Magikarp he/him Posted February 1 Posted February 1 Okay, so I was re-reading Alloy of Law, and I read the explanation that is given about the 'new' mistings because of the lineage and ectcetera when I came across an idea. Imagine you gather enough Nicrobursts to make 10 people a chain, touching each other and at the end of the line you place a Coinshot. Now, at the same time, all Nicrobursts start burning nicrosil, while the Coinshot pushes, let's say, a coin. Do the Nicrobursts effect stack? I mean, does the first Nicroburst power up the next's one ability, powering up the next, and so until it reaches the Coinshot with a x10 Nicroburst effect? That would be ridiculously powerful, but extremely situational, because you would need that 10 people to be in contact with each other and with you. What would it look like? Theoretically that Coinshot would be able to push only objects lighter than him/her, but at what speed would that coin fly? At that speed, probably it wouldn't matter if the coin crashes with something other than thick metal, because the Steelpush would be extremely brief and it could probably surpass even a really thick layer of stone. Like damn, what if someone's in the way? You have just disintegrated that person! (Probably it isn't as cool as I think it is, but it was worth a thought)
Trusk'our he/him Posted February 1 Posted February 1 2 minutes ago, Magikarp said: Okay, so I was re-reading Alloy of Law, and I read the explanation that is given about the 'new' mistings because of the lineage and ectcetera when I came across an idea. Imagine you gather enough Nicrobursts to make 10 people a chain, touching each other and at the end of the line you place a Coinshot. Now, at the same time, all Nicrobursts start burning nicrosil, while the Coinshot pushes, let's say, a coin. Do the Nicrobursts effect stack? I mean, does the first Nicroburst power up the next's one ability, powering up the next, and so until it reaches the Coinshot with a x10 Nicroburst effect? That would be ridiculously powerful, but extremely situational, because you would need that 10 people to be in contact with each other and with you. What would it look like? Theoretically that Coinshot would be able to push only objects lighter than him/her, but at what speed would that coin fly? At that speed, probably it wouldn't matter if the coin crashes with something other than thick metal, because the Steelpush would be extremely brief and it could probably surpass even a really thick layer of stone. Like damn, what if someone's in the way? You have just disintegrated that person! (Probably it isn't as cool as I think it is, but it was worth a thought) It's a cool idea, but I don't think it quite works that way. Duralumin and nicrosil Allomancy appear to enhance one's power by burning through all of their fuel in an instant. More metal burned = more Investiture = more potent effect. If the Coinshot had more steel in them to burn, this could probably work. If it's a lot of metal, too much to be instantly burned even with a standard enhancement metal (which I think should be the case because Leeching works that way and is the foil to enhancing) could probably be burned faster if the Nicroburst was enhanced by another Nicroburst themselves. 1
Adonalsium Will Return He/him Posted February 1 Posted February 1 Spiking for duralumin could enhance this as well, as I don’t think Nicrobursting uses up all nicrosil. Also, what if that was applied to lerasium? It probably wouldn’t create an insane Mistborn, but if it did…
Through the Living Hopper He/Him Posted February 1 Posted February 1 6 minutes ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Spiking for duralumin could enhance this as well, as I don’t think Nicrobursting uses up all nicrosil. Also, what if that was applied to lerasium? It probably wouldn’t create an insane Mistborn, but if it did… Duralumin doesn't increase power of Mistborn from Lerasium, so it's reasonable to assume nicrosil doesn't either.
