Did Adonalsium invest the whole Cosmere

[SzethIsBadAsHell he/him]

I was wondering today about Investment . A Shard moves to a planet , invests , and causes the Planet to be permeated with its essence . 

        So when Adonalsium was whole did They invest in the planet of Yolen . If so those people would be extremely Powerful , maybe like Hoid is the common person so to speak . I wondered if Adonalsium invested into the whole Cosmere ! 

       To me this seems more likely and would Explain why the Drominod system has a perpendicularity with no Shard ( my first theory on this was there was a Shard hiding thier) anyways . 16 powers , divided up amongst. The Cosmere . On Planets where two shards are present we see extremely powerful beings . TLR (Scadrial ) The Fused , Heralds and Radiants on Roshar , The Elantrians on Sel . On Planets with a single Shard the magic is less impressive . Taldain sandmasters are no mistborn for example . Threnodites who Shard was destroyed has little to no power.

       So this brings me back to my Original point imagine if Adonalsium invested into Yolen and Yolen only . I know there are Dragons  thier . But they still would be some Cosmic level entities or one would think . 

So I propose three Camps 

camp 1 Adonalsium did not invest anywhere 

camp 2 Adonalsium invested into the whole Cosmere

camp 3 Adonalsium invested into Yolen and all the planets in that system ! 

 

What camp amp are you in? 

[Elegy he/him]

I'm not sure about him having Invested into the whole cosmere, but it doesn't seem like he was only Invested in Yolen:

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Questioner

How many Shards have Invested their power on Roshar?

Brandon Sanderson

Technically, all of them did.

SpoCon 2013 (July 10, 2013)

He's most definitely refering to Adonalsium there.

[Weltall]

This isn't even a question. Investiture is everywhere in the Cosmere and all Investiture came from Adonalsium.

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Overlord Jebus

Is all Investiture in the cosmere associated with a Shard?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, well, okay. So this is a complicated one. *pauses* So, Investiture predates the Shattering of Adonalsium, all Investiture was from Adonalsium, all Investiture got assigned to one of the 16 Shards when Adonalsium was Shattered. Some of the Investiture was not on Yolen but location is irrelevant. So Investiture is related to Shards even on planets where none of the Shards are inhabiting.

Oathbringer London signing (Nov. 28, 2017)

And to add to what @Elegy said, we know that Adonalsium created the entire Rosharan system so everything there was heavily influenced by Adonalsium, but it's only the most obvious example. See Frost's letter to Hoid in Words of Radiance for a sign that Roshar is not unique in bearing Adonalsium's influence, even if it's the only one we know was created from the ground up.

Edited December 2, 2019 by Ookla the Nameless

[SzethIsBadAsHell he/him]

1 hour ago, Ookla the Nameless said:

This isn't even a question. Investiture is everywhere in the Cosmere and all Investiture came from Adonalsium.

Yes it is . What I’m reffering to in my question is this . When Odium first came into existence he hunted down Ambition who had settled onto Threnody and created a perpendicularity. Odium chased her thru space and finally splintered her. He then went to Sel and whacked Devotion and Dominion. They too had settled created perpendicularities . Odium did not , He them went to Roshar and was trapped on Braize by Honor . His magic permeates thier and I’m guessing the reason we haven’t seen a perpendicularity for Odium is he doesn’t want to settle . He wants to leave as soon as he is free and splintered Cultivation. 

         So I’m not sure how this works when Adonalsium was whole . Did he settle into the whole Cosmere or was it just the Yolen system . Like Brandon said himself it’s conplicated ...

  after Reading the WoB I’m leaning towards he is primarily settled on Yolen . Brandon says “ Some of the investiture was not on Yolen but location is irrelevant ...” this implies the majority of the Investiture was on Yolen , but the location of the investiture is not important as to which entity is influencing it is my quest at what he is getting at . 

        Basically what I’m saying is when shards settle certain things happen to let one know . Namely a magic system and a perpendicularity . The greater the amount of investiture., the more Powerful the system is . 

