Mostly Baseless Speculation on Nicrosil Spikes

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

Ah forget it, I've almost posted this same bloody topic a dozen times before but kept holding back because I think to myself "No, no it would be spoilers to a Post-Era 2 Story I will definitely write one day", but now I'm waiting for Era 3 instead so whatever I'll just post this and get on with my life.

Here are my thoughts and theories on how the Nicrosil Spikes used by the Set work and how to potentially improve them.

First off the docket, the mechanics behind them and where we've seen stuff like this before and what that might tell us.

-The Set's Nicrosil Spikes work by non-lethally shaving off the excess Preservation Investiture in the souls of all Scadrians, it takes around 20-30 normal people to fully charge a spike. This means that they're trying to make Allomancers by artificially raising the amount of Preservation in a person's soul, we have seen this before.

--With the Mistsickness, where the Mists went out of its way to forcibly Snap people with Allomantic Potential that was too deep to be brought out by a beating, so the Mists slightly raised the potnetial of these people and forcibly dragged out the power, causing sickness and sometimes death.

Spoiler

Brandon Sanderson

The Sliding Scale of Allomantic Potential

Noblemen, despite what Spook says in this chapter, are not immune to the mistsickness. The rumor Spook is referencing does have merit, however. You see, since the mists are Snapping people and awakening the Allomantic potential within them, it will affect far fewer noblemen than skaa. Why? Because a lot of the noblemen have already Snapped. They were beaten as children to bring out the powers.

However, that won't stop all of them from being affected by the mistsickness, because the mistsickness is also awakening Allomantic potential that would otherwise be too subtle to be brought out. Pretend there's a sliding scale of Allomantic potential. 100% means you're an Allomancer—in this series, only two people have hit 100%—Vin and Elend. Buried within a lot of people, however, is enough of a touch of Preservation's power to hit, say, 50% on the relative scale of Allomantic power. These people, when beaten and made to pass through something traumatic, awaken to their Allomantic abilities.

There are a lot of people out there, however, with something more like 20% to 30%. These are the people the mists are Snapping—since the mists are, themselves, partially the power of Preservation, they can touch people and increase their Allomantic potential slightly and then bring it to the forefront.

There is a correlation here, the trauma and raising of Preservation via the Mist is similar to what the Set are trying to accomplish. But its not working as well as they want, only some people are gaining powers and even then its only temporary until the power 'gives out'.

Why is this? I have a guess for that too. Identity Contamination.

We were properly introduced to this concept in TLM, where Marsh stated it is the reason why Hemalurgists in Era 2 are unable to use Compounding. Hemalurgic Spikes are also similar to Metalminds in the way that they are Keyed to the Identity to the person that charged them, the 20-30 victims in this instance. Which means that Nicrosil Spikes have a lot of differeing and conflicting Identities within them.

Now its not quite clear on what is the precise factor/s that decide what kind of Allomancer a person is born as, but I'm willing to bet that Identity is one of those factors. Perhaps all the differing Identities are confusingthe Investiture on what power it should manifest as, and the few times it does grant a power is because there is a majority of Identities that share potential for a specific power?

Therefore the next step to improving the Nicrosil Spikes is to simply Blank the Identities of the victims. Likely through a Malwish Harmonium Device that is charged with F-Aluminum to do it by force. But I don't think this is the end point, as I beleive that this Blank Nicrosil Spike will grant a power, but it will be random, based on what power the person was already slated to gain if they had enough Preservation. For example, one Blanked Spike would make Person A a Coinshot, but if that spike were to be taken out and given to a Person B, it would make them an Augur. This methd would probably also not allow for multiple powers to be granted by just Blanked Spikes, since most people only have the potential for a single power not more.

So how to improve on this and 'code' the spike to give a specific power? Go a step further, figure out a way to determine what power a donor could have had with one of the Blanked Spikes, then if their power is a desired one, make them one of the 20-30 donors but Blank every Donor's identity except theirs so that the Spike will be Keyed only to their Identity, which might  be enough to make the Investiture in the spike to manifest as a particular Allomantic power. Maybe.

