The Case for Nerfing Unsealed Metalminds (And How It's Already Done)

[Trusk'our he/him]

As Scadrial's ability to produce Unsealed Metalminds advances, I worry that the innate abilities of Metalborn and the niche of Hemalurgy may lose their validity. Why care if your Pewterarm/Bloodmaker Twinborn bodyguard was a natural Misting with a gold spike or just a decently trained dude with a Metalmind he bought from the store?

Well, I did have that worry, but I actually think Unsealed Metalminds may have more severe restrictions than previously assumed.

It is my current belief and theory that the ways to access the Metallic Arts can be roughly categorized into three groups along a spectrum.

On the far right, we have Metalborn who have overused their Investiture, becoming Savants. The power begins to permeate and transform the rest of their Spiritweb to conform to its Intent, allowing the practitioner to be highly efficient in their energy use and giving them far greater control over the Investiture.

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/36-arcanum-unbounded-chicago-signing/#e1557

Questioner

So Allomantic Savants. So I was curious-- That system-- When that happens, is it purely physiological, or is there something else happening in terms of--

Brandon Sanderson

Uhh, it's physiological in a cosmere sense, but that can involve your Cognitive and Spiritual aspects.

Questioner

I guess the question there is, are there other similar processes to savantism with other--

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah, yeah you've seen it. So, Soulcasters.

Argent

Where their skin turns--

Brandon Sanderson

Where they're slowly being-- their spirit is slowly being merged and infused with Investiture that is having Physical ramifications. It's the same thing.

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/73-shadows-of-self-san-francisco-signing/#e4303

Questioner

There is quantitative difference in Allomancy (e.g. Elend is stronger than Vin), there is skill difference (e.g. Breeze is better than Vin with zinc), but is there a qualitative difference too?

Brandon Sanderson

That’s the scale of what we call savant. Wax can do more with less. It’s not just skill, the burning for long, using for so long, will actually adapt your soul to the power.

Questioner

So can bronze savants pierce copperclouds?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, a bronze savant should be able to pierce copperclouds. It depends on the strengths of the coppercloud and the strength of the savant, but yes.

Questioner

So Elend could theoretically learn to pierce copperclouds?

Brandon Sanderson

Weaker ones, yeah, totally. He can learn how to do it by brute force.

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/369-skyward-san-francisco-signing/#e11691

Questioner

With a cadmium or bendalloy savant, would they be able to impact the amount of time that they can compress or expand?

Brandon Sanderson

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Questioner

So they could fit-- Theoretically they could make-- fit more time into the same amount of metal.

Brandon Sanderson

Oh, that's what you're asking. Yeee-- *pauses* So, yes, technically, because... Yes, but mostly what that's going to do is going to influence your strength and how much you can multiply--

Questioner

The size of the bubble?

Brandon Sanderson

The size of the bubble and the amount of time, like when you flare, you are pressing more time into it and a savant is gonna get really good at that. They're gonna get good at changing the bubble and the shape of the bubble, they're gonna get good at some of the other things involving the bubble. It does technically, as you become a savant, does mean you're able to squeeze a little bit more out of your metal, because that's just how it works, but that's not the main effect.

However, this comes at the cost of irrevocably binding them to the Investiture (at least in most cases), making them dependent upon it for functioning "normally", and even then it will warp individuals in undesirable ways (i.e. Tineye Savants feeling overwhelming sensitivity and pain and Pewterarm Savants running themselves into the ground because they can no longer feel pain or exhaustion enough).

On the far left, we have Unsealed Metalminds. These are kind of the opposite of Savants, I think: they can much more easily remove their power and swap it out or abandon it. However, their are more "restrictions" on how they can be used and like their ancient cousins, the Honorblades, I believe they'd be far less efficient with their Investiture use.

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/361-skyward-pre-release-ama/#e11519

Calderis

Does the nicrosil portion of the medallions function identitically to how a Soulbearer Ferring would use Nicrosil? 

