Random Storm Light questions

[Vaatuu]

So I just resantly finished WoR and I have a few lingering question about the series as a howl.

1: I heard somewhere that this is planned to be a 10 book long series, so considering that that's the number of orders in the KR and so far evory book has forest primarily on one of the new radiants. Does this mean there will be one book for each of them?

2: Are there six other orders/surges that we don't know about? 

3: Is the Nitewatcher Cultivation's spren in the same way that the Storm father is  Honor's spren?

4: Can a bound spren like Syl turn into any thing? Like say Kal needs to attack from a distance can she become a bow and arrow?

5: This one is more speculation, and it requires the answers to both questions 2 and 3 be yes, but is it possible that one of the other six orders is bound to the Nightwatcher like how Bonsmiths are bound to Storm father.

[Young Bard]

1 hour ago, Vaatuu said:

1: I heard somewhere that this is planned to be a 10 book long series, so considering that that's the number of orders in the KR and so far evory book has forest primarily on one of the new radiants. Does this mean there will be one book for each of them?

I don't know if this has ever been explicitly confirmed or denied, but 10 is a recurring number in Stormlight, in the same way that 16 is in Mistborn.

However, I doubt your theory, as Shalash, the patron of Lightweavers, is marked as being the Flashback character for one of the books, and Shallan is also a Lightweaver. There are no known entries of a Dustbringer having a flashback sequence either (and one other order which I can't remember.)

1 hour ago, Vaatuu said:

2: Are there six other orders/surges that we don't know about?

Well, we know what the orders are from what Brandon's told us in interviews, but we don't know what all of them do.

1 hour ago, Vaatuu said:

3: Is the Nitewatcher Cultivation's spren in the same way that the Storm father is  Honor's spren?

RAFO, or Read and Find Out.  It's what Brandon's told us when we've asked that. Expect to see that answer a lot, particularly when you start asking questions about the cosmere...

1 hour ago, Vaatuu said:

4: Can a bound spren like Syl turn into any thing? Like say Kal needs to attack from a distance can she become a bow and arrow?

Errrr... Being a bow and an arrow would require her to split herself in two, which I'm not sure whether or not she can do. That being said, it has been confirmed that Lift's spren, Glys, could turn into a Shardfork is Lift so desired.

1 hour ago, Vaatuu said:

5: This one is more speculation, and it requires the answers to both questions 2 and 3 be yes, but is it possible that one of the other six orders is bound to the Nightwatcher like how Bonsmiths are bound to Storm father.

That answer is a part RAFO, part we-don't-know (though it almost certainly would get a RAFO if it were asked.) There is a theory that there are fewer of the Bondsmiths (something that's mentioned by the epigraphs) because Bondsmiths like Dalinar need to bond with spren that have been dubbed "God-Spren", but that's just speculation.

[Darkness Ascendant]

NO! FATHER!

[Vaatuu]

37 minutes ago, The Young Bard said:

I don't know if this has ever been explicitly confirmed or denied, but 10 is a recurring number in Stormlight, in the same way that 16 is in Mistborn.

However, I doubt your theory, as Shalash, the patron of Lightweavers, is marked as being the Flashback character for one of the books, and Shallan is also a Lightweaver. There are no known entries of a Dustbringer having a flashback sequence either (and one other order which I can't remember.)

Well, we know what the orders are from what Brandon's told us in interviews, but we don't know what all of them do.

RAFO, or Read and Find Out.  It's what Brandon's told us when we've asked that. Expect to see that answer a lot, particularly when you start asking questions about the cosmere...

Errrr... Being a bow and an arrow would require her to split herself in two, which I'm not sure whether or not she can do. That being said, it has been confirmed that Lift's spren, Glys, could turn into a Shardfork is Lift so desired.

That answer is a part RAFO, part we-don't-know (though it almost certainly would get a RAFO if it were asked.) There is a theory that there are fewer of the Bondsmiths (something that's mentioned by the epigraphs) because Bondsmiths like Dalinar need to bond with spren that have been dubbed "God-Spren", but that's just speculation.

Thanks for answering my questions. 

[Vaatuu]

52 minutes ago, The Young Bard said:

I don't know if this has ever been explicitly confirmed or denied, but 10 is a recurring number in Stormlight, in the same way that 16 is in Mistborn.

