king of nowhere Posted February 6, 2016 Report Share Posted February 6, 2016 the more we figured the riddiculous power of the lord ruler, the more people cried foul that a mere mistborn like vin could best him. In fact, after BoM, we see that rashek was even more ridiculously overpowered than we assumed. But that also explains why he apparently went dumb. We've seen both wax and marasi tapping so much speed that they virtually stopped time. We've seen that wax was healed from death. So, of course rashek had nothing to fear from vin. no surprise that he was toying with her; he totally could afford it. And then vin ripped off his metalminds. First of all, let's see how impossible that should have been: those metalminds were so heavily invested that there was no way anyone could push on them (yes, I know the bands in the book were made by kelsier, I'm just assuming rashek's metalminds were similar in power, albeit probably only attuned to him). They also pierced a body. vin could only rip them because she was empowered by the mists. rashek had no way of predicting this, or expecting it, or fearing it. as far as he was concerned, it was plain impossible. with his metalminds, rashek lost his capacity to slow down time. consider someone who could practically stop time, think carefully through everything, and then act. consider that suddenly he loses this power, and he suddenly find himself with a few minutes left to live because he lost the capacity to tap age. Is it a surprise that he suddenly cannot make good decisions? He also lost much of his power. He lost all the feruchemy, and he also lost most of his allomancy; without his investiture manipulation, he was a much weaker allomancer than he was used to. With his reduced power, he could not just pull on his metalminds: they were too heavily invested. All he could try was to recover them by hand. which he tried to do, but vin pushed them away. At this point, he was already too feeble to do anything else. yes, he could still have used allomancy to jump out of the window (still, not much chances of finding the metalminds in all the mess, since they were invisible to allomancy), if he even bothered to take metals before; since he could empower his allomancy with the investiture in the metalminds, it's likely he didn't. Why would he? There is absolutely no chance in the world anyone could rip his metalminds off of him. So, rashek not only found himself severely crippled and with all the usual responses he had ingrained in his "muscle memory" (useing the term loosely to refer to the use of allomancy and feruchemy) not working anymore, but he may have completely lost the capacity to use all his powers and succumbed to lesser people just like a modern army would succumb to an ancient one if it was stuck without ammos and gasoline. The moment he lost his metalminds, rashek was already dead, and nothing he could do would alter that. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voidus Posted February 6, 2016 Report Share Posted February 6, 2016 Going off of some vague memories here but I believe the bands were just his Atiumminds, he had other pieces of metal on him that were presumably his other metalminds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king of nowhere Posted February 7, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 Going off of some vague memories here but I believe the bands were just his Atiumminds, he had other pieces of metal on him that were presumably his other metalminds. possibly so, but vin's push removed all of rashek's metalminds anyway. and the fact that those metalminds were so heavily invested - maybe because he figured it would be less likely that an opponent may push them away, maybe just because tlr wanted to have large supplies - is the best explanation for why he didn't just pull those metalminds back to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NovaSeeker he/him Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 (edited) Vin wasn't "merely" a Mistborn in that moment, though. She was burning the Mists, which were the unadulterated power of Preservation. That's how a "mere mistborn" was able to defeat him. (Also remember, the Lord Ruler was a "mere" mistborn/ferruchemist during this time. He no longer had the power of any Shards in that moment. Unlike Vin, burning Mists, who did.) Spoilers for the end of Bands of Mourning The Bands of Mourning belong to a revived Kelsier, not Rashek. In the epilogue you see the coppermind memory from the coin Hoid threw at Wax. The memory was of a man with scars on his arms who told people to "survive". This is obviously the Survivor of Hathsin himself. Coupled with the fact that he had a single eye-spike, just like the statue of "The Lord Ruler" at the temple that held the Bands, and you can infer that the revived Kelsier likely used hemalurgy to make himself into a full Ferruchemist as well as Mistborn, and then led the people of the southern continent as their benevolent god-king. Edited February 7, 2016 by NovaSeeker 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voidus Posted February 7, 2016 Report Share Posted February 7, 2016 possibly so, but vin's push removed all of rashek's metalminds anyway. and the fact that those metalminds were so heavily invested - maybe because he figured it would be less likely that an opponent may push them away, maybe just because tlr wanted to have large supplies - is the best explanation for why he didn't just pull those metalminds back to him. Did she? But regardless his other metalminds weren't actually that Invested, Vin didn't seem to have any problems with the ones that weren't spikes even before she used the Mists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yata he/him Posted February 15, 2016 Report Share Posted February 15, 2016 Probably also if Rashek didn't die in the moment He lost the Atiuminds, He will be probably too old and shocked to does