It would be a more complex operation requiring specific magical machinery and many people losing a chunk of their souls, but it would theoretically allow for a mass production of Allomantic powers through Hemalurgy.

Or this could be a load of bunk come Era 3 and I'm nothing but a madman with too much time on his hands. You decide!

[PanLin they/he]

5 hours ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

For example, one Blanked Spike would make Person A a Coinshot, but if that spike were to be taken out and given to a Person B, it would make them an Augur.

This tracks with how we know that Allomancy is partially genetic, but specific Misting powers aren't. Seems like Misting (and Ferring) expression is an emergent result of the pattern of a given person's Spiritweb.

5 hours ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

Go a step further, figure out a way to determine what power a donor could have had with one of the Blanked Spikes, then if their power is a desired one, make them one of the 20-30 donors but Blank every Donor's identity except theirs so that the Spike will be Keyed only to their Identity, which might  be enough to make the Investiture in the spike to manifest as a particular Allomantic power.

Huh, that's interesting. I wonder if that would work better if you stored the recipient's Identity first, then spiked them with this new spike, then let their own Identity back in over the top.

Like, we know from your quote that a person's Misting/Ferring ability is already decided by their Spiritweb, they just need some extra Preservation and the right conditions to unlock it. To give a specific power, surely you'd have to make sure the recipient's Spiritweb isn't going to colour it somehow, or tailor it specifically. Maybe someone with the conditions to become a Pewterarm needs a Nicrosil spike with a Lurcher's Identity to actually become a Tineye instead, but that same spike given to a Seeker will make them a Smoker.

We know Godmetals can get pretty funky when used as spikes, so maybe there's one that lets you steal specific aspects of a Spiritweb, literally something like "the chunk of Spiritweb that defines Misting/Ferring powers" as if you're searching through someone's source code for the right data address. Maybe an Ambition or Cultivation spike?

Hell, maybe there's another Godmetal out there that can hold an Identity charge without it getting used up. Super speculative, but imagine just having a set of 32 'filters' in your Hemalurgy lab that you just pass Nicrosil spikes through to charge them with specific Allomantic and Feruchemical powers.

6 hours ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

Perhaps all the differing Identities are confusingthe Investiture on what power it should manifest as, and the few times it does grant a power is because there is a majority of Identities that share potential for a specific power?

Unless we're barking up the wrong tree and this is all just based on what the recipient's power would have been anyway.

Which raises another interesting point—a side effect of Lerasium is making someone a full Mistborn, because they're just smacking pure Preservation into their Spiritweb. Does this mean that everyone actually has the potential for all abilities, and the 'single' power a Misting develops is actually just the least buried, and if you keep pumping them with Preservation-coded Investiture, they'll gradually manifest all the powers?

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

1 hour ago, PanLin said:

Huh, that's interesting. I wonder if that would work better if you stored the recipient's Identity first, then spiked them with this new spike, then let their own Identity back in over the top.

I was thinking about something like that, only continuously storing Identity when you want to use the power. Which probably wouldn't be a great time for the recipient.

1 hour ago, PanLin said:

Like, we know from your quote that a person's Misting/Ferring ability is already decided by their Spiritweb, they just need some extra Preservation and the right conditions to unlock it. To give a specific power, surely you'd have to make sure the recipient's Spiritweb isn't going to colour it somehow, or tailor it specifically. Maybe someone with the conditions to become a Pewterarm needs a Nicrosil spike with a Lurcher's Identity to actually become a Tineye instead, but that same spike given to a Seeker will make them a Smoker.

Hmm, that does sound like an issue, what with Identity Contamination being a thing. This is likely something that you'd probably need a much deeper understanding of the Spiritweb to pull off. 

