Words of Radiance Reactions (SPOILERS)

[branfordtough]

I'll probably do a longer blog post about this later, but my basic reactions after ten hours of sleep (needed them after that all-nighter):

 

• I had been hoping to see the progression of the relationship between Shallan and Jasnah throughout the book, given that the book was focused on Shallan, but Jasnah's "death" really threw a wrench into that.  That said, the loss of a protective figure in Jasnah really helped Shallan to grow in interesting directions as a person.  Also, I'm not sure if I supposed to, but I called Shallan having been the one to kill her mother as early as her first flashback chapter, so...called it?
• Kaladin's trials in this book were pretty compelling; his arc in this book seemed to be about coming to understand that his personal hatreds couldn't be allowed to conflict with the oath he took in TWOK.  Watching him drift further and further away from that oath in the latter half of the book was pretty upsetting, and I let out a definite whoop when he finally moved to protect Elhokar despite having good reason to hate him.  (Also, the "Elhokar is Dalinar's Tien" moment actually made me choke up a little.)
• Dalinar was pretty much the same person he was at the end of TWOK, so he was probably the least interesting person in this book.  That said, he still had some good moments, especially in relation to Kaladin and Shallan.
• Adolin didn't have much in the way of an arc, but the insights we got into his character were great, and oh god, that last scene with him.  That was one of the two big...not "cliffhanger" moments, not exactly.  More of an "oh, crap" moment?  Either way, I wouldn't have predicted him outright murdering Sadeas, but after the fact I could see how well Sanderson had foreshadowed that he was capable of exactly that.  I actually have a lot to say RE: what Adolin did, but it'll take a while to get my thoughts in order.
• The other "oh crap" moment, incidentally, was Jasnah turning up near Wit in the epilogue.  I have mixed feelings about that; on the one hand, I'm happy that she's alive, but on the other, I was left wishing that we had been given more reason to expect it beyond an initial gut feeling of "oh come on, she's too cool a character to kill this early on and this isn't a G. R. R. Martin novel."  I'm assuming she Soulcast a replica of her body and then Elsecalled off the ship, but I guess we'll have to wait until the next book to know more.
• Speaking of Wit/Hoid, wow he was all over this novel.  His scene during Shallan's childhood made me tear up, and overall I'm just really starting to love the guy despite still not understanding his motives.
• Sadeas came off as far too impotent for me to really care that he existed, and by the end of the novel he was more interesting as a catalyst for Adolin's hatred than as a character in his own right.  A little disappointing, since I absolutely loved him as a character in TWOK, but what can you do?
• Renarin had a strange place in the novel, and there were several moments that I just wasn't satisfied with.  His joining Bridge Four only dragged out an "oh, seriously?" reaction from me.  His showing up as the fourth Radiant in "The Four" was unsurprising, since his place in the arena fight was a big fat neon sign of +4 foreshadowing, and I was left wishing that he had gotten a few perspective segments.  Hell, even Sadeas did, and they only served as a red herring!
• Moash did not surprise me.  I mostly just feel vaguely bad for him, since he's way out of his depth.  Honestly, Kaladin, what were you thinking when you gave him those shards?  Ugh.
• I would write a lot about Zahel, but I don't think you all want to read a big love letter to the guy, which is what my writeup would end up being, so, oh well!  <3 zahel
• Szeth was pretty much crazy to begin with and the book's events only threw him even further off the deep end.  Him with Nightblood is a terrifying thought, and I can't wait for more from him. 

[Seloun]

It was very good, though parts of it make me wonder if it's trolling or it's really just that obvious...

 

It feels like most of the mechanics of the magic in the world is understood at this point (there are still plenty of mysteries, but the -big- ones are mostly answered); the major outstanding one is probably how shardplate fits into everything, since they don't seem to have the same 'dead spren' vibe the shardblades do. It feels like the questions are going to be relating to how all of the secret societies are related to one another (let's see - Gavilar, who was apparently friends with everyone, Ghostbloods, Sons of Honor, Skybreakers, the Diagram, the Shin, probably a couple of more); it's pretty amusing the everybody seems to know everyone else.