Brandon Sanderson

Not exactly. The medallion is a little more restrictive, for one thing.

But, what advantages do natural Metalborn or Hemalurgically derived powers have then? A little extra efficiency is great, but in the grand scheme of things not too massive.

Well, I think that Unsealed Metalminds, at least as they currently exist, are too far removed from the Spiritual Aspect of their wielders to provide them with the same level of protection that Hemalurgically or innately derived powers would.

@Sythrin asked a question about Nomad's weight-enhancing shackles in TSM and why they seemed to restrict him so much since Feruchemy is supposed to shield the user from that sort of thing. My initial thought was that it was simply a matter of the Spiritual Aspect not adapting as quickly as the added mass racks up, which is still true when tapping a lot.

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/361-skyward-pre-release-ama/#e11520

Calderis

I recently got the opportunity to ask you a question about Feruchemical steel and if it was a temporal effect and you told me to define that better. When tapping steel, the mind of the Feruchemist is sped up and physics affects their actions normally. When storing, their mind is not slowed and the effect seems tortuously difficult to amass. Storing generally seems to be the more dangerous/difficult option in Feruchemy, so does [Feruchemical steel] alter a person's personal relationship to the flow of time, with the disconnect between the Physical and Cognitive as a drawback of storing?

Brandon Sanderson

I see what you're asking. The mind-altering effects of [Feruchemical steel] are similar to the slight strength you gain from [Feruchemical iron]--it is your Spiritual nature adapting to the new influx of an attribute that it's not really expecting, and siphoning some of that investiture to make you capable of actually using it. So there is a slight temporal effect here, but nothing as big as I think you're looking for.

 

Footnote: This question is a follow-up to this question.

However, Nomad was only a few times heavier and still had the advantage of inhuman strength, if I recall, which doesn't fit his struggle. 

This leads me to believe that the weak bond between Metalmind and user isn't deep enough to properly adapt the Spiritweb to the Investiture being used, at least not conventionally. Heck, Radiants can heal spiritual injuries that Honorblades without the Surge of Regrowth because their bond is stronger, which I believe supports this idea.

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/116-general-reddit-2017/#e4788

Brandon Sanderson

A full-blown Radiant can heal almost anything (cut from a Shardblade included) because of the way the magic works--their soul is literally bonded to Investiture, and it suffuses them in such a way that even the soul is very resilient to damage.

Honorblades are what you'd consider a "prototype" for what eventually happened with Shardblades. An Honorblade can be used by anyone, without need for oaths, which makes them very dangerous--but since the bond isn't as deep, they are far less efficient. They use more Stormlight, for example, and can't heal to the extent that a Radiant can.

So the difference is not in the device that did the damage, but in the method using to heal. Over the course of the first two book, the reader should be able to subtly pick out differences from what Szeth says is possible (in more than just healing) and what Kaladin experiences.

All of this together makes me think that other powers granted via Unsealed Metalmind would face similar limitations. Steelminds may not speed up the mind of the user or fully protect them from the Gs of moving so quickly, forcing the user to tap much more slowly. Brassminds may be able to cool or heat you within regular human bounds, but try pushing it beyond that and you might hurt yourself. Zincminds may not only drain calories faster, but perhaps oxygen, making you lightheaded or faint if you tap too quickly.

 

TLDR my overly long post, I believe that we don't have to worry about Unsealed Metalminds replacing innate Metalborn or Hemalurgically granted powers because I think that they will function as a foil to Savantism- something more removed from the practitioner with less overall efficiency, less control, and less protection. However, they will be easier to get ahold of, can stack/overlap with innate powers, and can be modified or automated in ways natural powers cannot.

(I also want to briefly mention that I did not forget about Soulcasting Savants, which use a mechanaical form of Investiture usage but still can be warped by it. I think this kind of falls into its own category, as they still have real limits to them and don't have the same versatility that Radiant Soulcasters have. Perhaps this is also a danger of using mechanical Investiture, where it might have an easier time corrupting your Spiritweb than innate abilities that could perhaps have some natural buffers in place.)

