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cloudjumper

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Blackthorn Dalinar, Szeth, Lift, Vin, Sazed (Pre - Ascension), Miles, MeLaan, Vasher, Raoden (Full Elantrian), Dilaf, and Marsh are put in an arena. Who wins?

 

I apologize if this has been asked before. I am new to this community, so I am not sure what topics have already been covered.

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Depends at what point in time for a lot of them, Vin changes pretty drastically over time, notably with the acquisition of Duralumin. Marsh gains quite a lot of powers over time, going from being a simple Seeker to full Mistborn with a handful of feruchemical powers, does Vasher have Nightblood? Or Kalads phantoms?

Depending on what point in time I'd probably give it to Marsh, with Raoden and Vin coming in a close second and third.

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If Vasher has Nightblood then Vasher.

elseif Marsh is in his (current) final form then Marsh.

elseif Vin has a large supply of Atium (and other metals) then Vin (or same for basic Inquisitor form Marsh).

elseif Szeth (assuming a supply of Stormlight).

elseif Raoden has a chance if people ignore him for a few moments and he does some wild Aons.

 

...

 

Ok ok, enough with the programming jokes ->

We know Blackthorn Dalinar is no match for Szeth much less some of these other heavyweights.

I think a solid shardblade cut through the head would kill Miles.

MeLaan just does not bring much to the table. Perhaps she could survive long enough to simply win by default?

Dilaf is a strong fighter and seems resistant to investiture but I, personally, do not think he is on the same level as a Mistborn or Szeth.

Lyft is a bit of a wildcard but I imagine she is too young and inexperienced to win a gladiator cage match against other such hardened, and powerful, fighters.

Sazed with enough Steelrunning could theoretically win but, barring large amounts of steel, I do not think he has much of a chance.

Edited by CaptainRyan
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Miles can heal from basically anything except a shardblade and Szeth has a Honorblade so my moneys would be on him him.

Vin can push on all metals in Miles body with a duralumin push, so he wouldn't be able to heal anymore, and also using the same push to knock the honorblade away from Szeth, and crush his skull preventing him from healing. Though his other abilities would prove an issue. 

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Yeah Szeth powerset is quite powerful but fragile if he need to keep contact with the Blade, but I am unsure Vin may push on an Honorblade so strong to make Seth (powered with Stormlight) left it (much more if he know about Allomancy and stick the Blade with his hand).

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Yeah Szeth powerset is quite powerful but fragile if he need to keep contact with the Blade, but I am unsure Vin may push on an Honorblade so strong to make Seth (powered with Stormlight) left it (much more if he know about Allomancy and stick the Blade with his hand).

Sorry, the way I wrote it was vague. I believe if Vin pushed the honorblade away with a duralumin push, he would still be able to use stormlight and its abilities, but as I type this, I just remembered, it has been said in the books that honorblades don't dissipate when dropped. So that does make me wonder if he would be able to still use the abilities. I think he would, because he is bonded to it, and does not have to summon the blade to use its abilities, but it does certainly present a head scratcher if it is already summoned and knocked away. Hmmmmm

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Lift will run away. Then, assuming none of the unaging people survive, she'll outlive the rest by skillfully being younger than all the others.

To be fair there are quite a few people who don't age in there, but still...

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If Marsh is in his current state, then to me it's obvious he'd win. He's almost like a second Lord Ruler.

 

I'm kinda surprised though; in an other discussion, there were huge discussions of who'd win - The Lord Ruler or Vasher.

I think he's ignored a little to much here. True, the others are all powerful, but if he has a lot of breaths with him, so he can awake his clothes, or just whatever he wants, he's very dangerous. If he has Nightblood in addition, he's very, very, very dangerous and outmatches for sure Dalinar, Szeth, Kaladin and Lift.

 

Miles I don't give to big of a chance. He's not a great fighter, and even with compounding health, there will be the moment when he's out of health and gold. And as he's not a good fighter, but the others are, he'd just get smashed over and over again, until finally killed.

 

But in the end (like mentioned at the beginning) if Marsh is his peak, he'd be a "Mistborn" and probably almost (if not complete) full feruchemist. He can compound everything, and has so many different and strong powers, he'd win this fight definitly

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If Marsh is in his current state, then to me it's obvious he'd win. He's almost like a second Lord Ruler.