 

The key theme of the book to me was contrast. Mostly this was focused on Kaladin (likely because he's the one we know the most about at this point) and Shallan. Kaladin contrasts with Moash (pretty obvious), Szeth (also pretty obvious - but I see this in a law vs. good sort of way given the denouement) and Shallan (the scene in the chasm). Shallan's contrasts are her alternate selves and the way she generates distorted reflections of other people - in a positive way (indeed, she arguably single-handedly puts Kaladin on his right path during the chasm scene). Overall it reminds me of the theme from Mistborn about looking at what the character might have been if they'd made slightly different choices; Shallan's power is effectively the ability to bring about those alternate realities. Dalinar contrasts with Amaram (began in WoK, ends nicely with Dalinar's trick).

 

Now the trolling... the book seems so pro-Shallan/Kaladin that it almost feels like a trap. The scene where they meet the first time in the warcamp is pure classic tsundere; that scene immediately made it obvious where the relationship was going (almost too obvious...). Most of their interactions go that way, but the scene before and during the chasm are particularly notable. It's not even really a triangle; Adolin just has no clue, though he seems to have glimmers of it near the end of the book (to be fair, Shallan also seems to not have consciously noticed, but if there's one this she does really, really well, it's ignore inconvenient truths about herself). Shallan/Kaladin's relationship even has built-in pitfalls to make it more interesting (Helaran and the Cryptic vs. Honorspren angle). It also looks like Kaladin will be conveniently away for Book three so he's not there to defend himself when Shallan does learn about who actually killed Helaran - which will probably be about 5 minutes after Veil joining the Ghostbloods, if Dalinar doesn't tell her in the first chapter (I actually thought this might be deduceable from Kaladin's challenge of Amaram, but re-reading the scene, the wording is verrrrry careful...).

 

Also - how does Shallan build the storm room during the chasm scene? She only has one hand free (I think; there's a mention of her checking to see if her sleeve came undone when she wakes from her nap, but nothing else that seems to indicate whether she's wearing a glove). She's climbing with a Shardblade...A Spren (or Stormlight) Did It?

 

I was also somewhat disappointed by Chapter 7, though I understand why she had to be Put On A Bus; if she'd been around for any amount of time at the warcamps, the book probably would have been much, much shorter. This book basically let everyone else catch up to her (lampshaded pretty clearly in the ending, I'd say) so hopefully we'll be seeing more of her. It's also practically an in-universe meme that she's right about everything; I'm torn if it would be more amusing if this always proved to be true (in particular, if she's always even accidentally correct) or if it's going to come back to bite someone.

 

Kaladin's Third Ideal was somewhat disappointing, but I have sort of a headcanon that seems to explain it more satisfactorily. In particular, Kaladin's real issue is not so much about Elhokar and Moash, but about Amaram. This is because Kaladin protected Amaram - and Amaram becomes the reason Kaladin can't protect his squad. This is the real contradiction in his oaths - how can he have protected Amaram when doing so resulted in him not being able to protect his squad? If he had known what Amaram would have done, should he have protected Amaram? I think the Third Ideal says 'yes' to that question, in which case Kaladin's actions were still in Honor (a secondary headcanon bit is that this is due to the fact that the future can't be predicted, i.e. there is in fact no way that Kaladin could have known for sure what Amaram would have done, but he could be a lot surer about Amaram dying against the Shardbearer). The wording of the Ideal does make it awkward, but I pretend that the Ideal can be applied post facto (you might hate the person for something they do after you protect them - so it was 'right' at the time).

 

Overall it was really good, even if the early parts dragged a little, and some parts feel a bit too pat (it really feels like the back-end of WoK, where pretty much all of the major questions of WoK are answered). And Kaladin does carry the idiot ball for a good chunk of the book, but I primarily blame Shallan for that (she had to provide The Revelation for him). But IMO the chasm scene is among the best scenes in the book - and it probably wouldn't have had nearly the same impact without a bit of humble pie for Kaladin - so I'm willing to forgive that.

[Keeper]

wut. 

 

I just realized. 

 

 

 

 

Zahel is Vasher. 

 

 

Oh my God. 

 

Mind. Blown. 

 

(This also accounts for the rest of the book. The ending was awesome)

[Keeper]

At least, I think he is. If not then my mind is less blown. But still epic book!