[DoctaDajman]

45 minutes ago, Trusk'our said:

As Scadrial's ability to produce Unsealed Metalminds advances, I worry that the innate abilities of Metalborn and the niche of Hemalurgy may lose their validity. Why care if your Pewterarm/Bloodmaker Twinborn bodyguard was a natural Misting with a gold spike or just a decently trained dude with a Metalmind he bought from the store?

Well, I did have that worry, but I actually think Unsealed Metalminds may have more severe restrictions than previously assumed.

It is my current belief and theory that the ways to access the Metallic Arts can be roughly categorized into three groups along a spectrum.

On the far right, we have Metalborn who have overused their Investiture, becoming Savants. The power begins to permeate and transform the rest of their Spiritweb to conform to its Intent, allowing the practitioner to be highly efficient in their energy use and giving them far greater control over the Investiture.

  Hide contents

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/36-arcanum-unbounded-chicago-signing/#e1557

Questioner

So Allomantic Savants. So I was curious-- That system-- When that happens, is it purely physiological, or is there something else happening in terms of--

Brandon Sanderson

Uhh, it's physiological in a cosmere sense, but that can involve your Cognitive and Spiritual aspects.

Questioner

I guess the question there is, are there other similar processes to savantism with other--

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah, yeah you've seen it. So, Soulcasters.

Argent

Where their skin turns--

Brandon Sanderson

Where they're slowly being-- their spirit is slowly being merged and infused with Investiture that is having Physical ramifications. It's the same thing.

  Reveal hidden contents

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/73-shadows-of-self-san-francisco-signing/#e4303

Questioner

There is quantitative difference in Allomancy (e.g. Elend is stronger than Vin), there is skill difference (e.g. Breeze is better than Vin with zinc), but is there a qualitative difference too?

Brandon Sanderson

That’s the scale of what we call savant. Wax can do more with less. It’s not just skill, the burning for long, using for so long, will actually adapt your soul to the power.

Questioner

So can bronze savants pierce copperclouds?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, a bronze savant should be able to pierce copperclouds. It depends on the strengths of the coppercloud and the strength of the savant, but yes.

Questioner

So Elend could theoretically learn to pierce copperclouds?

Brandon Sanderson

Weaker ones, yeah, totally. He can learn how to do it by brute force.

  Reveal hidden contents

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/369-skyward-san-francisco-signing/#e11691

Questioner

With a cadmium or bendalloy savant, would they be able to impact the amount of time that they can compress or expand?

Brandon Sanderson

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Questioner

So they could fit-- Theoretically they could make-- fit more time into the same amount of metal.

Brandon Sanderson

Oh, that's what you're asking. Yeee-- *pauses* So, yes, technically, because... Yes, but mostly what that's going to do is going to influence your strength and how much you can multiply--

Questioner

The size of the bubble?

Brandon Sanderson

The size of the bubble and the amount of time, like when you flare, you are pressing more time into it and a savant is gonna get really good at that. They're gonna get good at changing the bubble and the shape of the bubble, they're gonna get good at some of the other things involving the bubble. It does technically, as you become a savant, does mean you're able to squeeze a little bit more out of your metal, because that's just how it works, but that's not the main effect.

However, this comes at the cost of irrevocably binding them to the Investiture (at least in most cases), making them dependent upon it for functioning "normally", and even then it will warp individuals in undesirable ways (i.e. Tineye Savants feeling overwhelming sensitivity and pain and Pewterarm Savants running themselves into the ground because they can no longer feel pain or exhaustion enough).

On the far left, we have Unsealed Metalminds. These are kind of the opposite of Savants, I think: they can much more easily remove their power and swap it out or abandon it. However, their are more "restrictions" on how they can be used and like their ancient cousins, the Honorblades, I believe they'd be far less efficient with their Investiture use.

