Gaz's Relationship with Kaladin

[wildbuc117 he/him]

I have the distinct feeling, though no evidence for those who have read all stormlight archive books so far, that Gaz is someone who knows Kaladin from Hearthstone.  The only, but little, evidence I have for this is Gaz calling Kaladin "Lordling".  Specifically I think he might be Jam (maybe one of the 3 unnamed boys that joined Amaram in chapter 44).  Has anyone asked this to Mr. Sanderson before? I didn't see it in https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gewMTmQ_czOrgwh20XX3oqk9jc179qXOHvjD1wv6ujs/edit#heading=h.6miu56tz7bru 

[Calderis he/him]

Hearthstone wasn't incredibly small, but I don't think it was large enough that Kaladin would fail to recognize someone from his childhood. He's only been away from Hearthstone for what, 4 years? 

[Gizmosowner he/him]

I think gas just called kaladin lordling because he was acting arrogant for his station as a bridge man. It's been a few months though so I'm unsure

Edited May 26, 2017 by Gizmosowner

[Ciridae]

Kaladin sounds very much like a lighteyed name, so that may be part of the reason, but I can't remember if Gaz already knew Kaladin's name when he started calling him lordling. 

[CaptainRyan he/him]

1 hour ago, wildbuc117 said:

I have the distinct feeling, though no evidence for those who have read all stormlight archive books so far, that Gaz is someone who knows Kaladin from Hearthstone.  The only, but little, evidence I have for this is Gaz calling Kaladin "Lordling".  Specifically I think he might be Jam (maybe one of the 3 unnamed boys that joined Amaram in chapter 44).  Has anyone asked this to Mr. Sanderson before? I didn't see it in https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gewMTmQ_czOrgwh20XX3oqk9jc179qXOHvjD1wv6ujs/edit#heading=h.6miu56tz7bru 

Nice catch! I am doing a re-listen to WoK right now and I noticed that both Gaz and some of the kids from Kaladin's flashbacks use that insult. I did not make the connection that Gaz, therefore, might be from Hearthstone. I just assumed that Kaladin would recognize someone from his home buuuuttttt, it has been 4 or 5 years since Kaladin was in Hearthstone and Gaz has definitely suffered some scars/loss of an eye that might make him unrecognizable enough. That being said, Gaz did try to have Kaladin killed from minute one (sending Kaladin to Bridge 4 with no shoes/padded vest) so I would hope that if Gaz really was from Hearthstone then Brandon would have done a better job of foreshadowing it than a single insult.

[wildbuc117 he/him]

15 minutes ago, CaptainRyan said:

Nice catch! I am doing a re-listen to WoK right now and I noticed that both Gaz and some of the kids from Kaladin's flashbacks use that insult. I did not make the connection that Gaz, therefore, might be from Hearthstone. I just assumed that Kaladin would recognize someone from his home buuuuttttt, it has been 4 or 5 years since Kaladin was in Hearthstone and Gaz has definitely suffered some scars/loss of an eye that might make him unrecognizable enough. That being said, Gaz did try to have Kaladin killed from minute one (sending Kaladin to Bridge 4 with no shoes/padded vest) so I would hope that if Gaz really was from Hearthstone then Brandon would have done a better job of foreshadowing it than a single insult.

That was kinda my thinking.  Gaz really does take a disliking to him from the get go, and considering how Gaz is later on... it doesn't really fit his personality unless he had a previous grudge against Kaladin or someone whom Kaladin reminded him of.  Plus 4 years of Kaladin being at war plus the entire slave year I feel like would likely have Kaladin not remembering those from his childhood who held a grudge against him, but those kids who held a grudge against Kaladin for his "easy" lifestyle of eating fruits all day...  especially the "lordling" that surmounted everyone else who joined Amaram's army plus killing a shardblade holder...  

