Sevynwarr Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 (edited) In Chapter 67 of Words of Radiance"Spit and Bile" Hoid (a.k.a. Wit) speaks with Dalinar about tyrants and what the nation needs. On page 798 continuing on to page 799 he says: "I will do what I can to help," Wit said, "and for that reason, I must go. I cannot risk too much, because if he finds me, then I become nothing--a soul shredded and broken into pieces that cannot be reassembled. What I do here is more dangerous than you could ever know." The conversation continues with Dalinar asking if who finds him, and Hoid replies "The father of hatred." Whom I assume to be Odium. Now, according to "the letter" Odium is assumed to have splinted several of the other shards. It's generally accepted that Odium can kill other people with shards by splintering them. It sounds as though Hoid fears being splintered from the above quoted comment he makes to Dalinar, but can a normal human who does not possess a shard be splintered the same as one who does? Or does Hoid have a shard too? Thoughts? Edited March 9, 2014 by Sevynwarr 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROSHtaFARian2.0 Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but Brandon has said several times that Hoid does not possess a Shard himself. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eejit Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 Which Hoid? The original, or Wit, who apparently uses his former master's name? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awesomeness Summoned Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 Unless otherwise specified, anytime Hoid is referenced it's assumed to be the current living Hoid not his former master. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eejit Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 Unless otherwise specified, anytime Hoid is referenced it's assumed to be the current living Hoid not his former master. How do we know Brandon is making the same assumption when responding to whether Hoid possesses a Shard? :conspiracy: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROSHtaFARian2.0 Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 (edited) How do we know Brandon is making the same assumption when responding to whether Hoid possesses a Shard? :conspiracy: Because of the context of how Brandon usually answers questions about Hoid bearing a Shard. Such questions often go hand in hand with questions like 'If Hoid did possess a Shard, which would he be most likely to take?' where its clear from Brandon's answers and discussion of Hoid's personality, motives, etc that he's referring to the Hoid we've come to know in the published novels. And the original Hoid died before Adonalsium was shattered, him bearing a Shard was never a real possibility. Edited March 9, 2014 by ROSHtaFARian2.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevynwarr Posted March 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 Then that would mean that Odium can do to normal people what he does to shards. Scary. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khyrindor Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 guys, maybe Hoid was Adonalsium, and died when Shattered. Now he's trying to rebuild himself. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armless writer Posted March 9, 2014 Report Share Posted March 9, 2014 He is collecting all the types of investure from different shards, but evidence points to hoid not being andolosium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnshard Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Really. What evidence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROSHtaFARian2.0 Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Really. What evidence? Tne fact that the response to Hoid's letter in WOR's epigraphs involves talking about Adonalsium as though it were a completely separate entity for one - not something you do if you're talking to Adonalsium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 (edited) Then that would mean that Odium can do to normal people what he does to shards. Scary. Seems likely that it's what he did to the Unmade. Rlain talks about those who gave themselves up to destroy the humans. It's an interesting aspect of Odium's power, to be sure. Rather terrifying, too - what's the afterlife like for someone who has their soul shredded, whether by Hemalurgy or Odium? I do hope it doesn't change, because otherwise it provides an incentive for the Cosmere-aware to commit suicide. Edited March 13, 2014 by Moogle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argent Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 Seems likely that it's what he did to the Unmade. Rlain talks about those who gave themselves up to destroy the humans. I must've missed this. It certainly does make a good case for the Unmade being Splintered souls instead of spren, though perhaps the two are not entirely different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 I must've missed this. It certainly does make a good case for the Unmade being Splintered souls instead of spren, though perhaps the two are not entirely different. I feel like I might have overstated my position. Here's the quotes: “It means our gods have returned,” Rlain whispered. “Who are your gods?” “They are the souls of those ancient. Those who gave of themselves to destroy.” A different rhythm to his words this time, slow and reverent. He looked up at Dalinar. “They hate you and your kind, sir. This new form they have given my people . . . it is something terrible. It will bring something terrible.” Our gods were born splinters of a soul, Of one who seeks to take control, Destroys all lands that he beholds, with spite. They are his spren, his gift, his price. But the nightforms speak of future life, A challenged champion . A strife even he must requite. —From the Listener Song of Secrets, final stanza My interpretation (which is not certain, though I am fairly confident) is that the Unmade were once listeners who had their souls shredded up and Splinters of Odium placed in them - a more Odious version of the Returned. The reasons seem to make sense: the Nahel spren betrayed the listeners when the humans arrived, forming Surgebinders, and so the listeners turned to Odium for vengeance. Cue Voidbringers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Observer Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 (edited) A lot of people seem to think that Hoid's endless referencing to a gemstone he once bore/was named after means he had a shard. IIRC, it's really just one of those pink crystals from Liar of Partinel. The ones nahel bonds probably came from when the magic of Yolen got all broken up. Edited for clarity. Edited March 15, 2014 by Observer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AerionBFII Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 (edited) Does he possess a Honorblade? I swear the description of Taln's blade changes between the WOK Epilogue and when Dalinar sees it. Hoid traveled with him and 'ran off' I think our dear Hoid is gathering a piece of every Shardworld magic and storing them in one of his cosmere hidey holes. Edited March 15, 2014 by WEZ313 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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