4 hours ago, Elegy said:

I'm not sure about him having Invested into the whole cosmere, but it doesn't seem like he was only Invested in Yolen:

He's most definitely refering to Adonalsium there.

I really hate how he answers questions . He could mean all of them as in ( Honor , Cultivation , and Odium ) or all of them as In all 16 when they were part of Adonalsium and created Roshar ! It’s confusing . 

[Weltall]

You do realize that literally everything in the Cosmere is made of Investiture, yes? Since it all came from Adonalsium, by definition Adonalsium 'Invested' in the entirety of the Cosmere.

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Aurimus

As the two Realms, the Cognitive and the Spiritual, are, well, fictional... Are they all comprised of Investiture, completely?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes. No, completely? Well, here's the thing. Investiture, matter, and energy are all the same thing in the cosmere. So, just like energy and matter are the same thing here. So, yes, everything's made of Investiture, in the same way that everything's made of energy in our world. Does that make sense?

Oathbringer London signing (Nov. 28, 2017)

And you seem to have ignored my earlier example that Adonalsium created the entire Rosharan system, ergo he Invested in it. First of the Sun's another world Brandon has explicitly stated to have Investiture that originated in Adonalsium, though it got assigned to Autonomy during the Shattering in the same way that a lot of the Investiture that was already on Roshar got assigned to Honor and Cultivation. In addition, the magic systems we see aren't fully created by the Shards, they're following certain 'pathways' that existed prior to the Shattering when there was only Adonalsium.

This WoB should answer a lot of your questions. Basically, the presence of one or more Shards on a world will make it easier to interact with the local magic in a more direct and powerful way, but Adonalsium's influence was quite literally everywhere.

Edited December 2, 2019 by Ookla the Nameless

[Honorless he/him]

Adonalsium's Investiture permeates the entire Cosmere. His Investiture Systems were also present throughout the Cosmere, which is what the Shards end up fueling and influencing towards their Intent. As for how Adonalsium's presence on Yolen would've affected the planet, we don't yet know

Spoiler

but Fainlife is a guess

 

[SzethIsBadAsHell he/him]

3 hours ago, Ookla the Nameless said:

You do realize that literally everything in the Cosmere is made of Investiture, yes? Since it all came from Adonalsium, by definition Adonalsium 'Invested' in the entirety of the Cosmere.

And you seem to have ignored my earlier example that Adonalsium created the entire Rosharan system, ergo he Invested in it. First of the Sun's another world Brandon has explicitly stated to have Investiture that originated in Adonalsium, though it got assigned to Autonomy during the Shattering in the same way that a lot of the Investiture that was already on Roshar got assigned to Honor and Cultivation. In addition, the magic systems we see aren't fully created by the Shards, they're following certain 'pathways' that existed prior to the Shattering when there was only Adonalsium.

This WoB should answer a lot of your questions. Basically, the presence of one or more Shards on a world will make it easier to interact with the local magic in a more direct and powerful way, but Adonalsium's influence was quite literally everywhere.

Thank you for that WoB . It gave me a general idea. But again left me utterly confused at the same time . So basically Adonalsium infused the Cosmere with Investiture . When the shards broke up they went along and found pools of investiture and modified it etc , etc . 

       Secondly the mechanics for shards and Adonalsium are completely different . Shards tend to invest in a planet , creating a perpendicularity , but can still manipulate investiture if another planet if it locates the investiture and knows it’s there. 

     Honestly that just gives me a headache . Sometimes his systems are too freaking complicated . People like what they understand. And I can’t make much of any sense out of this clusterfrack of rules he has going on 

[Elegy he/him]

The complexity and ambiguity of the world and the struggle of people to understand it are major themes in the Cosmere (which is why a lot of conflicts, in Elantris and Mistborn in particular, are solved by understanding the workings of their respective worlds), so making it all straight-forward and understandable would be dishonest to what he's trying to get across with these books, wouldn't it? Things aren't simple, whether people would prefer them to or not. Kaladin would also prefer the simple "us (humans) vs. them (listeners)" situation, but understanding that it isn't that simple is very important to his arc.

