Rustbringer

@Calderis much appreciated mate, just saved a bunch of time and effort on Coppermind. At least I know now that I was right about their mindless splinters being contained there in the cognitive. Not forcibly pulled there. But thanks for educating me.

I was unaware of that chronological fact. I had assumed the shards deaths and the reod were the same event Also, simply the how of it doesnt sit right with me. That odium could simply move such an amount of power. Perhaps the cognitive realm is where they fought and died after being splintered first?

Wasn't that accomplished by the splintering of the shards that owned that power and causing the reod so the dor would be denied to the physical realm in any tangible amount? If not, how would Odium have been able to effect such a change in 2 different shards power invested heavily across the world without holding the shards themselves or sacrificing a portion of his power to do so.. I just assumed it was difficult for one shard to interfere with another. Albiet mindless and splintered it still retains its intent. Unless of course he had help(bavadin) in arranging the cognitive realm condition as well as splintering the two

I've never pondered that. Sounds like they've had their spirit web tampered with. A shard can mess with anything and hemalurgy testifies to the bizarre effects of altering a spiritweb. One can only guess at what effects such would have on something primarily of the cognitive realm. But now that you mention it, perhaps the name hints at a completely different origin altogether... They may not even be spren

That's because there's a difference between native investiture which is everywhere resultant from adonalsium creating everything and shardic investiture which is coloured by the intents of the post shattering shards investing their power into worlds or systems Id say the reason Sel is the way it is, is because the combined power of two opposing shards that were thoroughly splintered is all mixed together without a mind to channel themthe way Harmony did(ruin and preservation weren't splintered at all)or the form to work with. So it's just a volitile chaotic mess

The void spren are the equivalent of radiant spren that hail from the cognitive realm of Braize. So the Unmade are actually the equivalent to the Unique/greater spren of Roshar. The only difference being the Unmade are of Odium and for the most part willingly serve his will and intent. While the only greater spren of Honour we've seen so far is the Stormfather, a very large splinter. The others seem more inline with nature and Cultivation(the nightwatcher and the water spiral axies witnessed) and seem more localised and mundane manifestations as opposed to the Unmade going about the world like plagues

I think its fair to wager that one of the unmade is trapped within aimia.

It makes me wonder, about that little void spren that was leading the parchmen when kaladin travelled with them. Such a spren wouldn't have to try hard too manage that deceit given their nature, native abilities and let's not forget, culminated knowledge from across the desolations.

Well at least the realmatically significant part still carries. The metal is a key so it reacts with investiture in a significant way for an allomancer. I still think my theory feels right though. I dunno. I think I'll add the allomantic push and pulls are working more after the fashion of magnetism as opposed to surge gravitation.

You have me on Renarin. That never crossed my mind. I conceed

I meant simply that he certainly percieved his arm not being there and had absolutely no reason to expect it to grow back until it started to do so. The same reason the bridge four squires lost their brands(those who had them) but kept the tattoo that was over it. They saw the brands as an injury done to them. While the glyph tattoo was something they chose as a symbol of their brotherhood.

Yeah fair enough. The arm things silly. But to that effect. If you lost an arm you would only lose it in the physical realm. But just to put it out there. Lopen clearly accepted he had one arm, hence all the one armed herdazian jokes. But a missing arm is an injury to the physical body that doesn't quite match up with the spirit webs blue print. I think its that he never dwelt on it and let it upset him(also he's not exactly a normal bloke by any standards). Kaladins scars on the other hand are a different story. Kaladin would have to leave behind the darkness that afflicts him from everything hes been through. The scars have attatched themselves to the part of kaladin who thinks he's a product of his past. I'm thinking his next ideal will cover those. Possibly something about "forgiveness" if i was to make a wild guess

I was under the impression that allomancers(and other invested folk) had a bunch of investiture in them keyed to whatever shard it came from. Also that the burning of metals acts like a key to access said investiture in a certain way. We all know that metals are realmatically significant to allomancers and metal contains higher native investiture than other stuff. So id suggest that steelpush and iron pull are simply allowing the investiture in the allomancers body to interact with the investiture in the metals around them and the lines are part of it. What made me think of this was Waxs experience with the bands of mourning. Where he saw that everything was in the form of investiture. The people, the rocks... Everything. Then backing it up again I mention that he used allomancy to throw the stones that pinned him. Proving that the amount of investiture you hold is the deciding factor. Not the relative mass

It seems to me like you're forgetting the obvious. It's not about how you see yourself really. Lopens arm grew back not because he believed it should. Its because he percieved its loss as an injury, a damage to the body. Kaladins brands are yet to heal because he has accepted them into his cognitive self as a symbol of the bitterness he still holds for the wrongs done to him. Thats the difference. Healing through investiture will fix something that is perceived as wrong. Also on the soul casting an arm thought. I think maybe it'd be theoretically possible. Probably not. But isn't stormlight from gems part of soul casting? So couldn't the investiture be traded off to create flesh blood and bone from thin air and craft a compatible arm. Then use Dalinars surge of cohesion to attatch the arm to the person physically?

