Did Odium make Ryshadium?

[snote]

I only ask because there are naming similarities to Atium and Preservation's metal that I can't remember the name of currently but it has the name of the Shardholder not the name of the shard. Rayse is the holder of Odium, I understand it's not a perfect transfer of letters but it certainly has a similarity. Any thoughts?

[Mathologist]

Well, atium was created by Ati (Holder of Ruin), and lerasium was created by Leras (Holder of Preservation). I can vaguely see the connection between Ryshadium and Rayse but it is nowhere near as close as the one to one correspondence between the names of the Shardholders and the god-metals.

[snote]

You mirrored my thoughts, Mathologist. It was something that just clicked in my mind as a possibility and I wanted others input. Thanks for the reply.

[Wrath]

It's more like Aona and AonDor, but even that is a stretch.

[kaellok]

It would make more sense to me that if they're of a Shard, then the Shardholder's name would be Ryshad.  Do we know Cultivation's name?

[Wrath]

It would make more sense to me that if they're of a Shard, then the Shardholder's name would be Ryshad.  Do we know Cultivation's name?

 

We do not.

[Patrick Star]

Quoted from here: http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/6568-cultivations-real-name/

 

So this is my first Topic, so be gentle please. I found this very telling passage in Words of Radiance  

 

"The sun hadn't quite set, but in the darkening sky, stars had begun to appear around Talns Scar. The Tear hung just above the horizon, a star much brighter than the others, named for the single tear Reya was said to have shed." (Kindle Edition, pg. 362 of 1080) 

 

Since we know the names of all the Heralds, I can only surmise Reya is Cultivation's real name and that the tear she shed was when Tanavast died. 

 

Thoughts?

 

 

So, assuming that Cultivation's name is Reya, we have another possible name to have Ryshadium derived from.

 

I'm going to take a gamble that normal horses are of Odium, and Ryshadium horses invested by Cultivation.  That would explain why the name isn't quite derived from Reya and isn't quite derived from Rayse.  And it's most definitely not derived from Tanavest (Hey, I'm going to go ride my Tanavedium now).

 

Probably not true, but does somewhat explain the naming.

[Wrath]

To be honest I would have thought that if the Ryshadium were of any Shard it would be Honour, given that they are bound to a human they consider worthy.

[GreyPilgrim]

I have it in my mind that Ryshadium and all horses are not of Roshar originally, just like the humans, as their biology just doesn't fit the ecology of the planet. We have had some discussion of what the Tranquiline Halls actually are. Whatever it is, it is almost certainly not a place of Odium, so I am going to say that the Ryshadium are not of Odium.

Sort of repeating what Wrath just said, I also don't think they are of Odium because of their honorable relation to humans, and seeming relation to Surgebinders, particular Knights Radiant.

[Eejit]

 

I'm going to take a gamble that normal horses are of Odium,

 

Um, why?

[Aleksiel]

I'm going to take a gamble that normal horses are of Odium

 

Not everything Kal dislikes is evil 

[Patrick Star]

Not everything Kal dislikes is evil 

 

Shallan doesn't like them either.

 

If those two are able to agree on something, it's either really good or really evil 

[Thought]

Given that Odium's name is Rayse, it is fairly unlikely that Cultivations name would be anything similar. Basic "rule" of writing: similar names get confusion, so it is best to avoid having character names start with the same letter or sound.

 

Of course, writers have a tendency to break rules, but usually only when there is a purpose and reason behind it. Thus, if Cultivation's name is anything like Rysha, there would probably be significance in it being so close to Rayse (of course, this is also an argument that Ryshadium being similar to Rayse is intentional as well, although the difference between a horse-like-creature and a shard might be big enough on its own to render this meta-argument moot).

 

As a side note, I'd like to point out that the ryshadium also have most of "Odium"'s name in them. But to propose a connection from that to Odium might be a bit like saying that wolfsbane is a canid.

 

Now for my own baseless theory, if Ryshadium get their name from Cultivation's own name, I will thus conclude that Cultivation and Odium used to be brother and sister (hence the similar names).

[Aleksiel]

Shallan doesn't like them either.

 

If those two are able to agree on something, it's either really good or really evil 

 

Syl took the form of a horse when Kaladin rode on one, so I really doubt she would have done it if horses were somehow of Odium 

[Fifth of Daybreak]

I'd have to say it's very unlikely:

 

Adlin looked over his battalions, which held the southern flank. Just beyond them, on one of the three plateaus that surrounded their army, the Parshendi sang a horrible song. Sureblood danced, snorting

"I don't like it either," Adolin said sofly, patting the horse on the neck. That song put him on edge.

