Lightblood Posted January 29, 2019 Posted January 29, 2019 Okay so in all the books, you never see Kaladin feel the effects of the thrill. All the other character viewpoints you see it (dalinar especially) but why doesn't Kaladin As a youth he probably didn't feel it because Moelach was in the shattered plains rather than bothering about Amarams domain. But what about when he gets to the shattered plains? There is nothing that says that a radiant can't feel the thrill. In fact we know by shallan's experience with the heart of revel that the KR can be affected by the unmade. Your Thoughts?
RShara she/her Posted January 29, 2019 Posted January 29, 2019 (edited) Kaladin isn't ever in a situation where he would fight while Nerghaoul is on the Shattered Plains, and by the time he does get to fight, Nerghaoul has mostly moved away (toward Jah Keved). Plus, his bond with Syl protects him from that influence to a degree. Edited January 29, 2019 by RShara
Kon-Tiki he/him Posted January 29, 2019 Posted January 29, 2019 (edited) Quote Shardlet(paraphrased) In response to the RAFO I complained that I didn't even get to my third question which was, "Does Kaladin feel the Thrill? Brandon Sanderson(paraphrased) *Laughs* No he does not. Kaladin is "immune" to the Thrill. SpoCon 2013 (July 10, 2013) But also Quote LadyKnightRadiant[PENDING REVIEW] Kaladin not ever feeling the Thrill. Is there a reason for that? Brandon Sanderson[PENDING REVIEW] There is a reason for that. What do you think? LadyKnightRadiant[PENDING REVIEW] I think it's because he's too good and too pure for this world. Brandon Sanderson[PENDING REVIEW] That is, I would say... Let's just say that there are points where Kaladin could have felt the Thrill. But once he had the attention of certain nebulous spren, somebody was watching out for him. Questioner[PENDING REVIEW] That was gonna be my second. I thought "He's probably just too good for it," and then I was like, "It's probably Syl's fault." Brandon Sanderson[PENDING REVIEW] There's a bit of a war inside of Kaladin. Skyward Denver signing (Nov. 15, 2018) Make of these what you will, since they don't really say the same thing. Edited January 29, 2019 by Kon-Tiki 3
SwordNimiForPresident the sword/that sword Posted January 29, 2019 Posted January 29, 2019 Isn’t Moelach the death rattle Unmade? Nergaoul causes the Thrill. I don’t think any of the Radiants feel it throughout the books other than Dalinar. He likely only still feels it because he’s so strongly Connected to it.
Kon-Tiki he/him Posted January 29, 2019 Posted January 29, 2019 Unfortunately, Kaladin and Dalinar are really the only two Radiants we've seen who've been in a position to feel the Thrill. And yeah you're right about the name, but Nergaoul did go to Jah Keved for the civil war in Vedenar
RShara she/her Posted January 29, 2019 Posted January 29, 2019 18 minutes ago, SwordNimiForPresident said: Isn’t Moelach the death rattle Unmade? Nergaoul causes the Thrill. I don’t think any of the Radiants feel it throughout the books other than Dalinar. He likely only still feels it because he’s so strongly Connected to it. Oops, that's what I get for my first post of the day. And yeah, still, Kaladin doesn't pick up a spear again until the battle at the Tower, at which point Nerghaoul has mostly moved on. Dalinar and Adolin both notice that it was fading or gone by that point. It'd be weak enough that Kaladin's bond with Syl would protect him from it.
Weltall Posted January 29, 2019 Posted January 29, 2019 48 minutes ago, Kon-Tiki said: Make of these what you will, since they don't really say the same thing. The latter and more precise WoB is considerably newer so it's safe to assume it controls over the older blanket statement that 'he's immune' and it fits with what we see in Oathbringer where just having a Nahel Bond doesn't completely shield you from the influence of the Unmade.