 

I'm kinda surprised though; in an other discussion, there were huge discussions of who'd win - The Lord Ruler or Vasher.

I think he's ignored a little to much here. True, the others are all powerful, but if he has a lot of breaths with him, so he can awake his clothes, or just whatever he wants, he's very dangerous. If he has Nightblood in addition, he's very, very, very dangerous and outmatches for sure Dalinar, Szeth, Kaladin and Lift.

 

Miles I don't give to big of a chance. He's not a great fighter, and even with compounding health, there will be the moment when he's out of health and gold. And as he's not a good fighter, but the others are, he'd just get smashed over and over again, until finally killed.

 

But in the end (like mentioned at the beginning) if Marsh is his peak, he'd be a "Mistborn" and probably almost (if not complete) full feruchemist. He can compound everything, and has so many different and strong powers, he'd win this fight definitly

Yeah if Vasher has Nightblood I definitely give him the win, unless Marsh has steel compounding and just instantly murders everyone that is. :P

I feel like people are underestimating Raoden a bit, he's very quick to draw and Aons are easily the most versatile ability here, Allomancy is way faster and more instinctive but I'd probably give Raoden the win over Szeth and possibly even Vasher if he didn't have Nightblood.

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To me Vasher is just a little overstimated (also with Nightblood), anyway my money on Marsh.

 

I don't know if people understimate Raoden, it's true He had the most flexible ability, but I find him lacking of the ability to react to the fighting dynamics at the right speed.

 

In the end I am unsure of the outcome but for as i see the character we may remove: Dalinar (if we take him as warlord), Meelan and Dilaf from the winner candidates.

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A big advantage of Vasher and Marsh compared to Sazed and Raoden as well (at least I think so, I didn't read Elantris in a while), is that they both are very experienced fighters.

Sazed was hardly fighting, and if I remember correctly, Raoden as well. He might be strong and quick, but is he experienced enough with his powers in an actual fight against 2 guys that have hundreds of years of experience?

 

Other point: If you say Arena, the question is how big this should be. I guess in close combat Raoden has no chance against Vasher or Marsh, as quick as he is. But on bigger distant, he might defeat Vasher, Marsh would be harder already

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Vin can push on all metals in Miles body with a duralumin push, so he wouldn't be able to heal anymore, and also using the same push to knock the honorblade away from Szeth, and crush his skull preventing him from healing. Though his other abilities would prove an issue. 

The more an object is invested the harder it is to push/pull on it with alloymancy so an honorblade would most likely be so heavily invested that Vin couldn't affect it.

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A big advantage of Vasher and Marsh compared to Sazed and Raoden as well (at least I think so, I didn't read Elantris in a while), is that they both are very experienced fighters.

Sazed was hardly fighting, and if I remember correctly, Raoden as well. He might be strong and quick, but is he experienced enough with his powers in an actual fight against 2 guys that have hundreds of years of experience?

 

Other point: If you say Arena, the question is how big this should be. I guess in close combat Raoden has no chance against Vasher or Marsh, as quick as he is. But on bigger distant, he might defeat Vasher, Marsh would be harder already

Also, the arena needs to be Arelon for Raoden to do anything, just going to Teod already weakened him quite a bit. Raoden also has almost zero fighting ability with aons, he can use them to fight but most other characters either have a lot of experience or a magic system more orientated toward fighting, or both.

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If Vin/Marsh super-pulled the Honorblade to them, then slowed it with a push to catch it, would they bond to it?

 

I guess we don't know for a lot of reasons. I assume not, as it would rely on too much...

 

 

As people have said, how levelled up is everyone? How well equipped? I've still not read Warbreaker or Elantris but I have an idea of the combatants abilities. 

 

Those who aren't natural fighters are out of it - Sazed and Lift could be lethal but (at this point for Lift at least) they just aren't combat ready.