 

2 hours ago, PanLin said:

We know Godmetals can get pretty funky when used as spikes, so maybe there's one that lets you steal specific aspects of a Spiritweb, literally something like "the chunk of Spiritweb that defines Misting/Ferring powers" as if you're searching through someone's source code for the right data address. Maybe an Ambition or Cultivation spike?

Maybe, we know that anything that can be stored in Feruchemy can be stolen with Hemalurgy.

Spoiler

PhantomMonstrosity

Could you steal any trait Hemalurgically that can be stored Feruchemically?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, you could steal any trait that can be stored.

So, there are plenty of Hemaurgic Properties that we haven't seen yet. Maybe 'Potential' is something that can be stolen? Stealing someone's potential for Allomancy rather than the power itself?

2 hours ago, PanLin said:

Hell, maybe there's another Godmetal out there that can hold an Identity charge without it getting used up. Super speculative, but imagine just having a set of 32 'filters' in your Hemalurgy lab that you just pass Nicrosil spikes through to charge them with specific Allomantic and Feruchemical powers.

Who even knows, besides Brandon. God Metals and their alloys could be used for pretty much anything as far as we know.

2 hours ago, PanLin said:

Unless we're barking up the wrong tree and this is all just based on what the recipient's power would have been anyway.

Which raises another interesting point—a side effect of Lerasium is making someone a full Mistborn, because they're just smacking pure Preservation into their Spiritweb. Does this mean that everyone actually has the potential for all abilities, and the 'single' power a Misting develops is actually just the least buried, and if you keep pumping them with Preservation-coded Investiture, they'll gradually manifest all the powers?

Not quite, Lerasium rewrites your Spiritual DNA to give you a strong Connection to Preservation. So, I don't think its just a matter of power, or at least its a level of power that would take a lot more than 20-30 people to reach, maybe more spikes than you could use without running into either the Flaw or the Limit.

[PanLin they/he]

1 hour ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

So, there are plenty of Hemaurgic Properties that we haven't seen yet. Maybe 'Potential' is something that can be stolen? Stealing someone's potential for Allomancy rather than the power itself?

Well, Chromium stores Fortune and steals Destiny. Maybe that's the key? Nicrosil spike as like an Allomancy engine with a Chromium spike that determines how that Allomancy manifests in you. Then you could even swap your Chromium spikes on the fly for different powers while keeping the Nicrosil one in place.

Making someone a different Misting is definitely something Soul Stampers could do

1 hour ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

Not quite, Lerasium rewrites your Spiritual DNA to give you a strong Connection to Preservation. So, I don't think its just a matter of power, or at least its a level of power that would take a lot more than 20-30 people to reach, maybe more spikes than you could use without running into either the Flaw or the Limit.

True! And that is an important distinction, thanks, but we also know the effect is additive. Mistborns get stronger, and Mistings become Mistborns with a stronger affinity to their original Misting power.

Spoiler

Shardlet

If Vin and Elend hypothetically each blindly ingested equivalently sized beads of lerasium, would Vin be a stronger Mistborn than Elend, or would they be equal?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, Vin would be stronger. It is additive, not just an overwrite.

The same thing happens with Hemalurgy; with Hemalurgy when you’re spiking someone’s soul, you’re ripping off a piece and adding it.

Firefight Seattle UBooks signing (Jan. 6, 2015)

This quote even calls out Hemalurgy, conveniently—in the same way Vin is a stronger Seeker with her earring, Lerasium beads and Nicrosil spikes add to your existing Spiritweb; Lerasium rewrites it to incorporate the new chunk of Preservation, and Nicrosil nails an extra chunk of someone else's Spiritweb to you.

Another couple of wobs talking about how (at least how I read it), Nicrosil spikes used on people from Scadrial essentially steal the chunk of their Spiritweb that is Preservation/Ruin, and how Preservation-coded Investiture, in the form of the mists, can theoretically be used to distill Lerasium.

Spoiler

Volratho (paraphrased)

Humans on Scadrial have Investiture of both Preservation and Ruin inside of them.

