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Returned breaking?


Cel

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Feel free to correct me on any of this (I am probably totally wrong):

So, in Nalthis (specifically Hallandren) people who die in particularly notable (that's not the right word, but you know what I mean) ways return, but with Returned powers. Also in Scadrial and Roshar, Allomancers and Radiants (respectively) have to snap/break. With an Allomancer, the ability was already there waiting to be brought out. With a Radiant, I think (maybe wrong) that they always had a spren, but the breaking made the Surgebinding ability show up. Maybe, the Returned's Divine Breath was in them the whole time, but their "breaking" brought it out! That would mean that the Splinter of Endowment had been there the whole time.

 

 

 

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This would, in essence, mean that everyone on Nalthis is bonded with a dormant Splinter of Endowment(as Endowment can likely give the choice to anyone she wants). I highly doubt that this is the case, as that would spread Endowment's Investiture even thinner than it already is.

The fact that Endowment appears before them and gives them the choice of whether or not to Return feels like further evidence against this, as she could easily give them the Divine Breath when they choose to Return.

Snapping is universal to the Cosmere, and applies to magic systems. Breath seems to be like Hemalurgy, where it carries the breaking with it(somehow), as everyone who is given breath can awaken.

26 minutes ago, Kaladinwillumarryme? said:

With a Radiant, I think (maybe wrong) that they always had a spren, but the breaking made the Surgebinding ability show up.

The Spren are looking for the snap, so they have to come after.

Quote

Question

So there’s Snapping on Scadrial, where an event happens and then you can use the magic. Is there something like Snapping on Roshar, where

Brandon Sanderson

Yes and no. They’re working under the same sort of assumption, the Spren are just looking for a specific thing that is similar to what Snapping does.

 


Edit: Scratch most of that, I found a WoB.

26 minutes ago, Kaladinwillumarryme? said:

Maybe, the Returned's Divine Breath was in them the whole time, but their "breaking" brought it out! That would mean that the Splinter of Endowment had been there the whole time.

The superpowered breath comes down after they die.

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ReaderAt2046

What would happen if, right after someone died, they were made into a Lifeless, and then Endowment tried to Return that person?

Brandon Sanderson

Oooh...now that's a spicy one. Endowment's gift of a superpowered Breath would come down, strike the Lifeless, and all kinds of craziness would occur. You'd end up with a drab god, which would be hilarious.
Edited by The One Who Connects
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Just now, Kaladinwillumarryme? said:

Thank you for the correction. But don't you think that it is similar to snapping/breaking?

I don't think it's that similar, but we don't know enough about snapping for me to say with any real authority beyond my opinion.

A good question to ask Brandon is if Lightsong or the other Returned would have been able to become a Radiant had they survived their Return-worthy act. That could settle it pretty definitively.

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While I personally don't think it is snapping, due to Endowments direct involvement, it is possible. 

Endowment may have set the threshold for snapping on Nalthis ridiculously high, and offers a Divine Breath to anyone who surpasses it. 

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Well it is hinted that bravery somehow is related to becoming a Returned (I know babies are the complication here). Perhaps there is some kind of break that happens when someone makes a large moral decision and this mini-break lets Endowment in for a brief period of time (which is why the people return after an IMMEDIATE brave death, not a death 2 years after something brave)

 

 

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As far as we know, only end-positive Investiture needs a Snapping mechanism. Therefore there is no Snapping required to Awaken.

45 minutes ago, The One Who Connects said:

A good question to ask Brandon is if Lightsong or the other Returned would have been able to become a Radiant had they survived their Return-worthy act. That could settle it pretty definitively.

Well, near-death events are enough trauma to Snap people into Allomancers. So it would probably work for Radiancy too.

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24 minutes ago, Oversleep said:

As far as we know, only end-positive Investiture needs a Snapping mechanism. Therefore there is no Snapping required to Awaken.

Well, near-death events are enough trauma to Snap people into Allomancers. So it would probably work for Radiancy too.

So I've been misinterpreting the "universal to the Cosmere" WoB? I guess since it is paraphrased...

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Jeremy

We know that Mistborn needed to Snap, and Surgebinders needed have the cracks in their souls filled. But what about the people in Warbreaker or Elantris? Is cracking and snapping only required on certain worlds?

Brandon Sanderson (Paraphrased)

This is universal to the cosmere; however, in certain magic systems / on certain worlds, this is easier than others.

Regarding near death trauma, you make a very good point that I feel dumb for not considering.

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Snapping is a mechanism that allows Investiture from external source pour into a person; in order to do that the soul must be cracked somehow. Enter the Snapping.

There is no external source of Investiture in Awakening or Feruchemy so it does not need spirit to be broken.

In Hemalurgy the Investiture is lost as the spike decays so it's not related to the user in any way.

Edited by Oversleep
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