anything more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plastic Misting Posted February 15, 2016 Report Share Posted February 15, 2016 The thought that crossed my mind when rethinking about how Rashek died is that he was actually stabbed with a spear when Vin finished him off. That could result in a hemalurgic spike. Has anyone else though of that before? In retrospect that theory seems so obvious, you could easily come up with that after having read the second book. Then maybe the sovereign could be the Lord Ruler, having his soul somehow transplanted into a new body by the use of that spike. Secret history spoilers: Obviously that's not true now. And the spike is probably also irrelevant, if there even was intent form someone, considering it would just be another iron or steel spike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king of nowhere Posted February 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2016 The thought that crossed my mind when rethinking about how Rashek died is that he was actually stabbed with a spear when Vin finished him off. That could result in a hemalurgic spike. Has anyone else though of that before? In retrospect that theory seems so obvious, you could easily come up with that after having read the second book. Then maybe the sovereign could be the Lord Ruler, having his soul somehow transplanted into a new body by the use of that spike. Secret history spoilers: Obviously that's not true now. And the spike is probably also irrelevant, if there even was intent form someone, considering it would just be another iron or steel spike. interesting. We know hemalurgy requires intent, so you can't accidentally making a spike by stabbing someone. On the other hand, the intent might not be yours: ruin is watching, and if he has the intent to make a spike, a spike will be made; see spook's case in hero of ages. And ruin was definitely looking and definitely wanted tlr to die. however, that's quite a redundant idea. with his atium metalmind lost, tlr was doomed to die of old age soon enough, stabbing notwithstanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
18th Shard he/him Posted February 22, 2016 Report Share Posted February 22, 2016 It was a wooden spear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King's Twit he/him Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 (edited) It was a wooden spear. I don't believe that it was ever confirmed whether the spear had a metal tip or not, but... Mistborn SH spoilers: We saw the Lord Ruler enter the Cognitive realm after he died and then almost immediately move into the Beyond, so the spike couldn't have taken taken his mind unless there were somehow two 'copies' of Rashek after the spiking. Plus, Ruin just worked so hard, pushing Kelsier and Vin exactly where they needed to go, to help Vin succeed in killing the Lord Ruler. LR is probably the greatest, most knowledgeable foe that Ruin has left after Preservation went all Fuzzy. He is probably the only person on Scadrial who is actively working against Ruin being released, and he is pretty effective at keeping Ruin contained, all things considering. Why would Ruin want to create the possibility of the Lord Ruler returning to life? Edited February 25, 2016 by King's Twit 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocHoliday he/him Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 It was a wooden spear.The book repeatedly describes it as "a simple wooden spear". Vin uses it as a crutch. While this implies that it's just ac point stick, I have to concede that it doesn't specifically exclude the possibility that it had a metal tip. The spear itself came either from the palace guard or Kelsier's armory. Which means it certainly would have had a steel tip, if anybmetal tip at all. Which means at best it would steal Allomantic Physical Metals(?) I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 Well, the Sovereign's coppermind apparently depicted him as having Inquisitor steelsight on the spike side of his face . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocHoliday he/him Posted February 25, 2016 Report Share Posted February 25, 2016 Yes, but we're 99% sure that's Kelsier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+TheAlmighty he/him Posted February 26, 2016 Report Share Posted February 26, 2016 After reading Secret History, Vin burning the mists to defeat the LR seems strange to me. After Kelsier met Preservation it seemed pretty clear he did not want the LR killed. He reveled in Rashek's unchanging preservation. Why would his mists then help Vin kill the LR? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
king of nowhere Posted February 26, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2016 After reading Secret History, Vin burning the mists to defeat the LR seems strange to me. After Kelsier met Preservation it seemed pretty clear he did not want the LR killed. He reveled in Rashek's unchanging preservation. Why would his mists then help Vin kill the LR? I believe it is because preservation set up things in motion when he still was sane, because he had predicted what would happen later. and he could not stop those things from happening. basically, he made a plan that was foolproof because he knew he would have become a fool himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
natc Posted February 27, 2016 Report Share Posted February 27, 2016 (edited) The mists are basically an autonomous force at this point, Leras set it up that way because he knew (and counted on the fact that) he was screwed. Besides, she apparently had a strong Connection to Preservation somehow (having been a strangely powerful allomancer and the shard just picking her out as a vessel like that) so all in all the mists likely couldn't refuse. Edited February 27, 2016 by natc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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