[The One Who Connects he/him]

2 hours ago, wildbuc117 said:

I didn't see it in https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gewMTmQ_czOrgwh20XX3oqk9jc179qXOHvjD1wv6ujs/edit#heading=h.6miu56tz7bru 

I actually don't think anyone's brought this up before, but I will also say that the fact that it isn't in the google Doc doesn't mean too much. The thread that the doc is cataloging is 128+ pages, so there is all manner of questions that get lost to the ether of "30 pages ago"

[Calderis he/him]

Without some reason to hate Kaladin, some very personal reason, I feel like most people would see someone who reminds them of home, even someone they disliked, and feel protective of them. They would become a symbol of life back home. 

The lack of recognition on Kaladin's part, and the circumstances that Gaz called him "Lordling" in... I just don't see this as anything beyond a horribly callus and jaded man, taking out his aggression on men he thinks are already dead anyway. 

Edited May 27, 2017 by Calderis

[wildbuc117 he/him]

10 minutes ago, Calderis said:

Without some reason to hate Kaladin, some very personal reason, I feel like most people would see someone who reminds them of home, even someone they disliked, and feel protective of them. They would become a symbol of life back home. 

The lack of recognition on Kaladin's part, and the circumstances that Gaza called him "Lordling" in... I just don't see this as anything beyond a horribly callus and jaded man, taking out his aggression on men he thinks are already dead anyway. 

You make a very solid point.  I've been pulling a Dalinar and am on my 10th listening of WOK right now and there is a high likelihood of me just trying to find connections that don't really exist but that I want to because there are SO MANY!  (as an aside why does "so many" capitalized look wrong?) 

[maxal she/her]

1 hour ago, Calderis said:

Without some reason to hate Kaladin, some very personal reason, I feel like most people would see someone who reminds them of home, even someone they disliked, and feel protective of them. They would become a symbol of life back home. 

The lack of recognition on Kaladin's part, and the circumstances that Gaz called him "Lordling" in... I just don't see this as anything beyond a horribly callus and jaded man, taking out his aggression on men he thinks are already dead anyway. 

I am agreeing with this. Kaladin's entitled superior arrogant attitude was enough to justify him getting on the bad side of Gaz. We also have to consider later perspectives on Gaz highlights a man having money issues (we do not know why) who's job's description was starting to wear thin on him. In shorts, I doubt Gaz enjoyed overseeing the bridgemen. He knew he would most probably never get any advancement and he was likely getting crap from basically everyone else within the army. It wouldn't be surprising if his reasons for being so callus merely were because those sad slaves were the only individuals he had any superiority over. He likely felt both satisfied and yet horrified at seeing at least he wasn't running the bridges, so when one shows attitude, it unnerves him.

I am not reading more into it than needs be: not everyone can be distant relatives.

[wildbuc117 he/him]

13 hours ago, maxal said:

I am not reading more into it than needs be: not everyone can be distant relatives.

But but but.... you're acting like there is an entire world, or 3 worlds, or cosmere, or something  .

Edited May 27, 2017 by wildbuc117

[maxal she/her]

47 minutes ago, wildbuc117 said:

But but but.... you're acting like there is an entire world, or 3 worlds, or cosmere, or something  .

Well it is quite a big world, especially if we are to introduce the planets and everything...  

The probability of Kaladin encountering a former Heartstone member running the very bridges he is sent to as a slave is very small. It is something all authors have to be mindful about: make too many characters chance encounter each other and readers will start to shake their heads negatively. It is the same about "dead characters" nor being dead: jump that shark too often and readers will sigh heavily. At least, Brandon has found a satisfying way to justify why so many Radiants are popping one next to the other, so he needs not to worry about this one too much.

[WhiteLeeopard she/her]

Its pointed out several times, mainly from Dalinar and Adolin in WoR but also some others, that Kaladin behaves like a lighteyes, from how he talks, and looks at people, to how he walks, and those are just the surface things. These are the kind of things which people notice subconsciously when someone acts "outside their rank". And its noticeable through WoK that a big part of why Kaladin drew so much attention from people around him were those characteristics. 