[+HoidIsAwesome he/him]

I think it was an outstanding book which delivered what it promised.

Yes the start was slow and I really wished at points that Kalidin would open up to Dalinar about his powers but after reading the book its obvious that the loss of the first two Ideals was essential in the devlopment of Kaladins character and it would not have fit his character to open up until the very end of the book.

As for Jasnah's revival - could not believe it. Maybe I've read too many of the books where charavetrs who are dead stay dead but did not see her coming back. There better be a very good explanation in the next book though

And my favourite part of the book: Nightblood - possibly my favourite character in epic fantasy and he ends up with SZETH! I honestly put down the book and closed my eyes for a minute as soon as I read the Night blood voice bit.

Also I can't believe I missed V = Zahel. Clearly wasn't paying enough attentions to his scenes - should have been blatantly obvious when he says he's not heard a voice in his head as he goes sleep for years.

Also that leads to the question: what happened to Viola. Is she somewhere else on this world? Another world? Dead? I guess future books will explain.

All in all it was brilliant and I'm already looking forward to WB2 and Book 3! Might need to reread this within the next week to see if I missed anything else though

[poww10s]

Did anyone catch the bit where Hoid implied odium might be able to splinter him like a shard? Maybe he is one?

[Aminar]

I think it was an outstanding book which delivered what it promised.

Yes the start was slow and I really wished at points that Kalidin would open up to Dalinar about his powers but after reading the book its obvious that the loss of the first two Ideals was essential in the devlopment of Kaladins character and it would not have fit his character to open up until the very end of the book.

As for Jasnah's revival - could not believe it. Maybe I've read too many of the books where charavetrs who are dead stay dead but did not see her coming back. There better be a very good explanation in the next book though

And my favourite part of the book: Nightblood - possibly my favourite character in epic fantasy and he ends up with SZETH! I honestly put down the book and closed my eyes for a minute as soon as I read the Night blood voice bit.

Also I can't believe I missed V = Zahel. Clearly wasn't paying enough attentions to his scenes - should have been blatantly obvious when he says he's not heard a voice in his head as he goes sleep for years.

Also that leads to the question: what happened to Viola. Is she somewhere else on this world? Another world? Dead? I guess future books will explain.

All in all it was brilliant and I'm already looking forward to WB2 and Book 3! Might need to reread this within the next week to see if I missed anything else though

I would say it's more obvious on a reread, once you realize Nightblood is on Roshar.  Before that there is just so little reason to suspect him.  That said, I'm debating heading to the local Barnes and Nobel and putting Sticky notes on his interlude saying, "This character is secretly another character from Brandon's Novel Warbreaker.  Can you guess who?

[Keeper]

Just a wondering on jasnah's revival, did she possibly go into shadesmar for a long while to escape the ship, which is how she got all the info from the Highspren and just completely disapeared after her "death" for the entire story

[DragonReborn he/him]

I just wanted to say that I love the book. I read it really fast, so I can't wait for my reread (which is about to start now).

 

Just a couple of quick thoughts:

-Kaladin acted like a little bitch for a little too long

-Shallan is just so corny sometimes

-I really wanted Jasnah and Kaladin together

-Having said that, she should have stayed dead

 

Also, I am definitely missing out on a lot of this cosmere stuff. So I got a lot of rereading to do

[karaokeang she/her]

I do have to say that I literally yelled "Hahah, I was right!" several times during my re-read for thoughts and theories I posted here and in the Tor Glimpses thread.  

 

Re:  Kaladin - I think his extreme hatred for Amaram did take him backwards in his ideals.  I think he also was so dark because Odium was trying to corrupt him.  Based on the Eshonai's use of the storm spren, I think Odium fills you with hate and depression and surgebinders are especially susceptible.

 

More thoughts later as I digest the book.

[Tulir he/him]

This book was glorious.  I loved it immensely!  However, the first thing that popped into my head was when is this?  Basically, how long has Vasher been alive?  Hoid was shown a lot more here and I appreciated that quite a bit.

[Swimmingly he/him]

damnation. Can't believe I didn't notice V = Z.

I assumed he had been a budding Windrunner who broke his oaths. I even felt proud for "noticing" that. Facepalm.