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

Yes.

Volratho (paraphrased)

Feruchemically, does storing Investiture in Nicrosil store this connection to Ruin/Preservation/Harmony?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

You are on the right track, and asking the right questions but RAFO.

Shadows of Self Chicago signing (Oct. 12, 2015)

 

Spoiler

BlackYeti

Because you've talked about alloying the god metals with other ones-- I was wondering whether you would be able to melt them down as you would with normal metals.

Brandon Sanderson

If you could distill the god metal: you could distill it out of the mist, that's theoretically possible.

Manchester signing (Aug. 6, 2014)

 

So again, if Lerasium grants all Allomantic powers and boosts existing ones, can enough Preservation-coded Investiture do the same thing? And if so, would you unlock one Misting power first, then all at once when you reach the right threshold, or is it gradual, and your Spiritweb just determines which order you unlock them in?

[Trusk'our he/him]

12 hours ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

-The Set's Nicrosil Spikes work by non-lethally shaving off the excess Preservation Investiture in the souls of all Scadrians, it takes around 20-30 normal people to fully charge a spike. This means that they're trying to make Allomancers by artificially raising the amount of Preservation in a person's soul, we have seen this before.

I would like to point out that we do not have confirmation that the spikes used by the Set are made of nicrosil. I think it's the most likely option, but it could very well be that they tried to use the typical metals for extracting powers because that's what they knew already worked.

I do think that they were probably nicrosil. I just felt the need to point out that it isn't technically canon yet.

19 hours ago, JustQuestin2004 said:

-The Set's Nicrosil Spikes work by non-lethally shaving off the excess Preservation Investiture in the souls of all Scadrians, it takes around 20-30 normal people to fully charge a spike. This means that they're trying to make Allomancers by artificially raising the amount of Preservation in a person's soul, we have seen this before.

--With the Mistsickness, where the Mists went out of its way to forcibly Snap people with Allomantic Potential that was too deep to be brought out by a beating, so the Mists slightly raised the potnetial of these people and forcibly dragged out the power, causing sickness and sometimes death.

  Reveal hidden contents

Brandon Sanderson

The Sliding Scale of Allomantic Potential

Noblemen, despite what Spook says in this chapter, are not immune to the mistsickness. The rumor Spook is referencing does have merit, however. You see, since the mists are Snapping people and awakening the Allomantic potential within them, it will affect far fewer noblemen than skaa. Why? Because a lot of the noblemen have already Snapped. They were beaten as children to bring out the powers.

However, that won't stop all of them from being affected by the mistsickness, because the mistsickness is also awakening Allomantic potential that would otherwise be too subtle to be brought out. Pretend there's a sliding scale of Allomantic potential. 100% means you're an Allomancer—in this series, only two people have hit 100%—Vin and Elend. Buried within a lot of people, however, is enough of a touch of Preservation's power to hit, say, 50% on the relative scale of Allomantic power. These people, when beaten and made to pass through something traumatic, awaken to their Allomantic abilities.

There are a lot of people out there, however, with something more like 20% to 30%. These are the people the mists are Snapping—since the mists are, themselves, partially the power of Preservation, they can touch people and increase their Allomantic potential slightly and then bring it to the forefront.

There is a correlation here, the trauma and raising of Preservation via the Mist is similar to what the Set are trying to accomplish. But its not working as well as they want, only some people are gaining powers and even then its only temporary until the power 'gives out'.

Why is this? I have a guess for that too. Identity Contamination.

We were properly introduced to this concept in TLM, where Marsh stated it is the reason why Hemalurgists in Era 2 are unable to use Compounding. Hemalurgic Spikes are also similar to Metalminds in the way that they are Keyed to the Identity to the person that charged them, the 20-30 victims in this instance. Which means that Nicrosil Spikes have a lot of differeing and conflicting Identities within them.