I had always assumed that 16 was the, for lack of a better word, important number for the cosmere as a whole but now that I think about it I can see where I might have made a mistake.

[Rasarr]

Regarding the first question, I believe Brandon has said that each book will have its flashback character and its Radiant order, but one doesn't necessarily equate the other, so it could be that Shalash's book is the "Dustbringers' book" the same way Shallan's is "Lightweavers' book". Or Shalash could become a Dustbringer, which is, if I remember correctly, also a possibility raised on this forum sometimes.

As for sixteen, Secret History implies that 16 metals were based on 16 Shards of Adonalsium ("divine number"), but apparently Tanavast didn't feel beholden to that the same way Leras did, so no, there are ten orders.

[goody153]

3 hours ago, Vaatuu said:

So I just resantly finished WoR and I have a few lingering question about the series as a howl.

1: I heard somewhere that this is planned to be a 10 book long series, so considering that that's the number of orders in the KR and so far evory book has forest primarily on one of the new radiants. Does this mean there will be one book for each of them?

Yeah it's split into 2 5 book series. There's a big timejump between the first 5 books and 2nd 5 books.

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2: Are there six other orders/surges that we don't know about? 

We already know all the surges we just haven't seen them. In fact i'm kinda excited about finally seeing a skybreaker  since skybreakers have both surge of gravitation(the flying ability of windrunners) and surge of division(apparently a destructive surge) so they are kinda like violent versions of Windrunners.

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3: Is the Nitewatcher Cultivation's spren in the same way that the Storm father is  Honor's spren?

Possibly but it hasn't been confirmed.

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4: Can a bound spren like Syl turn into any thing? Like say Kal needs to attack from a distance can she become a bow and arrow?

Yes as long as she stays in a reasonable size. Apparently you can turn a spren into an Arrow not sure about bows.

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5: This one is more speculation, and it requires the answers to both questions 2 and 3 be yes, but is it possible that one of the other six orders is bound to the Nightwatcher like how Bonsmiths are bound to Storm father.

Some of the radiant orders are speculated to be part Cultivation part Honor. Like edge dancers. I think Windrunners are probably one of the more honor type's of Orders.

[PantsForSquares]

2 hours ago, The Young Bard said:

Errrr... Being a bow and an arrow would require her to split herself in two, which I'm not sure whether or not she can do. That being said, it has been confirmed that Lift's spren, Glys, could turn into a Shardfork is Lift so desired.

Lift's spren is Wyndle. Glys is Renarin's spren.

[Young Bard]

52 minutes ago, PantsForSquares said:

Lift's spren is Wyndle. Glys is Renarin's spren.

Ah. Sorry. It's been a long day...

[Jofwu]

4 hours ago, Vaatuu said:

2: Are there six other orders/surges that we don't know about?

No, the orders and surges are all interconnected. And the orders are patterned after the Heralds, of which there were 10.

[Torrieltar]

6 hours ago, Vaatuu said:

3: Is the Nitewatcher Cultivation's spren in the same way that the Storm father is  Honor's spren?

We do have this:

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I didn't record it, but here's the takeaway:

1) The Nightwatcher and Stormfather are parallel entities such that NW:Cultivation::SF:Honor
2) There is sort of a parallel for Odium, but the parallel is the various Unmade instead of a single entitiy; 
3) They are parallel in that they are all Splinters; 
4) The Unmade are voluntary Splinters, because Odium ("like almost all of the other Shards") voluntarily splintered part of it's power
5) The SF is different from the others because it's a Sliver.

 

[nervousnerd]

12 hours ago, goody153 said:

Yes as long as she stays in a reasonable size. Apparently you can turn a spren into an Arrow not sure about bows.

We know that dead shardblades can be thrown, so Kaladin could throw his spear at things. Technically it should be easier to throw live ones since they can come back immediately. We haven't seen any become anything with moving parts though (even as basic as a bow and arrow). A sheild or a spear are fairly simple changes;  it may be that more complex things are harder. There must be some limit that we don't know though because Brandon loves the limitations almost more than the powers themselves.