Id like to point out that the female radiant in dalinars vision of ancient Natanatan. Named and used the ability regrowth to heal the civilians wounds. That means she had the surge of progression. Narrowing it down to either edgedancers or truth watchers. Personally i lean toward edgedancer

Im supportive of this theory. The idea of a cognitive restriction makes sense in that because they were originally humans it stands to reason that becoming something as alien as an alien crab would be beyond them to synthesise. Note that we have only seen kandra in mammalian forms. I just remember kanpaar exibititing a strange almost nervously reluctant response to a relavant question in SoS. I think he found the idea of doing it unpleasant and probably difficult. Then again the level of transformation skill among kandra varies greatly from several hours for a human to human transition in the case of Melaan who is considered skilled and competent. To Tensoon at their peak who can shift from wolf hound to human in seconds. So maybe its possible. Theoretically possible, given the highest skill and enough practice and understanding. But doubtful

Excellent, as well as her motives, this will also bring the timeline further into focus. Another piece of the puzzle culminating towards the cosmic power struggle. That made my morning

My sincere apologies. Im not up to the etiquette with this discussion board just yet. Nor am i very computer literate tbh, but yes i now do know how and when to spoiler tag. Thanks for the explanations on your edits Voidus. Forgive my faux pas good sirs

Im thinking southern scadrians who have been stormed with. Seeing as hemalurgic spikes are going wholesale at the moment. If trell is hijacking ruins system, all sorts of nightmarish things could happen. The humans of scadrial are of both preservation and ruin.. This mystery metal however is alien to the planet. Its essence will be at odds with the natural order across all the realms.

For starters it is known that kandra cannot or should not use any spikes other than the original blessings they were awoken with. Note the chapter where its said that Tensoon willing gave up one of his own spikes in a vain hope to give the damaged Reluur a few moments clarity. He screamed for their removal. Also Melaan states that it should be impossible, though she can't explain why bleeder could. It is assumed that her ability to switch out metalborn spikes was directly linked to the unknown spike of trell. Which seemed to alter her spirit web into a so far unique but detrimental way. The influence of the spike forced her to to remove one of her blessings to free herself of harmonys control. Possibly because or the theory linking Trell to Bavadin(Autonomy) Being without one of the spikes that made her unhinged her conciousness in the same way that afflicted Reluur. That unhingedness coupled with Trells influence made her the suffering and volitle mess as seen in Shadows of Self. Also may i add the rambling testimonies and frenzied sketches depicting monsters made by reluur. This wasn't revealed in the Bands of mourning and remains an important mystery regarding trells capabilities with what i gather are his own brand of hemalurgic abominations like the koloss of the first trilogy

I wonder if maybe spook at the end of his reign had someone spike him with all the feruchemical spikes. Then stored away his identity, all of it. Quite literally forgetting himself, then somehow let kelsier take him over for a pre decided amount of time. Kelsiers identity would have added the scars to a blank physical aspect with high connection. In the same way forgery works his appearance would have changed. The bit at the end where kel tells spook they have work to do makes me wonder. Did kelsier forsee a threat so great that he needed to both empower others on scadrial and create the bands as a weapon. A ruse like that would certainly fit kelsiers MO especially the crafty quadruple redundant vault seems something he would do and be quite pleased with himself about. Also the fact that both the sovereign and spook seemingly disappeared with none actually witnessing their deaths. So chances are, spooks still walking around and up to things. Riddled with spikes but very much himself

I wonder if an object of physical manifestation can work as key into another shards investiture, filtering it into an ambiguous raw form for the user. Like a nicrosil mind without imprinted identity. Maybe even stormlight infused gems could be carried offworld to fuel surgebinding. Could it be that we're looking at it the wrong way. That instead of hacking a planets magic system with identity connection. That there is a way to purify investiture of its shards origin, then use it to fuel at least some of the other magic systems. So rather than needing an access key one could just use primal investiture. The only influence on the investitures effect would be their own connection to their own magic system. All the power would have to do 'something' if given an intent natural to the user.

Also, the knowledge that aon dors influence decreases the further one gets from Elantris. Id argue that space and distance does play a deciding role. It was made clear that while a shard invests a whole world. That shards sphere of influence is limited to where they have rooted their power in the physical realm. I.e shardpools

Then until we find out what the comparative equivalence of different shards investiture, its hard to postulate how much connection is required or if its even possible to carry a magic system without identity hacking. Stormlight seems like such a free form of investiture in the sense that it exists in a perpetual storm circling the world pouring out investiture like a sprinkler. Think of it like water in a tap. Roshar it rains, Scadrial; the metal burned are like coupons used to redeem a drink, nalthis everyones given a bottle, sel a few people are in charge of a well and the symbols inherent to its three magics is a release valve.

I stand corrected, i wrote slivers of slivers and deleted it because it didnt read right. Forgot about the splinters cheers. I was inclined towards the theory because of a surgebinders specific connection to Honor and its intent through the radiant oaths. Those oaths become part of the surgebinders identity solidifying their connection to and thru its splinters. Who knows what level of connection a radiant who has sworn all the oaths is to their spren