Adonalsium Will Return He/him Posted February 1 Posted February 1 Yeah, I figured. Just wondered if maybe it would work. Anyway, back to the topic. What applications could this have? Pewter- general insane feats of strength Tin- not sure, really Bronze- Seek out everything in a city Copper- not sure, really Steel- send something extremely far and fast Iron- hard to do w/o hurting yourself Zinc- insane Riot, possible uses unknown- break into low-damage spiritweb? Brass- insane Soothe, possible use to calm a crowd rioting Bendalloy- pull a Wayne Cadmium- Hibernate Chromium- Leech, possibly ranged? Aluminum- not sure, really
Trusk'our he/him Posted February 1 Posted February 1 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Yeah, I figured. Just wondered if maybe it would work. Anyway, back to the topic. What applications could this have? Pewter- general insane feats of strength Probably let you heal quickly if you spam it, at the cost of essentially doing a Pewterdrag and exhausting yourself for the repeated influx of Investiture. A little like how Compounding can exhaust a person. Spoiler https://wob.coppermind.net/events/332-jordancon-2018/#e9576 Kaymyth We know that Compounding, if you do it too much, it has permanent effects on a person. Brandon Sanderson Yeah. Kaymyth Compounding for extended stretches, can it have some sort of effect similar to pewter drag, depending on the metal? Brandon Sanderson Yeah. I could say, I would say yes to that. 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Tin- not sure, really Blow up both your retinas and your eardrums simultaneously, then be struck blind, deaf, and dumb. Maybe glean some extra information if you're psyched up for it or dampen some of your other sensory organs ahead of time (i.e. blindfold) 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Bronze- Seek out everything in a city Vin actually shows us this one. Read Investiture far more deeply and intuitively (i.e. tell everything that a Soother is trying to do rather than just getting hints), Seek further, pierce Copperclouds. 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Copper- not sure, really Briefly counter a huge amount of Investiture pressuring your mind or counter duralumin/bronze usage (but unlikely to work given the timing needs to be just right). 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Steel- send something extremely far and fast Become pancake. Alternatively if you have pewter or are Wax, superjump long distances and smoosh things in the process. You might also be capable of seeing with Steelsight like Wax did with the Bands, maybe even going so far as to Push on people's souls (whatever that was supposed to mean when Wax contemplated it). 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Iron- hard to do w/o hurting yourself Die. Or, maybe with pewter survive and Pull on something very powerfully, like an jet in the sky you're trying to catch. 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Zinc- insane Riot, possible uses unknown- break into low-damage spiritweb? Brass- insane Soothe, possible use to calm a crowd rioting Functionally similar to each other- break into damaged Spiritwebs, leave an emotional imprint that sticks with someone (see Straff for example), overwhelm Coppercloud protection. 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Bendalloy- pull a Wayne Yup. Create solid bubble of time essentially (though he had a full stomach of Bendalloy and appeared to be approaching Savanthood, if not having already achieved it. This is likely on the higher end of what most Allomancers could do without artificial enhancement). 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Cadmium- Hibernate Skip forward large swaths of time, probably creating a shield that somewhat protects from outside influences (I'm assuming given Wayne's apparent crystal-like bubble). 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Chromium- Leech, possibly ranged? Seal up cracks in others' Spiritwebs, temporarily or permanently removing access to their powers. Might require them to Snap again to regain them. Spoiler https://wob.coppermind.net/events/385-orem-signing/#e12574 Wyndlerunner You've mentioned in the past aluminum savants being able to somewhat heal their spiritweb, healing them of the cracks, sort of healing them of Allomancy. Could a chromium savant do this to other people, kind of like in the Avatar [The Last Airbender] finale where he seals bending? Brandon Sanderson I will say RAFO, but I will say you're theorizing along correct directions. 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Aluminum- not sure, really Probably same as chromium, but on yourself. Could perhaps be useful to remove large Spiritweb cracks to prevent Emotional Allomancy of great power from seeping in. Might be more useful to someone with a beaten up Spiritweb who just wants it gone.
Adonalsium Will Return He/him Posted February 2 Posted February 2 23 minutes ago, Trusk'our said: 1 hour ago, Adonalsium Will Return said: Steel- send something extremely far and fast Become pancake. Alternatively if you have pewter or are Wax, superjump long distances and smoosh things in the process. You might also be capable of seeing with Steelsight like Wax did with the Bands, maybe even going so far as to Push on people's souls (whatever that was supposed to mean when Wax contemplated it). I think it might be related to Kell’s observations in SH- “metal and souls are the same thing”
