[OB] Kaladin's going to summon a highstorm

[What's a Seawolf?]

He just showed off advanced Adhesion (finally!) and one day he's going to be able to make a Highstorm.

Bear with me for a second.

There have been some discussion about Voidforms and how they mimic KR forms.  I was against this theory at first (as recently as minutes ago,) in part because we had no equivalent Stormform KR equivalent.

But we do.

What is Adhesion?  The surge of pressure and vacuum.  That sounds exactly like what Kal did in the latest Oathbringer chapter at the end of part 1, using pressure and vacuum to create a pocket that resisted the storm.  And what happens when there's enough pressure and vacuum (with gravitation thrown in for good measure?)  Weather.  Storms.

Now can Kal by himself summon a storm?  He's just one guy.

But Windrunners have a stormton of squires.

(And Kal did claim the skies, after all.)

One additional point.  The Adhesion+Gravitation combo for summoning Highstorms is not necessarily dependent on Voidforms having KR equivalents, but just to point out, the voidform that took to the skies at end of part 1 to chase Kal could very easily have been the Skybreaker voidform equivalent, leaving Stormform to match Windrunners.

[Leyrann]

Huh.

I like this theory. A lot. Doubt just a bunch of squires would be enough, but hey, there's probably gonna be more Windrunners later on. We've got a 15 year gap after all.

[Darvys]

About that scene, wasn't it odd that Syl didn't know what he did ? She always seemed to be one step ahead of him when it comes to knowledge of what they can do, but not now. 

Anyway, really looking forward to the reveal of his full skillset, and the epic displays Brandon has in store for us.

[duladen]

I love this idea. I can picture the KR determining where the enemy is located and the Windrunners summoning a Highstorm, barreling down on the forces of Odium like the cavalry.

[Head Crabs]

I dont know if the windrunners would have this power. It seems too destructive for their temperment. Let's say it is possible for a group of windrunners plus all their squires to summon a highstorm and ride it around to get to battles or whatnot. How many people would be caught out in that unexpected storm? Over a longer period of time these additional highstorms would also increase the rate of deterioration to towns and homes as well. Possibly even affecting crops, crem build up and probably a dozen other natural processes i cant think of right now. 

 

Too much death and destruction would come about if this were true and the windrunners used it as a rosharan taxi. 

[Steeldancer]

Could he create a low enough pressure area to create a storm? 

[Leyrann]

9 minutes ago, Head Crabs said:

I dont know if the windrunners would have this power. It seems too destructive for their temperment. Let's say it is possible for a group of windrunners plus all their squires to summon a highstorm and ride it around to get to battles or whatnot. How many people would be caught out in that unexpected storm? Over a longer period of time these additional highstorms would also increase the rate of deterioration to towns and homes as well. Possibly even affecting crops, crem build up and probably a dozen other natural processes i cant think of right now. 

He can probably direct the storm like he did here though, so it'd be a localized highstorm.

[Starla]

11 minutes ago, Leyrann said:

He can probably direct the storm like he did here though, so it'd be a localized highstorm.

That's what I was thinking. A mini-storm, or maybe a tornado to strike at a very specific target, like a thunderclast.

[jefftucker0525]

Personally I had a different take on that scene. A bunch of windspren gathered around him and the description instantly made me think "shardplate!!!" And while it would make a lot of sense for it to be a display of the adhesion surge, I thought that the 3 surges were all the Windrunners had, one being pure gravitation, one being adhesion, and one being a mixture of the two (basic lashing, full lashing, and half lashing. Might have that last one wrong) but anyways, my point is this. He used windspren to form a pocket of impenetrable defense. To me, that's the beginning of shardplate, which also would explain why Syl didn't understand it, which she probably would if it was the display of a surge.

[jefftucker0525]

And I might add that, while we're have a WoB saying that we won't see shardplate in OB, this could be him finally giving us a solid clue on where shardplate comes from.

[Leyrann]

5 minutes ago, jefftucker0525 said:

Personally I had a different take on that scene. A bunch of windspren gathered around him and the description instantly made me think "shardplate!!!" And while it would make a lot of sense for it to be a display of the adhesion surge, I thought that the 3 surges were all the Windrunners had, one being pure gravitation, one being adhesion, and one being a mixture of the two (basic lashing, full lashing, and half lashing. Might have that last one wrong) but anyways, my point is this. He used windspren to form a pocket of impenetrable defense. To me, that's the beginning of shardplate, which also would explain why Syl didn't understand it, which she probably would if it was the display of a surge.

There's basic lashing (stuff used for flying; gravitation), full lashing (sticking something to something else; adhesion) and reverse lashing (pulling stuff to an object or (probably) away from it; gravitation). No mixed stuff.

[What's a Seawolf?]

12 minutes ago, jefftucker0525 said:

Personally I had a different take on that scene. A bunch of windspren gathered around him and the description instantly made me think "shardplate!!!" And while it would make a lot of sense for it to be a display of the adhesion surge, I thought that the 3 surges were all the Windrunners had, one being pure gravitation, one being adhesion, and one being a mixture of the two (basic lashing, full lashing, and half lashing. Might have that last one wrong) but anyways, my point is this. He used windspren to form a pocket of impenetrable defense. To me, that's the beginning of shardplate, which also would explain why Syl didn't understand it, which she probably would if it was the display of a surge.

My initial reaction was shardplate too, but in the context of the scene it doesn't make much sense.  (Plus, Brandon can be a bit of a troll sometimes.)

Shardplate would protect Kal, but not create the bubble of protection that Kal created.

Adhesion has seemed grossly underpowered compared to the other surges we know about, and Kal's display of power being a result of Adhesion would go a long way to putting that surge back on a level playing field.