[The One Who Connects]

35 minutes ago, nervousnerd said:

There must be some limit that we don't know though because Brandon loves the limitations almost more than the powers themselves.

That's literally his second rule of magic in a nutshell. What the magic can't do drives the story forward.

As for spren becoming multiple parts, I personally figured that they couldn't but without something directly confirming either way...

[maxal]

14 hours ago, Rasarr said:

Regarding the first question, I believe Brandon has said that each book will have its flashback character and its Radiant order, but one doesn't necessarily equate the other, so it could be that Shalash's book is the "Dustbringers' book" the same way Shallan's is "Lightweavers' book". Or Shalash could become a Dustbringer, which is, if I remember correctly, also a possibility raised on this forum sometimes.

The only reason we raised it as a possibility was because it didn't make sense to have 10 major characters, 10 orders, but one order without any major character.

IMO, it does not make sense. I'd make sense if the 10 major characters weren't the same as the flashback characters, but they are. It is what it is though, so whatever the plan is, Dustbringers are the odd one out: no major character for this order.

 

 

[PantsForSquares]

2 hours ago, nervousnerd said:

We know that dead shardblades can be thrown, so Kaladin could throw his spear at things. Technically it should be easier to throw live ones since they can come back immediately. We haven't seen any become anything with moving parts though (even as basic as a bow and arrow). A sheild or a spear are fairly simple changes;  it may be that more complex things are harder. There must be some limit that we don't know though because Brandon loves the limitations almost more than the powers themselves.

This post made me realize something:

A Shardbow that can shoot raw bolts of Stormlight would be absolutely awesome.

[Darkness]

there is a theoryland WoB about a spren bow and arrow, but I'm on my mobile right now. I can try to find it later if someone else doesn't. I read it 2 nights ago

[Vaatuu]

23 hours ago, Rasarr said:

Regarding the first question, I believe Brandon has said that each book will have its flashback character and its Radiant order, but one doesn't necessarily equate the other, so it could be that Shalash's book is the "Dustbringers' book" the same way Shallan's is "Lightweavers' book". Or Shalash could become a Dustbringer, which is, if I remember correctly, also a possibility raised on this forum sometimes.

As for sixteen, Secret History implies that 16 metals were based on 16 Shards of Adonalsium ("divine number"), but apparently Tanavast didn't feel beholden to that the same way Leras did, so no, there are ten orders.

Thank you for anything my questions.

[Rasarr]

12 hours ago, maxal said:

The only reason we raised it as a possibility was because it didn't make sense to have 10 major characters, 10 orders, but one order without any major character.

IMO, it does not make sense. I'd make sense if the 10 major characters weren't the same as the flashback characters, but they are. It is what it is though, so whatever the plan is, Dustbringers are the odd one out: no major character for this order.

Hence why I mentioned the possibility that Shalash may become a Dustbringer, which could be interesting - she presumably knows all the theory, but with Dustbringers and Lightweavers sharing no surges whatsoever, she'd have to unlearn and re-learn a lot of stuff. 

[maxal]

11 hours ago, Rasarr said:

Hence why I mentioned the possibility that Shalash may become a Dustbringer, which could be interesting - she presumably knows all the theory, but with Dustbringers and Lightweavers sharing no surges whatsoever, she'd have to unlearn and re-learn a lot of stuff. 

It seems to me Shalash becoming a Dustbringer would be a massive spoiler, not the kind of plot Brandon would give away years prior to writing the book. I am therefore leaning towards this being merely a Red Herring. No way would Brandon give us the clues to figure such a crucial plot point obviously meant to be unexpected.

I thus think it may be possible there will either be: no major character for the Dustbringers, after all Brandon did say they were "the bizarre ones" or there will more than 5 major characters into the back five. It may be the "dead" characters will be replaced within new ones. I can't say, but surely a Herald dropping her Heralding duties to go join an order completely opposed to her former one is too much of a spoiler to be given away just now.

Hence, it probably isn't happening.

[Quiver]

On 07/09/2016 at 2:47 AM, maxal said:

The only reason we raised it as a possibility was because it didn't make sense to have 10 major characters, 10 orders, but one order without any major character.