SwordNimiForPresident the sword/that sword Posted January 29, 2019 Posted January 29, 2019 1 hour ago, Kon-Tiki said: Unfortunately, Kaladin and Dalinar are really the only two Radiants we've seen who've been in a position to feel the Thrill. And yeah you're right about the name, but Nergaoul did go to Jah Keved for the civil war in Vedenar I was thinking of the end of OB since they were all there. I’m still in the middle of my most recent reread, but I don’t remember any of them feeling it despite all of them being in the fight.
Kon-Tiki he/him Posted January 29, 2019 Posted January 29, 2019 At Theylan Field Nergaoul was behaving differently than normal. I think enThrilling the entire Sadeas army meant it didn't have the energy or focus for anyone else to feel it. Not even Adolin felt the Thrill at Theylan Field and we know he'd felt it before 2
CrazyRioter she/her Posted January 29, 2019 Posted January 29, 2019 I think Odium was directing Nergoaul pretty specifically at the people he wanted it aimed at during that battle. 1
Sedside she/her Posted January 30, 2019 Posted January 30, 2019 I think he is immune to the Thrill because Thrill represents bloodlust, desire to kill and destroy. Kaladin's purpose in a fight is to protect his men, not to kill enemies. 6
Rushu42 she/her Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 In Kon-Tiki's WOB, the last line really interested me. "There's a bit of a war inside Kaladin". I think that this war is between his Oaths and Honor (including Syl) and his own far more human impulses, which are vulnerable to the Thrill. We do see that Kaladin is fantastic at fighting, and his desire for vengeance is quite strong. Aside from his bond, there's no reason why he wouldn't be affected,andaffected quite strongly. Had Kaladin gone to battle after the incident with Elhokar (where he lost Syl) he probably would have felt the Thrill. He might still, if his bond with Syl begins to weaken again. I think that it's important that Kaladin doesn't feel the Thrill, for his value as a character, because he fights and kills quite a bit, but a large part of who he is is the fact that he hates it. He can feel empathy for the other side, to the point where he breaks down during the fight to reclaim Kholinar. Due to this, it's possible that Syl protects him from feeling the Thrill, not because it's universal to Windrunners, but because she knows that he wouldn't be able to handle it. Or maybe it's just universal to Windrunners, and Kaladin's characteristics are simply what attracted Syl in the first place. 2
Winds Alight she/her Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 (edited) I personally am a big fan of the "Kaladin is too good and too pure to be affected by Nergaoul" theory. Edited January 31, 2019 by Winds Alight 3
IGetLIFTed she/her Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 (edited) Kaladin was in Amaram’s army, while Nergaoul was in the Shattered Plains. While he was a bridgeman, he would have no reason to feel the Thrill as he didn’t fight. I guess he maybe could have been able to feel it while fighting as Dalinar’s bodyguard, but I don’t think he really was fighting that many people. If you think about it, the Thrill seems to arise during battle against many enemies, not fending off a few people. Not to mention, Nergaoul would have moved to Jah Keved by this time. Nergaol was definitely in Jah Keved by the time Kaladin became a full Radiant and moved to Urithiru. The only time should’ve felt the Thrill would be at the Battle for Thaylen City, where he was fighting Amaram and the Fused. In general, he just seems to have not been in the right place at the right time and doing the right thing in order to experience the Thrill, though Syl does have something to do with it as well. Edited January 31, 2019 by IGetLIFTed
IGetLIFTed she/her Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 On 1/29/2019 at 1:41 PM, SwordNimiForPresident said: I was thinking of the end of OB since they were all there. I’m still in the middle of my most recent reread, but I don’t remember any of them feeling it despite all of them being in the fight. I don’t think Nergaoul was with Kaladin at any point other than in Thaylen City. I think Nergaoul was involved in the Jah Keved succession war, and probably has much to do with that scene where Taravangian is walking through a field full of dead bodies. Dalinar also mentioned that most armies collapse after 10% losses, but the Vedens had kept fighting for an inordinately long time. The succession was happened in Words of Radiance, so by the middle of Oathbringer, Nergaoul wouldn’t still be on the Shattered Plains. The plateau runs against Parshendi were over and there was no reason to be there anymore.