On how and why Brandon deals with complexity and ambiguity, he elaborates a lot on that here (spoilered for length):

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Questioner

In reading about Adonalsium and Odium, I get the sense that it's more related to lerasium and atium than it is to, like, Preservation or Ruin. Because, sometimes it seems like we're identifying... Odium and Adonalsium as beings instead of, like, the body of--

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah, it is a little confusing by design. The question is, like, telling the difference between the Vessel who is holding the power, the intent of that power, and the physical manifestations of that power as Investiture or as whatever, these things are confusing. And I did this on purpose. I like that blurring between them. One of the things I did when I was designing the magic for the cosmere, was-- you guys know this very easily from looking at the books, I love the ideas of quantum theory, string theory, all this stuff. And even, just looking at quantum mechanics as we understand them right now. And the further you get into the details, the more the rules that you built, everything you understand upon, become blurry. And we live in this world where certain scientific principles, like-- I was sitting at a writing group, talking to my friend who's a mathematician, and I'm like, "I really like math 'cause it is objective. One plus one equals two." And he's like, "Well, the further you get in math, the less that actually is true, and the more 'One plus one equals two' is a philosophical statement, not an actual objective truth." And we talked about the nature of, the further you dig into things--

So, I tried to build the cosmere magic-- For instance, how the Bands of Mourning work. We are getting away from Step 1, which is, "Metals push or pull." We can get that. Into Step 2, where we are building complex machines out of the interactions between the magic. And we will then get to Step 3, where it's like, we can explain the principles, but you need to be a computer engineer to understand exactly how the computer is working. And I wanted to be able to build to get to that point. With the philosophy of, "What is the power, what is the individual, what is the intent," and things like that, we're kind of going that direction, in a philosophical direction. What does it mean? What are the answers?

Humans like things to be divided and put in boxes, but in nature, these boxes are usually arbitrary, of our distinction. So, I like that aspect of our interaction with the real world. So, the answer to your question is, this is not a question for me, this is a question for philosophers. Where does the intent stop, and the being begin? And what does it mean to have a body? Is the body of the original person that has taken up the Shard, the Vessel, when that drops out when they die, is that their real body? Or is that just the power pushing out something that it absorbed and recreating it, and dropping a copy of it? What is that? What's going on there? What's it mean? How much can a Vessel influence their intent? This is all a question for philosophers, that I'm going to explore in the books, but it's not the sort of thing that you're like--

Does one plus one equal two? The answer is, one plus one equals two according to this proof that we believe explains the universe, but is a little fuzzier than you think it is.

JordanCon 2018 (April 21, 2018)

That said, I like how it's not necessary to have all these complicated distinctions sorted out to enjoy the books. It's background workings. Getting frustrated with that does not mean getting frustrated with the story. It's a bonus and that's why, in my opinion, it works.

[KandraAllomancer he/him]

All Cosmere Investiture is obviously from Adonalsium, but there seems to have been some restrictions on magic on planets other than Yolen before the Shattering:

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Pod

You’ve said that you would call Surgebinding, Voidbinding, and fabrials the three magics on Roshar. Would it be more accurate to say that Surgebinding followed and emulated fabrials and/orthe possibility of fabrials or vice versa?

Brandon Sanderson

 Vice versa. Fabrials are... generally, Surgebinders first, fabrials second. 

Pod

So you couldn’t have done fabrials when it was just Adonalsium. 

Brandon Sanderson

Oh, before the [Shattering]? *deep in thought mmming*

Pod

Would the spren have still been able to do Surges then?

Brandon Sanderson

I would say... no. No, Adonalsium probably would not have let that happen. You could theoretically do it, if Adonalsium allowed it. 

Pod

He had boundaries against it. 

Brandon Sanderson

Yes. So, I would say no. 

Starsight Release Party (Nov. 26, 2019)