Now its not quite clear on what is the precise factor/s that decide what kind of Allomancer a person is born as, but I'm willing to bet that Identity is one of those factors. Perhaps all the differing Identities are confusingthe Investiture on what power it should manifest as, and the few times it does grant a power is because there is a majority of Identities that share potential for a specific power?

Therefore the next step to improving the Nicrosil Spikes is to simply Blank the Identities of the victims. Likely through a Malwish Harmonium Device that is charged with F-Aluminum to do it by force. But I don't think this is the end point, as I beleive that this Blank Nicrosil Spike will grant a power, but it will be random, based on what power the person was already slated to gain if they had enough Preservation. For example, one Blanked Spike would make Person A a Coinshot, but if that spike were to be taken out and given to a Person B, it would make them an Augur. This methd would probably also not allow for multiple powers to be granted by just Blanked Spikes, since most people only have the potential for a single power not more.

So how to improve on this and 'code' the spike to give a specific power? Go a step further, figure out a way to determine what power a donor could have had with one of the Blanked Spikes, then if their power is a desired one, make them one of the 20-30 donors but Blank every Donor's identity except theirs so that the Spike will be Keyed only to their Identity, which might  be enough to make the Investiture in the spike to manifest as a particular Allomantic power. Maybe.

It would be a more complex operation requiring specific magical machinery and many people losing a chunk of their souls, but it would theoretically allow for a mass production of Allomantic powers through Hemalurgy.

Or this could be a load of bunk come Era 3 and I'm nothing but a madman with too much time on his hands. You decide!

Sounds like a solid idea.

My personal take on the matter of why the Set's experimental spikes didn't quite work is twofold:

First, as you said, Identity contamination. Having so many conflicting soul fragments in one bindpoint is probably going to confuse the Spiritweb so thoroughly that it's a miracle anything useful would attach to the bearer. I think the reason their was some measure of success was probably because a random piece of Spiritweb temporarily aligned with that already existing in the bearer- i.e. if they had the buried potential to be a Coinshot and a Spiritweb fragment that belonged to a donor that also had the potential (and a higher than average one at that) to be a Coinshot, then they could stack and make the bearer of the spike become a Coinshot until hypothetical fulgurations in the spike caused them to misalign again.

 

Second assumes that the Set was in fact using nicrosil as their Hemalurgic focus for these experimental spikes. From a meta perspective it would be very weird for nicrosil to be capable of achieving the same results as all other power-grafting metals. That's what refined Atium does! It would be awfully weird to give one of the (as I understand it) cheaper metals the very power of Ruin's essence (perhaps less efficiently, but still just as versatile and way, way less expensive).

I'm going to make the leap of logic that nicrosil Hemalurgy can steal more or less any innate Investiture on a Spiritweb, or at least the extra not directly related to a creatures innate attributes, but it does not preserve the original function as well as most spikes. Over time, their contents could decay into a more base form of Investiture, one that isn't coded to provide a specific power as with other spikes, but instead would be like grafting on Breaths or other innate Investitures from different worlds. That would also fit well with this WoB stating that nicrosil is used to steal general Investiture, not powers.

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/472-jordancon-2021/#e14896

Pagerunner

The Hemalurgy table, you wrote down "atium steals any power, lerasium is all abilities, nicrosil is Investiture"; what's the difference between those three?

Hemalurgic atium, lerasium, and nicrosil. What's powers, abilities, and Investiture?

Brandon Sanderson

People are Invested in ways that do not give them active powers. So for instance, everyone on Nalthis is Invested. Everyone in the cosmere is, really. You want to steal their Investiture, but they don't have a power. You're still ripping off a piece of their soul. So there is a distinction between the actual Investiture that's in a human being and a specific power that they have.

So that distinction is pretty easy. You can also, with Hemalurgy, steal specific things. You can steal just general Investiture. You can steal, if you want--this is where the kandra Blessings come from. You can instead steal specific things that are not like stealing Allomancy. Stealing, for instance, someone's mental acuity.

