Could Heralds be made by Old Magic before oathpact began?

[echaozh]

Heralds all have their Honorblades and spendid power, but when they die, they go to Damnation and be tortured. We think they're tortured because it's part of the Oathpact, but could it be that they were tortured before the Oathpact? Say the torturing was the bane for the boon of Honorblades?

It's easy to think Honor handpicked the Heralds and gave them swords and power, as the swords are called Honorblades. But what if they're called Honorblades only because Honor made them? It could be forged by Honor and then given to the Heralds by Heralds by Nightwatcher as a boon. Say, they asked for power to fight a demon coming to their world. The Nightwatcher then gave them power and weapons to fight, but also made them tortured after they were killed.

Then when Honor and Cultivation wanted to trap Odium to Roshar, they thought of those souls tortured in Damnation, and gave them another chance to be alive and fight again. And the oath for the pact was not that they should be tortured, but that they should fight and win.

After some more thoughts, I think it will be very unwise to let your enemy torture your champions. What if he tried to tempt them and convert them to his side? Torturing them is not the best thing to do when you have your enemy's champions, even if you hate them so much. You should try to treat them and talk sense (or betrayal) into them. The torturing should be from the champions' side, and it is very realistic, as champions are so often deserted by the crowd and the crown if they live long enough.

Now, if it was Cultivation or Honor torturing the Heralds on Damnation, Damnation may not belong to Odium after all. There was a Tranquilline Hall, a Damnation, and roshar in the star system. The Listeners were the natives of Roshar and was the original worshipper of Honor. Humans were the natives of the Tranquilline Hall and brought Odium over. So Damnation belongs to Cultivation from the beginning! Cultivation may have been a mad scientist and say caused some greenhouse effect like disasters to happen and made her world Damnation. People hated her so much and Odium was attracted by the hatred into the star system. He got onto the only planet without a shard and later went with the humans there to Roshar, which had its own climate problems (the high storms).

[+asmodeus]

I would recommend you reread Oathbringer Chapter 38, Broken People.

You make some good logical arguments here, but we know that their getting tortured is not part of the Oathpact. It's a consequence that may or may not have been foreseen by the parties involved.

[NameIess]

8 hours ago, echaozh said:

It's easy to think Honor handpicked the Heralds and gave them swords and power, as the swords are called Honorblades. But what if they're called Honorblades only because Honor made them? It could be forged by Honor and then given to the Heralds by Heralds by Nightwatcher as a boon. Say, they asked for power to fight a demon coming to their world. The Nightwatcher then gave them power and weapons to fight, but also made them tortured after they were killed.

The reason that the Heralds asked for the Honorblades was to stop the desolation. They went to Honor and asked for the power to stop the Desolation.

8 hours ago, echaozh said:

After some more thoughts, I think it will be very unwise to let your enemy torture your champions. What if he tried to tempt them and convert them to his side? Torturing them is not the best thing to do when you have your enemy's champions, even if you hate them so much. You should try to treat them and talk sense (or betrayal) into them. The torturing should be from the champions' side, and it is very realistic, as champions are so often deserted by the crowd and the crown if they live long enough.

Honor was blinded by his power. He didn't consider that the Heralds were human, and able to break their oaths, so he never considered that they would be tortured.

8 hours ago, echaozh said:

Now, if it was Cultivation or Honor torturing the Heralds on Damnation, Damnation may not belong to Odium after all. There was a Tranquilline Hall, a Damnation, and roshar in the star system. The Listeners were the natives of Roshar and was the original worshipper of Honor. Humans were the natives of the Tranquilline Hall and brought Odium over. So Damnation belongs to Cultivation from the beginning! Cultivation may have been a mad scientist and say caused some greenhouse effect like disasters to happen and made her world Damnation. People hated her so much and Odium was attracted by the hatred into the star system. He got onto the only planet without a shard and later went with the humans there to Roshar, which had its own climate problems (the high storms).

Have you read Oathbringer? it clears all of this up.

[Honorless]

That would make it intentional sabotage on Cultivation's part against Honor and the Rosharan alliance, any would she do that?

We don't know what happened that made the humans of Ashyn plus the other races and the Dawnsingers, or Honor & Cultivation and Odium to switch sides. 

The Oathpact was between Honor and the Heralds, Odium's binding was separate according to The Stormfather 

[RShara]

The Heralds went to Honor and proposed the Oathpact, Cultivation and Odium weren't a part of it. The Honorblades are basically Splinters of Honor, given to the Heralds to help in their fight against the Fused. They only proposed the Oathpact because they couldn't fight the Fused, so the Fused existing (and Odium's arrival) has to predate the formation of the Oathpact.

The Oathpact was also based on the binding of Odium, so it had to post-date that binding. Which makes sense, since Odium doesn't Invest. He wouldn't have created the Fused and all if he hadn't already been bound.

Also, Honor and Cultivation came to Roshar together, because they were a couple. Cultivation wasn't on Braize. Odium also wasn't "on" Ashyn. He arrived there long enough to get them to destroy themselves, and then moved on to Roshar.