[DragonReborn he/him]

why are you so certain V=Z ?

[Swimmingly he/him]

He has lifesense, obliquely references losing Nightblood, uses Realmatic terms for the storms, uses a lot of colour metaphors which would make sense for a Hallandren native, and Chaos said so.

[Lady Radagu she/her]

Too much reaction to put here without a serious reread. My brain has melted, but in a good way.

[Chaos he/him]

why are you so certain V=Z ?

You mean you honestly think the grumpy swordsmaster, with a rope for a belt (normal ardents don't wear those), who Kaladin can't place the age of, who speaks in color metaphors constantly, who has lifesense in his interlude (he immediately knew when Kaladin was coming), and references a choice he needs to make every day to keep living... you think that guy isn't Vasher? And, you know, that he expected to hear a voice in his head, but of course hadn't heard one for years.

Go read his introduction (it's the chapter titled Swordsmaster) and his interlude again. Totally Vasher.

[Colby Jack he/him]

Basically, I hunkered down in a bookstore and skimmed the book as fast as I can, but I have to say, I feel a bit underwhelmed. I also think the dialogue in the book needs more editing, but it's all good.

 

 

EDIT: Hm, will you look at that down-votes.

I supposed I deserve it for saying what I said. I'd expand on my review, only I still don't have my copy of the book yet, so my reread hadn't happen yet. I guess I'll stick to my original assessment. However, this might just shy me from any more criticisms from now on.

Edited March 7, 2014 by Colby Jack

[Upas]

My favorite non-combat scene by far was Shallan and Kaladin spilling their guts to each other in the chasm. Kaladin really needed that to bring him off his path of being a lil' bitch. 

[Tortellini]

You mean you honestly think the grumpy swordsmaster, with a rope for a belt (normal ardents don't wear those), who Kaladin can't place the age of, who speaks in color metaphors constantly, who has lifesense in his interlude (he immediately knew when Kaladin was coming), and references a choice he needs to make every day to keep living... you think that guy isn't Vasher? And, you know, that he expected to hear a voice in his head, but of course hadn't heard one for years.

Go read his introduction (it's the chapter titled Swordsmaster) and his interlude again. Totally Vasher.

 

Yes, seeing everything explained it's very obvious - with this much detail it wouldn't be a fakeout any more I think. But I totally didn't see it, I thought it was one of the Heralds and felt clever about it!

[Moogle]

A great book.

 

I have very little I can react to, except to say that the entire book was not as I anticipated. In basically any way. Tons of surprises.

 

Also, thank you Adolin. You are the most heroic man on Roshar for saving us from him. And without much drama, either. It was perfect.

 

(Jasnah remains the best too.)

Edited March 5, 2014 by Moogle

[Cortez he/him]

I really enjoyed this book, it managed to live up to and even exceed my expectations, something which I was concerned about before reading. Would this book be as good as I wanted it to be? So many fantasy books recently have failed to live up to my high expectations (based on their previous works), that it was extremely refreshing that Brandon Sanderson managed to deliver.

 

Kaladins character was interesting for me. He needed to work out his 'Lighteyes' issues and I thought this was done well. I loved the way his hatred and distrust of all lighteyes conflicted with his Radiant oaths and the fact that his inability to reconcile these differences nearly cost him everything.

 

I loved the way Shallans character developed throughout the story. The way she became more confident and extroverted as she developed her skills through spying and infiltration. I liked her interaction with Pattern and the way the spren made her face the truths about herself rather than the lies she presented to the world. Her flashbacks were interesting although not really surprising as I'd figured out much of it already, although I was wrong about her Shardblade killing her father, I had figured out the rest of it from the sneak peaks and readings BS gave us. Her courtship with Adolin was well handled although I'm not happy with the love triangle thing with Kaladin, it was far too obvious for me and too much along the lines of a standard fantasy plot to really work.

 

Jasnah's 'resurrection' was initially a surprise, although it really shouldn't have been. On my second read-through it was obvious that she wasn't dead. Golden rule of fantasy for me is usually if you don't see a corpse you can't be sure they're dead. Unfortunately on my first read-through I missed the fact that Jasnah's body had vanished from her cabin. Shallan really should have been suspicious of that too.