Pagerunner

So abilities is like the half that's all the strength, speed, all that kind of stuff? Those are abilities, versus the Metallic Arts are all powers?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes.

Pagerunner

Then Investiture, is that offworld magics?

Brandon Sanderson

No, no, it's the raw power.

Pagerunner

Nicrosil is their soul?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes. A piece of their soul, essentially.

Pagerunner

So how would you go about stealing an offworld power?

Brandon Sanderson

It's going to depend. A Breath, you would steal with nicrosil. It's general Investiture, is what you would probably going call that. You could forcibly remove someone's Breath from them. The ability to be a Sand Master you would steal with the power ability.

This could help explain why there were some results in the experimental spikes creating powers, but only temporarily. The spikes could have broken them down into a less usable form over time, as that's not what they're designed to do.

[JustQuestin2004 he/him]

10 hours ago, PanLin said:

True! And that is an important distinction, thanks, but we also know the effect is additive. Mistborns get stronger, and Mistings become Mistborns with a stronger affinity to their original Misting power.

  Reveal hidden contents

Shardlet

If Vin and Elend hypothetically each blindly ingested equivalently sized beads of lerasium, would Vin be a stronger Mistborn than Elend, or would they be equal?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, Vin would be stronger. It is additive, not just an overwrite.

The same thing happens with Hemalurgy; with Hemalurgy when you’re spiking someone’s soul, you’re ripping off a piece and adding it.

Firefight Seattle UBooks signing (Jan. 6, 2015)

This quote even calls out Hemalurgy, conveniently—in the same way Vin is a stronger Seeker with her earring, Lerasium beads and Nicrosil spikes add to your existing Spiritweb; Lerasium rewrites it to incorporate the new chunk of Preservation, and Nicrosil nails an extra chunk of someone else's Spiritweb to you.

Another couple of wobs talking about how (at least how I read it), Nicrosil spikes used on people from Scadrial essentially steal the chunk of their Spiritweb that is Preservation/Ruin, and how Preservation-coded Investiture, in the form of the mists, can theoretically be used to distill Lerasium.

  Reveal hidden contents

Volratho (paraphrased)

Humans on Scadrial have Investiture of both Preservation and Ruin inside of them.

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

Yes.

Volratho (paraphrased)

Feruchemically, does storing Investiture in Nicrosil store this connection to Ruin/Preservation/Harmony?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

You are on the right track, and asking the right questions but RAFO.

Shadows of Self Chicago signing (Oct. 12, 2015)

 

  Reveal hidden contents

BlackYeti

Because you've talked about alloying the god metals with other ones-- I was wondering whether you would be able to melt them down as you would with normal metals.

Brandon Sanderson

If you could distill the god metal: you could distill it out of the mist, that's theoretically possible.

Manchester signing (Aug. 6, 2014)

 

So again, if Lerasium grants all Allomantic powers and boosts existing ones, can enough Preservation-coded Investiture do the same thing? And if so, would you unlock one Misting power first, then all at once when you reach the right threshold, or is it gradual, and your Spiritweb just determines which order you unlock them in?

Fair points all around, though I think it might be more likely that additional Unkeyed Nicrosil Spikes will just boost the power you already have.

Could make for an interesting difference, having people with one single power that's boosted beyond natural levels. Like a Lerasium-level Misting. Rioters and Soothers that can take control of Kandra on their own, Augurs and Oracles able to break into the Spiritual Realm just from casual use, and so on.

1 hour ago, Trusk'our said:

I would like to point out that we do not have confirmation that the spikes used by the Set are made of nicrosil. I think it's the most likely option, but it could very well be that they tried to use the typical metals for extracting powers because that's what they knew already worked.

I do think that they were probably nicrosil. I just felt the need to point out that it isn't technically canon yet.

Also fair point, but they do talk about specifically stealing investiture, not powers. And that's a big difference when it comes to the wording of these things. I feel like they would have specified more if they were doing something like that. Like "See, even though this woman isn't a coinshot we've managed to charge this steel spike just a little".

