anything else to point out about it. He easily could've been testing the waters to see if people would be willing to "yeet" me for info. What a weird way to state that by the way, it's like he was expecting me to not be an elim or something. If several people responded to his comment in the positive, then he would've gone ahead and supported the info wagon on D2. No one replied to his comment however, so he dropped it. Although, you are correct it could've been a distancing technique, so why would he tell Luck that he scanned me and read me as vil? Why draw attention to me unnecessarily? Yes, I did do that, but if I'm being honest, I wasn't really convinced by your case against Vorros. I had no reason to convince you to get off of him. Your whole case was that he slipped up and tried to kill his own warder. The supposed slip up could've been real because he was a blademaster not a warder, or Forsaken/Aes Sedai. I also stated a couple of other reasons that Vorros did what he did, like fishing for warders, which if you are vil, worked in your case. I WAS THE FIRST TO VOTE ON HIM AFTER YOU. How is that resistant? The only thing that I showed resistance in is just trusting you completely, which I think is fair. Araris thought the same thing as me. I was just looking at the option that you were elim and it was false, kind of like how you are working out what might happen if I was vil this cycle. Wait, if Devo is the Forsaken and I'm Aes Sedai, how does that fit into my Bladmaster/Warder/Forsaken elim team idea? Are you saying that I'm a warder then and that I was faking it? wouldn't that be super easy to CC though? Also, Vorros specifically called me out several times N1 and D2, how does that fit into your whole idea of the e/e thing. Also, why would he ask this specifically? Why did he care if I thought you were elim? Why didn't he care about my Sart or Xino being elim? He also died voting on you D2, which may have been a further attempt to distance or not reveal his teammates. @Luckspren He tried to convince you to vote on Xino but he himself was voting for Mat? That doesn't seem like a self preservation play at all. Anywho da day... That was a freaking long post where I was essentially dissecting both of Mat's posts about me. He makes two good points that I call out, but a lot of what he says is full of holes, at least according to me. Sorry that was so long!!!

Why would I claim that before even knowing whether he did a physical action or not? Either I blocked him, I lied and hoped against hope he didn't do a physical action, or we're teamed. What I'm most concerned about is both you and Mat saying you'll do things if I flip green. Are you worried I will be vil or something? Sart's posts have a great deal of logic and reasoning behind them. I'm finding it hard to refute what he's saying. Although, I don't think that Araris is elim Sart. I would say that it is most likely Devo and Mat. They seem to be pretty well teamed. They haven't done anything explicit, but now that it is coming down to the ropes, they are really pushing hard against Sart. Hmmm, trying to make it sound like there's breathing room and while there is, wouldn't it be easier to get it right now? Why is there so much concern about me getting misexed? If your so sure, then just say so and don't say "ah well, he might be green." You might be Shining's warder but how do we know that you aren't an elim? That seems like a pretty fair balanced team to me, a Blademaster, a Forsaken, and a Warder. Assuming that Devo is the Forsaken and you are the warder, which we can't confirm now, by the way, then that adds up to how, "you couldn't save him." Did your action fail to happen, or did it not? You would know whether your action failed or if it succeeded and if it was a Warder's protection action, then you don't have a chance for it to fail so it must've been role blocked. Yes, it is a risk, but you said yourself that round three is when you are willing to make those riskier plays. Also, killing a person that people pretty much know to be a vil and then having a chance to survive, again if you are the warder, would really help people convince themselves that you can't be an elim. Anyway I slice it, I keep coming back to you Mat. I don't know what it is exactly, but I just have this feeling that you are an elim and most probably in cahoots with Devo. Thus you saying that it could be a Araris/Devo team in an attempt to distance yourself. Therefore, Mat, Devo. I still think that Devo is an elim and your teammate though. Also, @xinoehp512 This is the third turn in a row! I you just that convinced that I'm an elim or what? @Luckspren What are you're thoughts? We haven't heard from you yet!

Mat, there's always the possibility that they used a seal weave on Shining so that healing and protects wouldn't work. That's what I would've done if I was trying to kill someone that was going to be protected like Shining. Instead, I did 4 harden airs. I did one each on Sart, Xino, Devo, and Mat. No Mat, that is not why your action failed. The only one that was successful was Sart's so he couldn't have submitted the action. I'm still so sad because each weave had a 70% chance to succeed! I guess I just got really unlucky. I'm going to go ahead and clear Sart as an alim lean and put him more into my neutral Category. I am going to guess that it's either Xino or Devo, or maybe even both. Devo is really good at flying under the radar and while his D1 vote seems like he couldn't be the forsaken, Devo is pretty random so I wouldn't put it past him to make a move like that.

Hello darkness my old friend... This feels so empty.

@The Unknown Novel I believe I also voted on Vorros, unless my vote was changed!!! I do doubt that though. It would've been soon after Matt's vote. That is interesting... I think it's weird that they tried to get you to vote on Xino and claim me as village. It had to have been a last minute ploy to mess with the village, that's what I would do if I knew I was going to die. Also, everyone voted yesterday and there's no missing vote? Does that mean that there's no forsaken or am I missing something? Maybe the first missing vote was a sham created by the elims to make it seem like we had a Forsaken in the game and would thus hyperfocus on it. I would still think that there is a myrdraal though. All I said was that Wizard was my warder and didn't even offer someone else as a different option to vote for, which I would do if I was trying to get you to change your vote. If someone wants to counterclaim me, then that would be evidence against me, but Wizard was my warder, you were my only pm and I didn't feel the need to share that info with the thread yet. Also, it looked like Xino was the one that was going to get exed, why would I try to get you to stop voting on Vorros before he was even in danger? Edit: Nevermind, I just noticed that the Vorros train is missing a vote and I don't think that Xino would be the Forsaken... But who's to say?

Well, there's no denying this then. Thanks for coming out Shining. This really makes this real for me. I'll just get this out of the way now. I'm an Aes Sedai so anyone that wants to join me for a heal on Shining as a night action, I guess let me know.

Well, what did you channel? Also, @Lucksprendo you sign off on his pm action? Votes! Edit: Mat (1): Vorros Vorros (6): Mat, Conq, Shining, Luckspren, Araris, Sart

I actually agree that it doesn't make sense for you to put yourself out there if you were elim, it would've made more sense for someone who more people were neutral about or leaning slightly Elim on, like Vorros himself, but that's assuming there is someone on your possible Elim team like that. I'm willing to trust you on this, so hopefully you didn't just pull a fast one!

Why? Why does this make me look worse? Yes, both luck and Vorros defended me last time but it would be idiotic for my entire team to try and defend me in the bandwagon, so there would be at least one Elim that would be frowning on me. @Matrim's DiceAlso, just putting this out there, this could be a ploy to save Xino, who might be Matrim's teammate. Yes, he's been glaring at him but how do we not know that it is a ploy. He voted for Xino last cycle, but Xino wasn't in danger of dying in the first place. I agree with Araris, I would like to know the name of the PMer. Also, @Vorros, what actions did you take last night and on the first day cycle?

I see no reason for you to lie about that, because if you're lying then you would be the next target and I don't see the elims doing that without some kind of crazy plan. You also don't seem like the type to take that kind of risk as an Elim. Sart, Vorros