Sedside she/her Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 1 hour ago, IGetLIFTed said: While he was a bridgeman, he would have no reason to feel the Thrill as he didn’t fight. He fought quite a lot at the Tower and killed tons of Parshendi there.
IGetLIFTed she/her Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 1 hour ago, Sedside said: He fought quite a lot at the Tower and killed tons of Parshendi there. That’s true, but the Thrill was fading for Dalinar by that point, which means that Nergaoul was leaving.
Sedside she/her Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 2 minutes ago, IGetLIFTed said: That’s true, but the Thrill was fading for Dalinar by that point, which means that Nergaoul was leaving. Hm, I thought, that Dalinar was struggling with the Thrill because of changes in his personality. 1
IGetLIFTed she/her Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 2 hours ago, Sedside said: Hm, I thought, that Dalinar was struggling with the Thrill because of changes in his personality. He originally thought that too, and that was probably a part of it. When he went to Jah Keved, however, he said that what he originally thought was him becoming immune to the Thrill was actually the Thrill moving away to Jah Keved, and that’s why he could feel it so strongly again.
Arch he/him Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 (edited) On 1/29/2019 at 0:15 PM, Kon-Tiki said: Unfortunately, Kaladin and Dalinar are really the only two Radiants we've seen who've been in a position to feel the Thrill. And yeah you're right about the name, but Nergaoul did go to Jah Keved for the civil war in Vedenar No Szeth felt it too at the Battle of Thaylen, but he just reacted in disgust. You could assume it's because of his shin culture and his experience with murder that caused the reaction. My theory is that certain radiant orders have a natural affinity/immunity to corresponding Unmade. Windrunners have a immunity to Nergaoul and Lightweavers have an affinity with Re-shephir. It would explain Shallan's success against Re-shephir despite her inexperiance, but being fairly ineffective when confronting Ashertmarn. it would also explain why Dalinar's bond didn't seem to protect him at all from Nergaoul and why he couldn't sense anything wrong with the Urithiru while Re-shephir controlled it's central gemstone thing. Before someone brings up Renarin sensing something wrong, I'll also add that it doesn't have to be a 1:1 correlation (wouldnt add up anyways). Just that some orders are more likely to be successful against certain Unmade than others. For example: perhaps for Skybreakers, instead of total immunity, disgust is their typical reaction to the thrill. Edited January 31, 2019 by Arch 2
Arch he/him Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 "A phantom sense called to him, a desire to continue killing, to revel in the butchery. Szeth rejected it, sick. He had never enjoyed this. He could never enjoy this." chapter 118
RShara she/her Posted January 31, 2019 Posted January 31, 2019 24 minutes ago, Arch said: No Szeth felt it too at the Battle of Thaylen, but he just reacted in disgust. You could assume it's because of his shin culture and his experience with murder that caused the reaction. My theory is that certain radiant orders have a natural affinity/immunity to corresponding Unmade. Windrunners have a immunity to Nergaoul and Lightweavers have an affinity with Re-shephir. It would explain Shallan's success against Re-shephir despite her inexperiance, but being fairly ineffective when confronting Ashertmarn. it would also explain why Dalinar's bond didn't seem to protect him at all from Nergaoul and why he couldn't sense anything wrong with the Urithiru while Re-shephir controlled it's central gemstone thing. Before someone brings up Renarin sensing something wrong, I'll also add that it doesn't have to be a 1:1 correlation (wouldnt add up anyways). Just that some orders are more likely to be successful against certain Unmade than others. For example: perhaps for Skybreakers, instead of total immunity, disgust is their typical reaction to the thrill. I think it also has to do with personalities. Some people are more inclined to feel and welcome the Thrill and others are less so. Personality, experience, Nahel bond, all figure into it, imo. Also, it's affected, not effected.
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