1 hour ago, Trusk'our said:

First, as you said, Identity contamination. Having so many conflicting soul fragments in one bindpoint is probably going to confuse the Spiritweb so thoroughly that it's a miracle anything useful would attach to the bearer. I think the reason their was some measure of success was probably because a random piece of Spiritweb temporarily aligned with that already existing in the bearer- i.e. if they had the buried potential to be a Coinshot and a Spiritweb fragment that belonged to a donor that also had the potential (and a higher than average one at that) to be a Coinshot, then they could stack and make the bearer of the spike become a Coinshot until hypothetical fulgurations in the spike caused them to misalign again.

You put it better than I could and I thank you for that.

1 hour ago, Trusk'our said:

Second assumes that the Set was in fact using nicrosil as their Hemalurgic focus for these experimental spikes. From a meta perspective it would be very weird for nicrosil to be capable of achieving the same results as all other power-grafting metals. That's what refined Atium does! It would be awfully weird to give one of the (as I understand it) cheaper metals the very power of Ruin's essence (perhaps less efficiently, but still just as versatile and way, way less expensive).

I'm going to make the leap of logic that nicrosil Hemalurgy can steal more or less any innate Investiture on a Spiritweb, or at least the extra not directly related to a creatures innate attributes, but it does not preserve the original function as well as most spikes. Over time, their contents could decay into a more base form of Investiture, one that isn't coded to provide a specific power as with other spikes, but instead would be like grafting on Breaths or other innate Investitures from different worlds. That would also fit well with this WoB stating that nicrosil is used to steal general Investiture, not powers.

  Reveal hidden contents

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/472-jordancon-2021/#e14896

Pagerunner

The Hemalurgy table, you wrote down "atium steals any power, lerasium is all abilities, nicrosil is Investiture"; what's the difference between those three?

Hemalurgic atium, lerasium, and nicrosil. What's powers, abilities, and Investiture?

Brandon Sanderson

People are Invested in ways that do not give them active powers. So for instance, everyone on Nalthis is Invested. Everyone in the cosmere is, really. You want to steal their Investiture, but they don't have a power. You're still ripping off a piece of their soul. So there is a distinction between the actual Investiture that's in a human being and a specific power that they have.

So that distinction is pretty easy. You can also, with Hemalurgy, steal specific things. You can steal just general Investiture. You can steal, if you want--this is where the kandra Blessings come from. You can instead steal specific things that are not like stealing Allomancy. Stealing, for instance, someone's mental acuity.

Pagerunner

So abilities is like the half that's all the strength, speed, all that kind of stuff? Those are abilities, versus the Metallic Arts are all powers?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes.

Pagerunner

Then Investiture, is that offworld magics?

Brandon Sanderson

No, no, it's the raw power.

Pagerunner

Nicrosil is their soul?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes. A piece of their soul, essentially.

Pagerunner

So how would you go about stealing an offworld power?

Brandon Sanderson

It's going to depend. A Breath, you would steal with nicrosil. It's general Investiture, is what you would probably going call that. You could forcibly remove someone's Breath from them. The ability to be a Sand Master you would steal with the power ability.

This could help explain why there were some results in the experimental spikes creating powers, but only temporarily. The spikes could have broken them down into a less usable form over time, as that's not what they're designed to do.

Would be a reasonable limit to Nicrosil Spikes for them to only give you enough Preservation Investiture to unlock your own random Allomantic power instead of just granting you a specific Allomantic power like other spikes, so you can't just stack more to gain more powers and it would even still have carry the theme of some people just being born more special than others in Era 3. Since some people would have the potential to be a Coinshot or a Slider, and others would be a Gnat or an Augur. Though with Harmonium Devices the less useful Allomantic powers will probably gain quite a bit of usefulness.

I think, from a meta-perspective, that there's been more than enough foreshadowing that Nicrosil is the key to mass producing Mistings without gratuitous amounts of murder. It'll just require a lot more development.