[jefftucker0525]

Good point.... I'm still gonna hope I'm right though lol

[dvoraen]

I think this is likely, a Windrunner calling a storm, but I also think it'll take a little something extra: Dalinar.  More precisely, the Bondsmith attached to the Stormfather.

 

Syl flat out said that he's "supposed to harness the storm", so it only stands that ordering one direct delivery might need a little more to it than that.

Edited November 7, 2017 by dvoraen

[Harbour]

I dont know will this happen but that would be an absolutely epic scene written by Brandon. Just imagine Kaladin controlling the storms like a total badass. 

[Salkara]

44 minutes ago, jefftucker0525 said:

And I might add that, while we're have a WoB saying that we won't see shardplate in OB, this could be him finally giving us a solid clue on where shardplate comes from.

I don't remember this WoB. Do you have a link?

[ChazBolt]

3 hours ago, What's a Seawolf? said:

There have been some discussion about Voidforms and how they mimic KR forms.  I was against this theory at first (as recently as minutes ago,) in part because we had no equivalent Stormform KR equivalent.

....

One additional point.  The Adhesion+Gravitation combo for summoning Highstorms is not necessarily dependent on Voidforms having KR equivalents, but just to point out, the voidform that took to the skies at end of part 1 to chase Kal could very easily have been the Skybreaker voidform equivalent, leaving Stormform to match Windrunners.

So first, i did like that theory and im glad its kinda been supported now.

Second, i like your idea that what chased Kal was the VB Skybreaker, not Stormform.

Third, i dont think he will be able summon highstorms. Too destructive, like @Head Crabs said. However, i do think this will expand into larger control of storms and redirection of them. 

[The alertArchitect]

Interesting theory - but personally, I think that if Windrunners could create a storm (I’m saying ‘could’ simply because I use that for everything that’s not directly stated in a book or confirmed by WoB), it wouldn’t be a highstorm. I say this because that would require the Windrunners to produce a new source of investiture on Roshar. Move the existing highstorm around? Maybe. Make a new source of investiture with existing investiture? I’m a bit skeptical. I think that if this theory is true, then the reason that the Stormform Listeners could summon the everstorm is because it’s Odium’s version of the highstorm - his manifestation of investiture on Roshar, in contrast to the highstorm being Honor’s, meaning that it’s summoning/creation couldn’t be replicated, but the Stormform Listeners could probably make normal storms, as could the Windrunners, their presumed KR counterparts. 

[jefftucker0525]

1 hour ago, Salkara said:

I don't remember this WoB. Do you have a link?

I don't, I saw it on the forums the other day. And I'm horrible at finding them or I'd try, sorry.

Edited November 7, 2017 by jefftucker0525

[Bernem]

2 hours ago, Salkara said:

I don't remember this WoB. Do you have a link?

Here ya go!

Quote

INTERVIEW: Jan 7th, 2015
Central Library, Seattle, WA (Paraphrased)

Question
Will we find out soon where Shardplate comes from?

 

BRANDON SANDERSON

You will eventually, but it is not the next book.

 

Edited November 7, 2017 by Bernem

[Salkara]

1 minute ago, Bernem said:

Here ya go!

Almost 3 years old! I'll keep my hopes up, even though I now think I probably shouldn't.

[Frostlander]

7 hours ago, What's a Seawolf? said:

Adhesion has seemed grossly underpowered compared to the other surges we know about, and Kal's display of power being a result of Adhesion would go a long way to putting that surge back on a level playing field.

As much fun as it was sticking Lopen and other sundry objects to the wall, I agree that Adhesion needs some more power. Maybe Brandon was holding off on it until we got to the Bondsmith book so he wouldn't give too much away about the surge. We also haven't seen much of an order using both surges much. Although we've seen a lot of Shallan's Illumination, she can barely Transform. We've really only seen surface level explorations for most of the other surgebinding characters. Can't wait to see someone with two full surges!

[Divided by Zero]

I think it's a fair theory that Kal is at least developing some kind of skill which will involve manipulating of highstorms/bargaining with the Stormfather. 

This falls into line with the Parshendi in Stormform summoning an Everstorm and the general concept that Stormform may be the voided version of Windrunner.

[IntentAwesome]

11 hours ago, What's a Seawolf? said:

Adhesion has seemed grossly underpowered compared to the other surges we know about, and Kal's display of power being a result of Adhesion would go a long way to putting that surge back on a level playing field.

I agree. Most orders seems to have two vastly different powers. Light weaving  and soul casting are two different things that can be used in different ways. What we have seen Kaladin do so far can mostly be summed up as manipulating how objects move (or don’t move). I’m hoping to see more out of windrunner powers. 

2 hours ago, Divided by Zero said:

I think it's a fair theory that Kal is at least developing some kind of skill which will involve manipulating of highstorms/bargaining with the Stormfather. 

This falls into line with the Parshendi in Stormform summoning an Everstorm and the general concept that Stormform may be the voided version of Windrunner.

Syl seems to agree that windrunners have some power over the storms. From WoK, “Kaladin, you’ve heard the stories. Men who walked on walls, men who bound the storms to them.”

I don’t think they can summon a high storm. But maybe they can pull one along with them, so they have a constant supply of stormlight. 

[Elena]

7 hours ago, Divided by Zero said:

I think it's a fair theory that Kal is at least developing some kind of skill which will involve manipulating of highstorms/bargaining with the Stormfather. 

This falls into line with the Parshendi in Stormform summoning an Everstorm and the general concept that Stormform may be the voided version of Windrunner.

I tend to agree morr with @IntentAwesome  (not summoning, but maybe 'calling' the existing Highstorm) but have a welcome upvote! Your username rocks