 

If Ryshadium were of Odium, they'd most likely not react this way to the song that I have to assume is of Odium. 

[snote]

First of all, wow this thread got more popular than I expected. Second, thank you all for your input. 
When I made the thread it was solely based on the naming similarities and was just something that struck me out of the blue and wanted the input of the boards. I am not convinced it's true either. Just an erant thought. Though, that doesn't mean it's impossible.

 

 

 

Quoted from here: http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/6568-cultivations-real-name/

 

 

 

So, assuming that Cultivation's name is Reya, we have another possible name to have Ryshadium derived from.

 

I'm going to take a gamble that normal horses are of Odium, and Ryshadium horses invested by Cultivation.  That would explain why the name isn't quite derived from Reya and isn't quite derived from Rayse.  And it's most definitely not derived from Tanavest (Hey, I'm going to go ride my Tanavedium now).

 

Probably not true, but does somewhat explain the naming.

 

Wow, that is a great connection. I never expected this thread to give me a possible name of Cultivation. So, super duper thanks for that.

 

 

I'd have to say it's very unlikely:

 

Adlin looked over his battalions, which held the southern flank. Just beyond them, on one of the three plateaus that surrounded their army, the Parshendi sang a horrible song. Sureblood danced, snorting

"I don't like it either," Adolin said sofly, patting the horse on the neck. That song put him on edge.

 

If Ryshadium were of Odium, they'd most likely not react this way to the song that I have to assume is of Odium. 

We don't know how the whole shardic creation plays on the individual. For instance, the Stormfather calls the Parshendi "The Ancient Ones" though they are almost certain Voidbringers or part of the collective of things that are Voidbringers. So, does that mean that they are of Odium? If so, then why do they have honorable fighting characteristics as Kaladin mentions at the end of tWoK? Then you have Eshonai and the other members of the Parshendi actively avoiding the ancient forms that bring the return of their gods. Because they fear what it will do to them. So, my point from all of this is, just because Ryshadium act a certain way when hearing a song that creates a storm, doesn't mean that they aren't of Odium. Especially when we know that song was "Old of design" meaning that Voidbringers of the past likely had the option to do it themselves, but opted not to. Also, Sureblood could have been reacting to Adolin's own emotions. Animals, even intelligent ones, have a large amount of emotional empathy towards humans. Especially when they are tamed.

[Vasteel]

I wouldn't read to much into the "dium" of Odium and Ryshadium. I'm pretty sure there is a WoB that says Odium wasn't even the original name of the shard, unless he changed ryshadium to correspond with the new name. I doubt there is a relation.

[happyman]

First of all, wow this thread got more popular than I expected. Second, thank you all for your input. 

When I made the thread it was solely based on the naming similarities and was just something that struck me out of the blue and wanted the input of the boards. I am not convinced it's true either. Just an erant thought. Though, that doesn't mean it's impossible.

 

 

Wow, that is a great connection. I never expected this thread to give me a possible name of Cultivation. So, super duper thanks for that.

 

 

We don't know how the whole shardic creation plays on the individual. For instance, the Stormfather calls the Parshendi "The Ancient Ones" though they are almost certain Voidbringers or part of the collective of things that are Voidbringers. So, does that mean that they are of Odium? If so, then why do they have honorable fighting characteristics as Kaladin mentions at the end of tWoK? Then you have Eshonai and the other members of the Parshendi actively avoiding the ancient forms that bring the return of their gods. Because they fear what it will do to them. So, my point from all of this is, just because Ryshadium act a certain way when hearing a song that creates a storm, doesn't mean that they aren't of Odium. Especially when we know that song was "Old of design" meaning that Voidbringers of the past likely had the option to do it themselves, but opted not to. Also, Sureblood could have been reacting to Adolin's own emotions. Animals, even intelligent ones, have a large amount of emotional empathy towards humans. Especially when they are tamed.

 

I am absolutely rock-solid certain that the Listeners are not of Odium.

 

The aspect of the Voidbringers that are of Odium are the Spren they have bonded.

 

My personal pet theory is that the Voidbringers are either of Adonalsium or come from even further back.

[Wrath]

I am absolutely rock-solid certain that the Listeners are not of Odium.

 

The aspect of the Voidbringers that are of Odium are the Spren they have bonded.

 

My personal pet theory is that the Voidbringers are either of Adonalsium or come from even further back.

 

There's a WoB where someone asked if the Listeners were of Honour, Cultivation or Odium. The answer was "No" for Honour and "Not originally" for Cultivation and Odium.