 

For me though the thing that really made this story was the sheer number of different factions that are now active within the story. In addition to the Ghostbloods, Taravangian, and Kholin/neo-radiant factions we also have the Skybreakers (led by Nalan) and the descendants of the Voirin hierocracy, not to mention the voidbringers/unmade. What really makes this great is that its hard to see which side some of the various groups are on. The Ghostbloods were opposed to Amarams new hierocracy faction, who want to bring back the desolations (in order to restore church power), yet were also opposed to Jasnah, who wanted to prevent the desolations? Add to that the fact that Shallan is tied to two different (and possibly opposing groups) and the potential for exciting intrigue and betrayal in the next book is huge. There are also the wildacrds who must be taken into account, a lot more information is given about Hoid and some hints as to his nature, but what really blew my mind is that both Vasher and Nighblood are active on Roshar and not together either!

 

In short this book was, for me, amazing. The only problem is... How long until book three?

[Daveron]

So I've been a long time stalker on this forum , and I have to say the amount of stuff that was guessed correctly absolutely astounds me. Needless to say I absolutely loved this book, but since it's 7am and I haven't slept yet I'll save more thoughts on how fantastic this book until after I've slept for most of today

Edited March 5, 2014 by Daveron

[Aminar]

I really enjoyed this book, it managed to live up to and even exceed my expectations, something which I was concerned about before reading. Would this book be as good as I wanted it to be? So many fantasy books recently have failed to live up to my high expectations (based on their previous works), that it was extremely refreshing that Brandon Sanderson managed to deliver.

 

Kaladins character was interesting for me. He needed to work out his 'Lighteyes' issues and I thought this was done well. I loved the way his hatred and distrust of all lighteyes conflicted with his Radiant oaths and the fact that his inability to reconcile these differences nearly cost him everything.

 

I loved the way Shallans character developed throughout the story. The way she became more confident and extroverted as she developed her skills through spying and infiltration. I liked her interaction with Pattern and the way the spren made her face the truths about herself rather than the lies she presented to the world. Her flashbacks were interesting although not really surprising as I'd figured out much of it already, although I was wrong about her Shardblade killing her father, I had figured out the rest of it from the sneak peaks and readings BS gave us. Her courtship with Adolin was well handled although I'm not happy with the love triangle thing with Kaladin, it was far too obvious for me and too much along the lines of a standard fantasy plot to really work.

 

Jasnah's 'resurrection' was initially a surprise, although it really shouldn't have been. On my second read-through it was obvious that she wasn't dead. Golden rule of fantasy for me is usually if you don't see a corpse you can't be sure they're dead. Unfortunately on my first read-through I missed the fact that Jasnah's body had vanished from her cabin. Shallan really should have been suspicious of that too.

 

For me though the thing that really made this story was the sheer number of different factions that are now active within the story. In addition to the Ghostbloods, Taravangian, and Kholin/neo-radiant factions we also have the Skybreakers (led by Nalan) and the descendants of the Voirin hierocracy, not to mention the voidbringers/unmade. What really makes this great is that its hard to see which side some of the various groups are on. The Ghostbloods were opposed to Amarams new hierocracy faction, who want to bring back the desolations (in order to restore church power), yet were also opposed to Jasnah, who wanted to prevent the desolations? Add to that the fact that Shallan is tied to two different (and possibly opposing groups) and the potential for exciting intrigue and betrayal in the next book is huge. There are also the wildacrds who must be taken into account, a lot more information is given about Hoid and some hints as to his nature, but what really blew my mind is that both Vasher and Nighblood are active on Roshar and not together either!

 

In short this book was, for me, amazing. The only problem is... How long until book three?

And then there's the fact Gavilar was part of Amaram's faction. Gavilar was evil... And Holy crap, going to post this in the Venli topic.

[+Aletus he/him]

You all have touched on the big reactions over and over again, but one that caught me off guard was when Shallan was with Tvalkav and the rest, the discussion she has with pattern about the table sounds creepily similar to forgery.

[FeatherWriter she/her]

Okay, because I worked very hard on these and I'm selfish and self-promoing... Y'all should check the Shardcast page, because my audio reactions to each chapter are starting to be released! There's a thread over in the Shardcast forum for discussing it!