Atium in wax and Wayne

[Jame Starmade]

So where is the Atium in the wax and Wayne books. Is it simply crazy rare because the pits of whatever were destroyed/lost or is it no longer being produced?

[Pagerunner he/him]

The Pits are no more, and there wasn't much going into to recreated world at the end of the original trilogy, since the atium mistings burnt it all away. Marsh has a small stockpile he's using to compound and decrease his age, like TLR did. But it doesn't look like Harmony is manifesting atium anymore. Now, the next book will be titled The Lost Metal, so there are some who think we'll see a return of atium. (Those who don't think it's somehow referring to harmonium, at least.) But since the Shards are combined, it probably follows that the separate metals for the two Shards aren't being made anymore.

[Andy92]

What if The Lost Metal just turns out to be Wayne misplacing his gold-plated watch? 

[Lord Bookwyrm he/him]

What if 'the lost metal' is referring to lerasium? I mean, the last we've seen of it is when Elend became a Mistborn while burning it

[Dellexe he/him]

On 4/4/2017 at 6:03 AM, Pagerunner said:

But it doesn't look like Harmony is manifesting atium anymore.

http://www.theoryland.com/intvsresults.php?kwt='pits of hathsin' 

Second item. Apparently believing that Wax's father is interested in the Pits is "on the right track." 

I think that they will keep producing Atium, though in reduced quantities as some Investiture is now going towards the creation of the fused God-Metal. 

[Lord Bookwyrm he/him]

Since there is still a large part of Preservation in allomancers and regular people alike, for the balance to remain inside harmony, the part of Ruin has to go somewhere is Ruin, and that somewhere is (probably) atium. So yes, I think atium is still being produced, just on a smaller scale, since there are less humans than there were and allomantic power has decreased over time.

[Lord Bookwyrm he/him]

1 hour ago, KalaDellexe said:

http://www.theoryland.com/intvsresults.php?kwt='pits of hathsin' 

Second item. Apparently believing that Wax's father is interested in the Pits is "on the right track." 

I think that they will keep producing Atium, though in reduced quantities as some Investiture is now going towards the creation of the fused God-Metal. 

But an equal amount of investiture is coming from preservation, so the original amount of atium has to be produced

[bluedeath33 he/him]

See if you scroll down on from the second one your on about, theres an interesting WoB about Interplanetary trade O.o

[The One Who Connects he/him]

6 hours ago, KalaDellexe said:

http://www.theoryland.com/intvsresults.php?kwt='pits of hathsin' 

Second item. Apparently believing that Wax's father is interested in the Pits is "on the right track." 

I think that they will keep producing Atium, though in reduced quantities as some Investiture is now going towards the creation of the fused God-Metal. 

Trying to find the WoB on theoryland, think it's actually in one of the signing reports on the Shard..

But as Pagerunner said earlier, the Pits no longer exist. The Well is gone too. Harmony has "recovered then" and there was something about a relation to him getting his own Shardpool(might've been our own speculation though)

[Andy92]

The thing with Atium returning though is that it's a "useless" metal if Mistborn aren't around to burn it. Sure, you can have an Atium misting, but I'm not sure how common those really are outside of how Preservation affected the snapping (the whole 1/16 thing) process to allow for an army of Atium mistings.

Edit: I'm also slightly confused on why The Pits don't exist anymore. There's a specific occurrence in SoS (I think) where Wax is physically climbing the Pits of Hathsin around the time he meets TenSoon. If the Pits are no more, what did that reference to Wax being in the Pits of Hathsin mean?   

Edited April 6, 2017 by Andy92

[Pagerunner he/him]

24 minutes ago, Andy92 said:

The thing with Atium returning though is that it's a "useless" metal if Mistborn aren't around to burn it. Sure, you can have an Atium misting, but I'm not sure how common those really are outside of how Preservation affected the snapping (the whole 1/16 thing) process to allow for an army of Atium mistings.

Edit: I'm also slightly confused on why The Pits don't exist anymore. There's a specific occurrence in SoS (I think) where Wax is physically climbing the Pits of Hathsin around the time he meets TenSoon. If the Pits are no more, what did that reference to Wax being in the Pits of Hathsin mean?   

Were they the Pits of Hathsin, or were they the old Kandra homeland? The geographical caverns may still exist, but not the atium geodes.

[Andy92]

40 minutes ago, Pagerunner said:

Were they the Pits of Hathsin, or were they the old Kandra homeland? The geographical caverns may still exist, but not the atium geodes.

I need to find the book when I get home to find the exact line, but if I remember right, the wording was basically Wax understanding that he was climbing the walls to the Pits of Hathsin. I think it was referring to the geographical cavern without the geodes since those are all gone. I think the location of the Pits is still around, there just isn't any Atium production. 

[Calderis he/him]

6 minutes ago, Andy92 said:

I need to find the book when I get home to find the exact line, but if I remember right, the wording was basically Wax understanding that he was climbing the walls to the Pits of Hathsin. I think it was referring to the geographical cavern without the geodes since those are all gone. I think the location of the Pits is still around, there just isn't any Atium production. 

Exactly. It's when Wax and TenSoon are fleeing the... Hemalurgy things. They climb through the geode free pits.

If the pits were producing, we'd have seen geodes in that scene, because it's not like anyone has been in there to harvest. No geodes means no atium production, a continual harvest, or there are "new pits" somewhere else. 

Edited April 6, 2017 by Calderis

[Stark he/him]

The Pits of Hathsin and the Kandra Homeland were the exact same thing.  That was one of the big reveals in Hero of Ages.  The geodes are far more interesting, because after Kelsier destroyed them, it was mentioned he had shut down Atium production for approximately 300 years.  Which is the time difference between Era 1 and Era 2.  