NameIess Posted February 16 Posted February 16 On 2/1/2026 at 6:49 PM, Trusk'our said: Probably let you heal quickly if you spam it, at the cost of essentially doing a Pewterdrag and exhausting yourself for the repeated influx of Investiture. A little like how Compounding can exhaust a person. Reveal hidden contents https://wob.coppermind.net/events/332-jordancon-2018/#e9576 Kaymyth We know that Compounding, if you do it too much, it has permanent effects on a person. Brandon Sanderson Yeah. Kaymyth Compounding for extended stretches, can it have some sort of effect similar to pewter drag, depending on the metal? Brandon Sanderson Yeah. I could say, I would say yes to that. Blow up both your retinas and your eardrums simultaneously, then be struck blind, deaf, and dumb. Maybe glean some extra information if you're psyched up for it or dampen some of your other sensory organs ahead of time (i.e. blindfold) Vin actually shows us this one. Read Investiture far more deeply and intuitively (i.e. tell everything that a Soother is trying to do rather than just getting hints), Seek further, pierce Copperclouds. Briefly counter a huge amount of Investiture pressuring your mind or counter duralumin/bronze usage (but unlikely to work given the timing needs to be just right). Become pancake. Alternatively if you have pewter or are Wax, superjump long distances and smoosh things in the process. You might also be capable of seeing with Steelsight like Wax did with the Bands, maybe even going so far as to Push on people's souls (whatever that was supposed to mean when Wax contemplated it). Die. Or, maybe with pewter survive and Pull on something very powerfully, like an jet in the sky you're trying to catch. Functionally similar to each other- break into damaged Spiritwebs, leave an emotional imprint that sticks with someone (see Straff for example), overwhelm Coppercloud protection. Yup. Create solid bubble of time essentially (though he had a full stomach of Bendalloy and appeared to be approaching Savanthood, if not having already achieved it. This is likely on the higher end of what most Allomancers could do without artificial enhancement). Skip forward large swaths of time, probably creating a shield that somewhat protects from outside influences (I'm assuming given Wayne's apparent crystal-like bubble). Seal up cracks in others' Spiritwebs, temporarily or permanently removing access to their powers. Might require them to Snap again to regain them. Reveal hidden contents https://wob.coppermind.net/events/385-orem-signing/#e12574 Wyndlerunner You've mentioned in the past aluminum savants being able to somewhat heal their spiritweb, healing them of the cracks, sort of healing them of Allomancy. Could a chromium savant do this to other people, kind of like in the Avatar [The Last Airbender] finale where he seals bending? Brandon Sanderson I will say RAFO, but I will say you're theorizing along correct directions. Probably same as chromium, but on yourself. Could perhaps be useful to remove large Spiritweb cracks to prevent Emotional Allomancy of great power from seeping in. Might be more useful to someone with a beaten up Spiritweb who just wants it gone. Do aluminum and chromium allow one to seal cracks in the spiritweb? I know WoB’s have said they could purge unwanted investiture, but sealing up cracks seems like a different thing.
Trusk'our he/him Posted February 16 Posted February 16 1 hour ago, NameIess said: Do aluminum and chromium allow one to seal cracks in the spiritweb? I know WoB’s have said they could purge unwanted investiture, but sealing up cracks seems like a different thing. It's been hypothesized to be the case, and Brandon has said that it is the direction he wants us to be looking in regards to the power. Spoiler https://wob.coppermind.net/events/385-orem-signing/#e12574 Wyndlerunner You've mentioned in the past aluminum savants being able to somewhat heal their spiritweb, healing them of the cracks, sort of healing them of Allomancy. Could a chromium savant do this to other people, kind of like in the Avatar [The Last Airbender] finale where he seals bending? Brandon Sanderson I will say RAFO, but I will say you're theorizing along correct directions. Sorry, the WoB I gave in the initial post to help clarify is kind of hidden, merged with the quote box underneath.
Immortal Platypus Posted February 16 Posted February 16 On 2/1/2026 at 4:49 PM, Trusk'our said: Briefly counter a huge amount of Investiture pressuring your mind or counter duralumin/bronze usage (but unlikely to work given the timing needs to be just right). it would probably also counter duralumin + brass/zinc (or TLR's mass soothing effect) which could overcome a normal coppercloud's anti-emotional-tampering effect. Again, timing is basically impossible w/out atium (or potentially F-Chromium), but still technically possible
Trusk'our he/him Posted February 16 Posted February 16 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Immortal Platypus said: it would probably also counter duralumin + brass/zinc (or TLR's mass soothing effect) which could overcome a normal coppercloud's anti-emotional-tampering effect. Again, timing is basically impossible w/out atium (or potentially F-Chromium), but still technically possible Actually, isn't Emotional Allomancy immune to Atium sight? Spoiler https://wob.coppermind.net/events/100-rbooks-ama-2015/#e9038 dwhitlo1 I was re-reading through Vin's fight with Zane, and I think that her method of killing him might be more complicated than necessary. Here is the strategy I would use to fight a mistborn with atium (assuming I have no atium myself or electrum). First I would use a duralumin enhanced soothing to deaden everything except complacency. I would at the same time use a duralumin enhanced riot to spike their sense of complacency. I would then go for the jugular with a duralumin enhanced pewter slash. I think this strategy has a good chance of victory since atium does not show what is going on inside of you, only what you will physically do. Therefore, your enemy will not see the emotional allomancy coming which gives you a few seconds to work with as he is stunned. By the way, if you do not think complacency is a riotable emotion replace it with love. What do you think? Does my strategy have a chance of success? Brandon Sanderson I like this strategy. Thinking outside the proverbial box. I think it has a good chance of succeeding, depending. Remember, emotional Allomancy is NOT mind control. And a duralumin-fueled blast of emotion is going to draw a lot of attention to itself, but will still be stunning. So yes, I'd say this is a valid method of taking on someone with atium. Though, perhaps electrum would work better, since it shows the end state of the person being hit with it. Edited February 16 by Trusk'our