IMO, it does not make sense. I'd make sense if the 10 major characters weren't the same as the flashback characters, but they are. It is what it is though, so whatever the plan is, Dustbringers are the odd one out: no major character for this order.

 

 

This kind of feeds into my minor, meta-Archive theory, actually. If there are no Dustbringer main characters, it's because the Dustbringer PoV is one which is going to be woven through all the books as an ongoing and consistent thread, rather than cycling in and outof focus like the others.

[maxal]

1 hour ago, Quiver said:

This kind of feeds into my minor, meta-Archive theory, actually. If there are no Dustbringer main characters, it's because the Dustbringer PoV is one which is going to be woven through all the books as an ongoing and consistent thread, rather than cycling in and outof focus like the others.

If you were right, then wouldn't it mean we should have a Dustbringer main protagonist currently active within the story? I say the one who's story arc is intervene with everyone and is an on-going arc is Kaladin... He's basically the main protagonist of the whole story. 

[Xaklys]

I don't anything about Shalash being a Flashback character (I do know she is Jezrien's daughter, and he is the king of the Heralds) but I know Renarin and Lift are confirmed for their own books in the second half of the series.  I think Jasnah will have her own too.  I know she survived but should she actually die, Brandon has said that he has nothing against writing flashbacks about a dead character.  I also think Taln will have a book as well, just a theory though.

[The One Who Connects]

1 hour ago, Xaklys said:

I don't anything about Shalash being a Flashback character (I do know she is Jezrien's daughter, and he is the king of the Heralds) but I know Renarin and Lift are confirmed for their own books in the second half of the series.  I think Jasnah will have her own too.  I know she survived but should she actually die, Brandon has said that he has nothing against writing flashbacks about a dead character.  I also think Taln will have a book as well, just a theory though.

From this topic (Wiery's last post on last page)

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[03:19:30]

Questioner: So the first one is Kaladin’s backstory, the second is Shallan’s backstory, who’s next?

Brandon: I actually haven’t been able to decide yet. It’s going to be one of the five for the first five books are Kaladin and Shallan and then Dalinar, Szeth, and Eshonai and I can’t decide which one matches the next book best. And I’m going to have to write it...

Argent: What’s the current list for the back five?

Brandon: Current list for the back five… Jasnah, Lift, Ash, Renarin, and Taln.

On the "Dustbringer" subject, there's a 15 year time gap between the front and back 5. Which is plenty of time for a younger Dustbringer to come into prominence. Start as an interlude character and show up in Lift/Jasnah's POV chapters of some battle scene.
Now that I think about it, Taln and Shalash flashbacks could be from the older Desolations right? Maybe our unknown Dustbringers will be alive during those. The Herald=/=Order, but I'm sure that once the battle starts you work with whoever is nearby

[maxal]

9 minutes ago, The One Who Connects said:

From this topic (Wiery's last post on last page)

On the "Dustbringer" subject, there's a 15 year time gap between the front and back 5. Which is plenty of time for a younger Dustbringer to come into prominence. Start as an interlude character and show up in Lift/Jasnah's POV chapters of some battle scene.
Now that I think about it, Taln and Shalash flashbacks could be from the older Desolations right? Maybe our unknown Dustbringers will be alive during those. The Herald=/=Order, but I'm sure that once the battle starts you work with whoever is nearby

The problem has always been Brandon considers the flashback characters to be the main characters as well. Therefore, if no flashback character is a Dustbringer, then no major character is a Dustbringer. Non-major characters have very limited POV within any given book. It means very little exposition to for our Dustbringer.

[Xaklys]

17 hours ago, The One Who Connects said:

From this topic (Wiery's last post on last page)

On the "Dustbringer" subject, there's a 15 year time gap between the front and back 5. Which is plenty of time for a younger Dustbringer to come into prominence. Start as an interlude character and show up in Lift/Jasnah's POV chapters of some battle scene.
Now that I think about it, Taln and Shalash flashbacks could be from the older Desolations right? Maybe our unknown Dustbringers will be alive during those. The Herald=/=Order, but I'm sure that once the battle starts you work with whoever is nearby

Thank you for letting me in on that, I very much appreciate it.  I'm new to the cosmere so I was not made aware of that.  At least I know I was relatively right, thank you though!