Willshaping Crasher Posted October 11, 2018 Posted October 11, 2018 On 10/8/2018 at 4:30 AM, Leyrann said: The chunk Preservation had removed from Ruin was the atium, so I think it's safe to assume that, in physical form, the chunk is equal to all the atium there is. Which, I would say, is quite a bit larger than Nightblood. 2 questions: 1. Do we know for sure that atium is exactly equal to the chunk removed? 2. Atium is no longer created. The amount had to be quite small after Kelsier destroyed the Pits of Hathsin. Vanishingly smaller after the final battle in HOA. How much atium do you believe is still in existance and does this energy not need an outlet? Given that the atium did not always exist as a set amount in physical form, I don't know why people cling to the need for the physical aspect to be constant.
Leyrann Posted October 11, 2018 Posted October 11, 2018 59 minutes ago, Willshaping Crasher said: 1. Do we know for sure that atium is exactly equal to the chunk removed? Occam's Razor. I see no reason to assume it isn't. 1 hour ago, Willshaping Crasher said: 2. Atium is no longer created. The amount had to be quite small after Kelsier destroyed the Pits of Hathsin. Vanishingly smaller after the final battle in HOA. How much atium do you believe is still in existance and does this energy not need an outlet? To our knowledge, the only atium still in existence is the atium owned by Marsh. As for the outlet... https://wob.coppermind.net/events/105-17th-shard-forum-qa/#e1155 Quote rags How is Harmony balanced when a part of Preservation's power is expended on human sentience? Isn't that what caused all the trouble to begin with? Brandon Sanderson Indeed. Hm... What could Sazed be doing with that extra power... To my knowledge we don't actually know. There's a bunch of theories around though.
Steeldancer he/him Posted October 11, 2018 Author Posted October 11, 2018 Quote Ironeyes So harmonium, we have a working theory that the reason it's so volatile is because some of the subatomic particles are associated with Ruin and some of them are [of?] Preservation. Is that true? Brandon Sanderson Yeah, that's basically what's going on is that it's creating a very unstable metal. Now, it is in the nature of the Cosmere not a compound but an element. But, you could call it a subatomic particle sure. It's very volatile because it is in nature spiritually in contrast with itself. And so though it is a single element rather than a compound, the spiritual nature is not happy as it is, and you can set up in the physical realm, through reactivity things that would just rip it apart and really your energy is not, your energy in that is actually pulling from the Spiritual realm, and so that's why it can be so much more explosive than even the chemistry would account for. Ironeyes So it's not that the subatomic particles are invested, it's that they have a spiritual identity which causes them to... Brandon Sanderson Yes. Ironeyes So then it's not creating an oxide because after the spiritual energy goes away from the explosion[unintelligible] metal, right? Brandon Sanderson Right, and... Ironeyes So you can't find harmonium oxide in the water afterwards. Brandon Sanderson Right right right right. Because it's not, it's, yeah. But you might be able to find something else, which is really relevant to the cosmere. And to Scadrial. Ironeyes So the core elements, the core particles, having extra repulsion causes them to have a nuclear potential. Brandon Sanderson I would not call it nuclear because it's not the same exact thing. But there is a cosmere equivalent, to... I mean, you could do nuclear power just the same in the cosmere, but since we have a third kind of state of matter, right, matter, energy, Investiture, you have a third axis that you know, you can release energy from matter, you can release investiture from matter, and things like that. So it's similar, but following its own rules that I have a little more... that are controlled by me, right. But are built on this idea. So once you add [unintelligible for a few syllables] that matter can now exist in this third state, you get all sorts of weird things, which one of the things that happens is, you can get an energy release in sort of the same way. A reaction, I'm not going to call it a nuclear reaction, but of the same vein. source Relevant WoB. It's quite possible the relevant residue is atium, due to excess Ruin. 1
Calderis he/him Posted October 11, 2018 Posted October 11, 2018 5 hours ago, Steeldancer said: Relevant WoB. It's quite possible the relevant residue is atium, due to excess Ruin. It may be similar, but it won't be atium, as there is no longer an Ati. Relevant WoBs Quote Questioner Before Preservation locked up Ruin, or whatever, or if Ruin had won. Would atium exist? Brandon Sanderson ...There are timelines where there would be no atium. Questioner ...So if Harmony exists, does atium exist? Brandon Sanderson Atium does not exist because there is no Ati. Well there is atium left over from before, but-- Questioner So it was only part of Ati's body and not part of Harmony's body. Brandon Sanderson There is no atium, there is no Preservation any longer, there is no Ati. Questioner So does harmonium exist? Brandon Sanderson ...There's no Leras and there's no Ati, there's no Ruin-- Questioner Does harmonium exist then? Brandon Sanderson Good question. source Quote Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) If Kelsier created a metal while holding Preservation that it would have acted the same as lerasium, though over time the properties of it might shift. Footnote: Unspecified question by Ted Hermansource
Steeldancer he/him Posted October 11, 2018 Author Posted October 11, 2018 3 hours ago, Calderis said: It may be similar, but it won't be atium, as there is no longer an Ati. Relevant WoBs Interesting, I hadn't heard that before. Now that's quite interesting. What would it be called? So much to consider.