 

Which makes it super interesting as the Lost metal may well be Atium.  But Harmony could change that.  I think that is the direction Brandon set us up to look in.  Which makes me inclined to look in other directions partly because he likes to fake us out, and partly out of sheer contrariness.

 

But on a similar vein - Has anyone ever asked what the allomantic properties/potential would be of God metal alloys?  And I don't mean Malatium, or any other alloy of God metal and the base 16.  I mean, Atium-Lerasium Alloys.  Or Atium/Lerasium-Ettmetal Alloys.  Or Atium-Ettmetal-Lerasium.

 

Edit:  Though if Wax used Allomancy at all during the escape through the caverns, he would have ruined any new Atium buds that had developed, wouldn't he?  And when does Wax ever not use Allomancy in a fight?

Edited April 6, 2017 by Stark

[Andy92]

15 minutes ago, Stark said:

The Pits of Hathsin and the Kandra Homeland were the exact same thing.  That was one of the big reveals in Hero of Ages.  The geodes are far more interesting, because after Kelsier destroyed them, it was mentioned he had shut down Atium production for approximately 300 years.  Which is the time difference between Era 1 and Era 2.  

Which makes it super interesting as the Lost metal may well be Atium.  But Harmony could change that.  I think that is the direction Brandon set us up to look in.  Which makes me inclined to look in other directions partly because he likes to fake us out, and partly out of sheer contrariness.

I agree. I feel like the title is meant to make people think it's Atium, and he'll throw some curveball because that's what Brandon does lol.

[The One Who Connects he/him]

1 hour ago, Stark said:

Edit:  Though if Wax used Allomancy at all during the escape through the caverns, he would have ruined any new Atium buds that had developed, wouldn't he?  And when does Wax ever not use Allomancy in a fight?

Not actually. Kelsier broke the things by actually pulling on the geodes via Allomancy. He got steel/iron lines to the geodes without them exploding, so Wax should have seen those same lines were there any Atium around.

Any geodes that were inside of his "steel bubble" would have broken as he passed by, but to put it simply: no lines, no Atium. 

[Dellexe he/him]

If I recall right, Harmony is a deep intermingling of Ruin and Preservation, but there's still a distinction between the Investiture. I've been away from the 17th Shard for a while though, so I don't know of any new developments. 

Do the intermingled Investiture, in my mind, would create the fused God-Metal, but the two distinct Investitures at the "edges" of Sazed would bleed through and create Atium and Lerasium.

Can Shards willfully stop the bleed of power into the three forms, gas, metal, liquid? /

[The One Who Connects he/him]

5 hours ago, KalaDellexe said:

Can Shards willfully stop the bleed of power into the three forms, gas, metal, liquid?

Well.. An argument can be made for Tanavast, given that if he hadn't made the Honorblades, then Shardblades wouldn't exist, thus no solid form.

Under the assumption that Shardpools are always the "liquid" form, I would say they can't stop that from forming.

For the gaseous form, consider the other Shards. Who do we not know a gaseous form for, and why? If we know them all, odds are they can't stop it from happening

[Calderis he/him]

27 minutes ago, The One Who Connects said:

For the gaseous form, consider the other Shards. Who do we not know a gaseous form for, and why? If we know them all, odds are they can't stop it from happening

You made me start thinking about this and what I got is obviously the mists for Harmony

(spoilers for non Scadrian worlds)

Spoiler

Stormlight for Honor and Cultivation

Breath for Endowment

Odium... Don't think we've seen anything directly of Odium except possibly the black sphere so... Maybe? 

D&D... We seen Aona's Shardpools that existed before they were splintered, but nothing else. This may be due to the way the Dor is crammed into the Cognitive Realm though.

I haven't read either form of White Sand beyond what's in AU so no real frame of reference there. 

I'm pretty sure that's all of them though, and with the exception of me not having read White Sand, that seems to be a consistent form of investiture across the board. So I'd have to vote for gaseous being a constant? Maybe? 

Edited April 7, 2017 by Calderis

[Kingsdaughter613 she/her]

Spoiler

Investiture on Taldain has to do with sunlight.

 

[Calderis he/him]

@Kingsdaughter613 I'm aware of that much.

Spoiler

I'm aware of the microbes on the sand and the basics, I just haven't read the book or graphic novel to know more in depth. 

 

[Kingsdaughter613 she/her]

Just now, Calderis said:

@Kingsdaughter613 I'm aware of that much.

  Hide contents

I'm aware of the microbes on the sand and the basics, I just haven't read the book or graphic novel to know more in depth. 

 

Spoiler

I meant it as an addition to your theory. Sunlight could be argued as gaseous. It's the light itself that is invested, which is why you can access the investiture if you can see the star.

 

[Calderis he/him]

Ah thanks. I totally took that the wrong way. Sorry 

[Kingsdaughter613 she/her]

It's okay. Sometimes things don't come across clearly in text. Glad it's cleared up!

[+robardin he/him]

On 4/6/2017 at 0:28 PM, Andy92 said:

I agree. I feel like the title is meant to make people think it's Atium, and he'll throw some curveball because that's what Brandon does lol.

Exactly. I have no doubt that the titular Lost Metal is NOT atium, exactly because there is a blank display on a pedestal in the Museum of the World of Ash or whatever it was calling Atium "the lost metal".

If Rule #1 is "there's always another secret", that means Rule #0 is "if it looks like a secret (to the characters) has been openly spilled (to the reader) in the title, think again".