Immortal Platypus Posted February 16 Posted February 16 12 minutes ago, Trusk'our said: Actually, isn't Emotional Allomancy immune to Atium sight? Hide contents https://wob.coppermind.net/events/100-rbooks-ama-2015/#e9038 dwhitlo1 I was re-reading through Vin's fight with Zane, and I think that her method of killing him might be more complicated than necessary. Here is the strategy I would use to fight a mistborn with atium (assuming I have no atium myself or electrum). First I would use a duralumin enhanced soothing to deaden everything except complacency. I would at the same time use a duralumin enhanced riot to spike their sense of complacency. I would then go for the jugular with a duralumin enhanced pewter slash. I think this strategy has a good chance of victory since atium does not show what is going on inside of you, only what you will physically do. Therefore, your enemy will not see the emotional allomancy coming which gives you a few seconds to work with as he is stunned. By the way, if you do not think complacency is a riotable emotion replace it with love. What do you think? Does my strategy have a chance of success? Brandon Sanderson I like this strategy. Thinking outside the proverbial box. I think it has a good chance of succeeding, depending. Remember, emotional Allomancy is NOT mind control. And a duralumin-fueled blast of emotion is going to draw a lot of attention to itself, but will still be stunning. So yes, I'd say this is a valid method of taking on someone with atium. Though, perhaps electrum would work better, since it shows the end state of the person being hit with it. I think if you're burning bronze and no one in the area is burning copper to mask the pulses, it's probably something you could notice with atium, but most people burn copper rather than bronze. I have no basis for that, but it feels to me like something that could work. There's also a distinct world where it doesn't work like that, which is probably more likely, but still. electrum would work better, and i almost said that, but I don't know if electrum enhances your mental state like atium does to help you process the information. if it doesn't, you'd probably need F-zinc to process what happened to you in the future to time the duralumin copper 1
Trusk'our he/him Posted February 16 Posted February 16 10 minutes ago, Immortal Platypus said: I think if you're burning bronze and no one in the area is burning copper to mask the pulses, it's probably something you could notice with atium, but most people burn copper rather than bronze. I have no basis for that, but it feels to me like something that could work. There's also a distinct world where it doesn't work like that, which is probably more likely, but still. Honestly, I think that could have a chance of working, maybe even without Atium depending on your reaction time and whether Pulses are emitted ahead of the power itself. 11 minutes ago, Immortal Platypus said: electrum would work better, and i almost said that, but I don't know if electrum enhances your mental state like atium does to help you process the information. if it doesn't, you'd probably need F-zinc to process what happened to you in the future to time the duralumin copper Yeah, electrum at the very least doesn't give you cognitive enhancements like Atium- it takes a lot of practice to use with effectiveness in quick-paced scenarios. Spoiler https://wob.coppermind.net/events/309-miscellaneous-2016/#e9197 Questioner How does electrum work? Brandon Sanderson Electrum can see future shadows only as far in the future as is done with atium in the books. They use it to counter atium in that they see their own future shadow fighting, and if they see their shadow get hit by an attack, they know to avoid that attack, and they change their own future. This compounds the future shadows they see, which makes it practically as effective at countering atium as atium itself. While the scope of an electrum shadow is very limited, it could be useful in many situations. Like if you were playing tennis, you’d be able to look at your shadow and tell if you managed to hit the ball or not, and adjust accordingly. That would still take a lot of practice to master, but it could be very effective. I do think it should provide something to help though, like how tin allows you to focus on specific sensory inputs and pewter lets you ignore pain and exhaustion. Just much smaller than Atium. Spoiler https://wob.coppermind.net/events/270-the-hero-of-ages-annotations/#e7551 Brandon Sanderson Allomancy's Mental Effects An interesting side note is to watch how Allomancy—all of its forms—enhances the mind in some way. Though the original concept for the magic system focused on different powers—some physical, some mental—the final product always had a mental component. Notice how, when burning tin, Spook is more able to focus on solitary conversations in the room. Or how his mind can filter out the mist or the cloth he wears. Burning pewter or tin will also make the mind more alert and awake. Burning atium not only lets one see a little bit into the future, but also lets one process that information in a useful way. The mind is such a big part of what makes us who we are. I wanted Allomancy to impact the characters—to have an effect you could see on the minds of those using it. As I've stated, one of the places where books can outshine television or movies is in the ability to see exactly what is happening inside a character's thoughts and emotions. By adding a mental component to each of the Allomantic powers, my hope was to play off of this strength of the written form.