 

Marsh has a lot of tricks up his sleeve, being a killing machine and having a mix of metal powers. Szeth and Vasher are killing machines. Vin's special power is working out a way to beat opponents she has no right to and is also a killing machine. Elantrians are very powerful. Can't really call it on logic without reading the last 2 series and having more info, but I'd put Vin and Vasher up there. Both survivors and combat pragmatists. But given that Marsh at HoA level nearly kills Vin at HoA pre-Mist level, Marsh is probably my overall winner in a straight fight

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i think marsh will win even if vasher has nightblood tbh...pretty sure he can compound steel and pewter as of AoL era

He probably can, but again it begs the question of at what point are we taking the character? At her peak Vin was a Shard, if we're only counting when she had a physical body then she was using the Mists to crush entire building, pretty sure she easily wins if she's at that level.

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I remember reading somewhere that Brandon would put his money on Vin in a fight between Vasher (with nightblood) and Vin but said it would be close.

 

Of course, everything depends on timing. But assuming you are taking all characters at their peak (sans any level of shard ascension) then Marsh likely makes the most sense to me.

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I remember reading somewhere that Brandon would put his money on Vin in a fight between Vasher (with nightblood) and Vin but said it would be close.

 

Of course, everything depends on timing. But assuming you are taking all characters at their peak (sans any level of shard ascension) then Marsh likely makes the most sense to me.

Well again, Vin at her peak is capable of leveling buildings since she can use the Mists. Or just yanking the linchpin spike right out of Marsh.

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Well again, Vin at her peak is capable of leveling buildings since she can use the Mists. Or just yanking the linchpin spike right out of Marsh.

You'd assume this hypothetical fight is taking place of "neutral" ground where all magic systems function properly, correct? 

 

1) There shouldn't be mists just floating around

2) Her using the mists is a part of the ascension process, I did say "sans any level of shard ascension"

Edited by Voidus
because that b) emote always happens
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You'd assume this hypothetical fight is taking place of "neutral" ground where all magic systems function properly, correct? 

 

A) There shouldn't be mists just floating around

B) Her using the mists is a part of the ascension process, I did say "sans any level of shard ascension"

1) Depends where and when the fight is, and if we're assuming that people have access to the resources they need (ie. Raoden is near Elantris, Dilaf is on Sel, Vasher has Breaths, Marsh has enough Atium to not instantly age into dust) then I'd say there should be some.

2) Technically it's a separate process, it's just that she burned enough of it that she could pick up the Shard, burning the mists doesn't cause you to ascend any more than burning Lerasium does, it's just because of the amount she used.

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1) Depends where and when the fight is, and if we're assuming that people have access to the resources they need (ie. Raoden is near Elantris, Dilaf is on Sel, Vasher has Breaths, Marsh has enough Atium to not instantly age into dust) then I'd say there should be some.

2) Technically it's a separate process, it's just that she burned enough of it that she could pick up the Shard, burning the mists doesn't cause you to ascend any more than burning Lerasium does, it's just because of the amount she used.

 

We're talking enough for her to destroy buildings though. 

 

And again, I said that personally, im assuming this is neutral ground where magic works properly for everyone. 

 

The real question i guess to me is about magic users who sort of have an innate ability vs magic users who rely on consuming a product (metal) 

 

Is everyone starting fresh here? Do people have unlimited supply of whatever resource they use? Have feruchemists stored any attributes? 

 

That starting point is more determinative for me than anything else.

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We're talking enough for her to destroy buildings though. 

 

And again, I said that personally, im assuming this is neutral ground where magic works properly for everyone. 

 

The real question i guess to me is about magic users who sort of have an innate ability vs magic users who rely on consuming a product (metal) 

 

Is everyone starting fresh here? Do people have unlimited supply of whatever resource they use? Have feruchemists stored any attributes? 

 

That starting point is more determinative for me than anything else.

I really don't think it'd take that much, a tiny trickle was enough for her to pull on something not only embedded in flesh but also Invested enough to hold 1000 years of age.

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And another relatively small amount was enough to make Ruin- Marsh flee from her in HoA.

Still, hard call. If Marsh has speed stored up and uses it to KO Vasher and take Nightblood, would his Feruchemy fuel using it? What's its rate of non-Endowment Investiture use? Do the other combatants need a connection to Honor/Roshar to use the Honorblade when they kill Szeth?

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