Voidbinding Theory

[Bloodfalcon he/him]

 He had heard that the Voidbringers could hold [stormlight] in perfectly. But, then, did they even exist? His punishment declared that they didn’t. His honor demanded that they did.

 

That quote got me thinking that perhaps Szeth is under the impression that he is a Voidbringer. I know that would mean he was asking if he existed, but if you consider his weirdly inverted logic on other topics, it may become understandable. I got to thinking that if that was his belief, his punishment, Truthlessness, could be a literal description. His people don't believe in him and his "Voidbringing," so he is without truth. BUT his honor in refusing to kill himself or deviate from his orders prove that he is still here and a thing. Wheel of Time fans, think about how weird the Aiel beliefs were on things like this: men who could channel would think it their duty to go fight the dark one, so they would just run off. 

Cool. So. That got me wondering then about Voidbinding, and I considered something I hadn't before: Szeth can use Windrunner abilities, Order 1, and pretty much fits the bill for the exact inverse of the qualities. In other words, he is VOID of them. He is not a leader, in fact he follows like a mad man. He is not protective, in fact he stomps on others protection, and is basically an entirely offensive tool thus far. These may not be the things that landed him in this role, but they seem like good examples of him developing these inverse characteristics. Maybe we'll have 10 Voidbringer Orders that are all void of the described characteristics.

If anyone has seen ideas like these discussed, I'd love to hear of them. I tried a search but it was hard to word and brought up like....every topic. 

[steeleyes]

http://coppermind.net/wiki/Unmade

 

kind of supports the idea if one agrees with the speculation that the Unmade are the opposites to the Heralds.

[hoser he/him]

Ask and you will receive.  Interestingly, a search on "szeth" brought up none of these old threads.

 

These seem relevant:

• Szeth and the Voidbringers
• Are The Shin Hiding Something?
• The Dark Side of Shin
• Szeth and Gavilar's encounter

These do not:

• Szeth & Honor, Shin & Cultivation
• Dalinar has a voice in his head; and why Szeth remains truthless.

 

The idea that he is becoming a Voidbringer or a champion of Odium has occurred before, but I haven't seen the idea that he is becoming an inverse-windrunner as a way of becoming a Voidbringer (upvote). 

I think that it might be a matter of doing Odiumish things to become a Voidbringer, so hating people, renouncing things that people enjoy, etc would characterize the Voidbringers.   To me the irrational hatred that Szeth feels and the screams he hears are the hallmarks of his advancement as one of Odium's minions.  

These ideas seem compatible, so I can't wait to see the development that is coming relatively soon. 

 

I don't read the OP quote as indicating he thinks that he is a Voidbringer.  To me it says that what he did to be punished (and hence his honor) was based on the existence of Voidbringers.  It also says that the punishment (and by extension the punishers: the Stone Shamans) declare that Voidbringers don't exist. 

 

He is trapped by his adherence to Stone Shamanism even when he denies the existence of Voidbringers, which is a part of it.  This, in turn, leads him to murder, etc.  If he would just pick a different subset of Stone Shamanism to believe in, he could suffer so much less.  I think this must be part of what Brandon wants to explore: how people's religious beliefs can cause them to suffer. 

[Argent he/him]

I think this must be part of what Brandon wants to explore: how people's religious beliefs can cause them to suffer. 

 

Sazed-son-son-Vallano, Steward of Terris...

[hoser he/him]

Bwah-hah-hah! And the ultimate punishment: become a god!

[dungeonfood he/him]

In one of the threads hoser posted, I found a reference to this epigraph, though the poster's analysis skipped over what stood out to me...

 

I wish to sleep. I know now why you do what you do, and I hate you for it. I will not speak of the truths I see.”

—Kakashah 1173, 142 seconds pre-death.
A Shin sailor, left behind by his crew, reportedly for bringing them ill luck. Sample largely useless.

And at the very end of the Prologue, there's "To Szeth’s people, a dying request was sacred." Shin may be familiar with the prophetic nature of the dying phrases, and Szeth could've learned of the future that way.

 

What stands out to me here is the word "truth". Note that it's a Shin talking. This has absolutely got to have something to do with being "truthless".

[Argent he/him]

In retrospect, "Sample largely useless" should've been a dead giveaway. That's practically saying "Pay attention to this!"

[marianmi]

I read that quote as a direct message to Taravangian/the nurse killing the guy. 

 

I wish to sleep. I know now why you do what you do, and I hate you for it. I will not speak of the truths I see.

 

He wants to sleep/die - he has seen in his vision why they are killing all the people, and he hates them for it. He will not give them an epigraph (a truth he sees in his dying vision).

[Ethrien he/him]

That's almost definitely they way its meant to be taken, however whats interesting is that it's a Shin sailor. For everyone else the epigraph is an almost involuntary thing, why/how this Shin is able to objectively decided to not speak is of interest as well as the connections between 'truths' and 'truthless'.

 

The Shin refuses to speak the 'truths' he sees, which truths? Well given the nature of the epigraphs, its almost certainly something relating to the Final Desolation, and therefore a truth about Vorinism. Its not much but you could take it as a small look into Stone Shamanism. Szeth is 'truthless' which seems a fancy way of saying liar. If a truth of Stone Shamanism was that the Desolations and by extension the Vorin gods, the Radiants and the Voidbringers are false, then Szeth as a Surgebinder is an affront to that truth and his entire existence deemed a lie. We say his kind doesn't exist therefore he doesn't exist, therefore he is 'truthless'.

[Argent he/him]

The Truthless may be anything, but they are not liars.

[Ethrien he/him]

They don't tell lies, however if some tenant of Stone Shamanism refutes the notion of Surgebinders, or Heralds or something else that Szeth proves simply by existing, then he would be living proof that Stone Shamanism is in some regards false. And therefore to allow the continuation of Stone Shamanism, the brand of 'truthless' marks his very existence a lie.

Edited October 28, 2013 by Ethrien

[Blindillusions he/him]

There is some speculation in others topics that Shinovar is the location of where the Heralds left their Blades. My point isn't so much about that, but more along the lines that perhaps one of the tenants of Stone Shamanism is that humanity won in the last desolation. If Szeth found evidence he believes proves the Voidbringers are still a real threat it could rock a pinnacle foundation of his religion. We've all seen examples of how far a religion will go to protect itself. Thus Szeth is made Truthless. Perhaps being truthless is a spiritual quest to show Szeth there are no more Voidbringers...only horrible examples of humanity....

-Edited because phones are horrible to type on.

Edited October 28, 2013 by Blindillusions

[Bloodfalcon he/him]

They don't tell lies, however if some tenant of Stone Shamanism refutes the notion of Surgebinders, or Heralds or something else that Szeth proves simply by existing, then he would be living proof that Stone Shamanism is in some regards false. And therefore to allow the continuation of Stone Shamanism, the brand of 'truthless' marks his very existence a lie.

Well said. This is where I meant to go with the topic, but sometimes my word has very bad.