Immortal Platypus Posted February 16 Posted February 16 13 minutes ago, Trusk'our said: Honestly, I think that could have a chance of working, maybe even without Atium depending on your reaction time and whether Pulses are emitted ahead of the power itself. I think the pulses come out simultaneously with the power being used, so in the case of a duralumin Soothe/Riot, I don't think you could duralumin copper in time without F-zinc, maybe not even with f-zinc. I do know iron/steel you burn, then have to trigger in order to have the Push/Pull effects, but I don't think that's true of zinc/brass. I think once you burn those, their effect is immediate. Quote Yeah, electrum at the very least doesn't give you cognitive enhancements like Atium- it takes a lot of practice to use with effectiveness in quick-paced scenarios. Hide contents https://wob.coppermind.net/events/309-miscellaneous-2016/#e9197 Questioner How does electrum work? Brandon Sanderson Electrum can see future shadows only as far in the future as is done with atium in the books. They use it to counter atium in that they see their own future shadow fighting, and if they see their shadow get hit by an attack, they know to avoid that attack, and they change their own future. This compounds the future shadows they see, which makes it practically as effective at countering atium as atium itself. While the scope of an electrum shadow is very limited, it could be useful in many situations. Like if you were playing tennis, you’d be able to look at your shadow and tell if you managed to hit the ball or not, and adjust accordingly. That would still take a lot of practice to master, but it could be very effective. I do think it should provide something to help though, like how tin allows you to focus on specific sensory inputs and pewter lets you ignore pain and exhaustion. Just much smaller than Atium. Hide contents https://wob.coppermind.net/events/270-the-hero-of-ages-annotations/#e7551 Brandon Sanderson Allomancy's Mental Effects An interesting side note is to watch how Allomancy—all of its forms—enhances the mind in some way. Though the original concept for the magic system focused on different powers—some physical, some mental—the final product always had a mental component. Notice how, when burning tin, Spook is more able to focus on solitary conversations in the room. Or how his mind can filter out the mist or the cloth he wears. Burning pewter or tin will also make the mind more alert and awake. Burning atium not only lets one see a little bit into the future, but also lets one process that information in a useful way. The mind is such a big part of what makes us who we are. I wanted Allomancy to impact the characters—to have an effect you could see on the minds of those using it. As I've stated, one of the places where books can outshine television or movies is in the ability to see exactly what is happening inside a character's thoughts and emotions. By adding a mental component to each of the Allomantic powers, my hope was to play off of this strength of the written form. I think that electrum's mental enhancement would probably manifesting as knowing what caused your shadow to do what it did, and not as increased processing speed.
Trusk'our he/him Posted February 16 Posted February 16 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Immortal Platypus said: I think that electrum's mental enhancement would probably manifesting as knowing what caused your shadow to do what it did, and not as increased processing speed. Personally, I think that's the more powerful option, since you're already seeing the future and you can train reflexive action to respond to such stimuli. Six of the Dusk spoilers: Spoiler At most I think it would be more of a general hint unless supercharged though, since the closest cousin magic- Sak's talent- only shows one's corpse and the aftermath of one's death, not the direct cause of that death. Edited February 16 by Trusk'our
Immortal Platypus Posted February 16 Posted February 16 28 minutes ago, Trusk'our said: Personally, I think that's the more powerful option, since you're already seeing the future and you can train reflexive action to respond to such stimuli. Six of the Dusk spoilers: Hide contents At most I think it would be more of a general hint unless supercharged though, since the closest cousin magic- Sak's talent- only shows one's corpse and the aftermath of one's death, not the direct cause of that death. yes, I don't mean instant exact knowledge, just an easier way of figuring it out. for example, if I get hit by an arrow or stabbed by a spear, those two wounds could look very similar. there would likely be some clue or subtle idea that would let you know which one 1
Trusk'our he/him Posted February 16 Posted February 16 3 hours ago, Immortal Platypus said: yes, I don't mean instant exact knowledge, just an easier way of figuring it out. for example, if I get hit by an arrow or stabbed by a spear, those two wounds could look very similar. there would likely be some clue or subtle idea that would let you know which one Ah, understood. Yes, I think that would work just fine.
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