[wildbuc117 he/him]

If I have asked this question and received a reply from Adam Horne, are there any rules against me posting the response here?

[Vissy]

Who is Adam Horne? And why would it be against the rules to post someone's opinion here? If it's spoiler-ific, just add massive spoiler tags.

[kari-no-sugata]

On 5/27/2017 at 0:54 AM, Calderis said:

Without some reason to hate Kaladin, some very personal reason, I feel like most people would see someone who reminds them of home, even someone they disliked, and feel protective of them. They would become a symbol of life back home. 

The lack of recognition on Kaladin's part, and the circumstances that Gaz called him "Lordling" in... I just don't see this as anything beyond a horribly callus and jaded man, taking out his aggression on men he thinks are already dead anyway. 

Indeed.

Gaz is basically reacting to Kaladin's "attitude". Something pretty much every character he meets does at various points.

There's also no reason why Gaz would call him "Lordling" just because he knew him in the past. He would be more likely to refer to him as a surgeon, for example, and implying he could be a lord would actually be dangerous if it was true. We see some of Gaz's perspective and none of it confirms he has any background knowledge on Kaladin.

[wildbuc117 he/him]

52 minutes ago, Rob Lucci said:

Who is Adam Horne? And why would it be against the rules to post someone's opinion here? If it's spoiler-ific, just add massive spoiler tags.

Sanderson's Executive Assistant.

This isn't an opinion, this is the answer. And while I assume that any questions answered at a convention or book signing are deemed public, I don't know if the same goes for asking questions/receiving answers through email.

[Pagerunner he/him]

8 hours ago, wildbuc117 said:

If I have asked this question and received a reply from Adam Horne, are there any rules against me posting the response here?

The forum doesn't have any rules to the contrary, as far as I'm aware. Adam is the one to worry about, if he wants to be on-record or not. In the past, when Team Sanderson has communicated things they wish to remain confidential (either through online messaging, or an in-person aside at a signing), they've told the person not to pass it around. 

I very rarely take anyone other than Brandon as 100% correct. Even Peter, the Stormlight continuity editor and one of Brandon's old writing group, has said some things that I think are wrong. (Not counting the time he and Brandon took to arguing on Twitter over how Shardblades interact with aluminum.) I don't know as much about Adam's background as I do Peter's; depending on the answer, and how he phrased it, it might not be definitive.

[wildbuc117 he/him]

3 minutes ago, Pagerunner said:

The forum doesn't have any rules to the contrary, as far as I'm aware. Adam is the one to worry about, if he wants to be on-record or not. In the past, when Team Sanderson has communicated things they wish to remain confidential (either through online messaging, or an in-person aside at a signing), they've told the person not to pass it around. 

I very rarely take anyone other than Brandon as 100% correct. Even Peter, the Stormlight continuity editor and one of Brandon's old writing group, has said some things that I think are wrong. (Not counting the time he and Brandon took to arguing on Twitter over how Shardblades interact with aluminum.) I don't know as much about Adam's background as I do Peter's; depending on the answer, and how he phrased it, it might not be definitive.

Welp, the answer I received is in the spoiler below.  The email didn't have a warning attached with it (unlike the one that said not to distribute white sand w/out Sanderson's permission)

Spoiler

"Kaladin and Gaz met for the first time at the Shattered Plains."

 

[maxal she/her]

9 hours ago, wildbuc117 said:

Welp, the answer I received is in the spoiler below.  The email didn't have a warning attached with it (unlike the one that said not to distribute white sand w/out Sanderson's permission)

  Hide contents

"Kaladin and Gaz met for the first time at the Shattered Plains."

 

Thanks for settling this one out. I am pretty it was alright for you to publicly say it as I doubt this is considered much of a spoiler.

[scifan he/him]

That's what I remembered from what I've read thus far.