Subvisual Haze Posted October 11, 2018 Posted October 11, 2018 We know splinters can be formed from a shard's destruction (this seems to be Odium's MOA for destroying other shards). It seems like it is also possible for shards to purposefully and voluntarily spin off independently operating concentrations of their power though (also called splinters). Endowment's Divine Breaths, the Honorblades from Honor, Odium's Unmade. I think they do this to delegate tasks that they otherwise couldn't directly do themselves (Endowment's meddling, the Herald's special mission, the Unmade seeming to have freer action in messing with Roshar than Odium etc.). All seem creations from the original shard, but now operating independently and possibly with different motives than the shard itself. Could Harmony be creating small splinters of concentrated ruin from himself as a way to balance out his internal preservation and ruin? If so, who has control of the power in these splinter(s)? My money is on Mr. Survivor grabbing that power, whether Harmony intended him to or not.
TrдVψLшR 0115 he/him Posted October 11, 2018 Posted October 11, 2018 (edited) 9 hours ago, Calderis said: It may be similar, but it won't be atium, as there is no longer an Ati. @Calderis Ok this has been bugging me though. Is this not just a technicality that Brandon is using to throw people off? Of course it won’t be called Atium because Ati no longer exists, but really it’s essentially the same metal w a different name. Right? I mean Ati is dead but Ruin is not. I would think that Ruin has not changed at all. Even with Sazed holding both shards he still feels a pull from each one individually Edited October 11, 2018 by PelekinikeleT 1
Calderis he/him Posted October 11, 2018 Posted October 11, 2018 2 minutes ago, PelekinikeleT said: @Calderis Ok this has been bugging me though. Is this not just a technicality that Brandon is using to throw people off? Of course it won’t be called Atium because Ati no longer exists, but really it’s essentially the same metal w a different name. Right? I mean Ati is dead but Ruin is not. It would start off essentially the same metal yes. But read lerasium WoB again. It may shift over time. Considering how differently Sazed's view of Ruin is to what Ati became, I think if a shift can happen it definitely would. 1
TrдVψLшR 0115 he/him Posted October 11, 2018 Posted October 11, 2018 @Calderis do u think that the magic will stay the same?
Calderis he/him Posted October 11, 2018 Posted October 11, 2018 2 minutes ago, PelekinikeleT said: @Calderis do u think that the magic will stay the same? Why wouldn't it? A single metal produced as the essence of a Shard is not the system. The system isn't specifically made by the Shards. It's a natural interaction between the Shards and the planet itself. Quote -snip- Kaimipono On a broader level, is hemalurgy officially dead, then? Or is it still extant in some Ruin-free (but still messy) form? (If it's gone, is there any imbalance since Preservation's magic power is kept and Ruin's isn't?) Brandon Sanderson Is Hemalurgy dead? No, not at all. It, like the other two powers, was not created by Ruin or Preservation, but by the natural state of the world and its interaction with the gods who created it. It still requires the same method of creation, but very few people are aware of how it works. source The magic system was unchanged by Rashek reshaping the world, so it should remain so after its restoration 1
TrдVψLшR 0115 he/him Posted October 12, 2018 Posted October 12, 2018 Sorry I was afk @Calderis Cool, I was actually talking about the magic of the “new atium” specifically. If it does shift over time and change slightly I wonder what ur predictions are of what it will do when someone burns it
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