  Reveal hidden contents

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/361-skyward-pre-release-ama/#e11519

Calderis

Does the nicrosil portion of the medallions function identitically to how a Soulbearer Ferring would use Nicrosil? 

Brandon Sanderson

Not exactly. The medallion is a little more restrictive, for one thing.

But, what advantages do natural Metalborn or Hemalurgically derived powers have then? A little extra efficiency is great, but in the grand scheme of things not too massive.

Well, I think that Unsealed Metalminds, at least as they currently exist, are too far removed from the Spiritual Aspect of their wielders to provide them with the same level of protection that Hemalurgically or innately derived powers would.

@Sythrin asked a question about Nomad's weight-enhancing shackles in TSM and why they seemed to restrict him so much since Feruchemy is supposed to shield the user from that sort of thing. My initial thought was that it was simply a matter of the Spiritual Aspect not adapting as quickly as the added mass racks up, which is still true when tapping a lot.

  Reveal hidden contents

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/361-skyward-pre-release-ama/#e11520

Calderis

I recently got the opportunity to ask you a question about Feruchemical steel and if it was a temporal effect and you told me to define that better. When tapping steel, the mind of the Feruchemist is sped up and physics affects their actions normally. When storing, their mind is not slowed and the effect seems tortuously difficult to amass. Storing generally seems to be the more dangerous/difficult option in Feruchemy, so does [Feruchemical steel] alter a person's personal relationship to the flow of time, with the disconnect between the Physical and Cognitive as a drawback of storing?

Brandon Sanderson

I see what you're asking. The mind-altering effects of [Feruchemical steel] are similar to the slight strength you gain from [Feruchemical iron]--it is your Spiritual nature adapting to the new influx of an attribute that it's not really expecting, and siphoning some of that investiture to make you capable of actually using it. So there is a slight temporal effect here, but nothing as big as I think you're looking for.

 

Footnote: This question is a follow-up to this question.

However, Nomad was only a few times heavier and still had the advantage of inhuman strength, if I recall, which doesn't fit his struggle. 

This leads me to believe that the weak bond between Metalmind and user isn't deep enough to properly adapt the Spiritweb to the Investiture being used, at least not conventionally. Heck, Radiants can heal spiritual injuries that Honorblades without the Surge of Regrowth because their bond is stronger, which I believe supports this idea.

  Reveal hidden contents

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/116-general-reddit-2017/#e4788

Brandon Sanderson

A full-blown Radiant can heal almost anything (cut from a Shardblade included) because of the way the magic works--their soul is literally bonded to Investiture, and it suffuses them in such a way that even the soul is very resilient to damage.

Honorblades are what you'd consider a "prototype" for what eventually happened with Shardblades. An Honorblade can be used by anyone, without need for oaths, which makes them very dangerous--but since the bond isn't as deep, they are far less efficient. They use more Stormlight, for example, and can't heal to the extent that a Radiant can.

So the difference is not in the device that did the damage, but in the method using to heal. Over the course of the first two book, the reader should be able to subtly pick out differences from what Szeth says is possible (in more than just healing) and what Kaladin experiences.

All of this together makes me think that other powers granted via Unsealed Metalmind would face similar limitations. Steelminds may not speed up the mind of the user or fully protect them from the Gs of moving so quickly, forcing the user to tap much more slowly. Brassminds may be able to cool or heat you within regular human bounds, but try pushing it beyond that and you might hurt yourself. Zincminds may not only drain calories faster, but perhaps oxygen, making you lightheaded or faint if you tap too quickly.

 

TLDR my overly long post, I believe that we don't have to worry about Unsealed Metalminds replacing innate Metalborn or Hemalurgically granted powers because I think that they will function as a foil to Savantism- something more removed from the practitioner with less overall efficiency, less control, and less protection. However, they will be easier to get ahold of, can stack/overlap with innate powers, and can be modified or automated in ways natural powers cannot.

(I also want to briefly mention that I did not forget about Soulcasting Savants, which use a mechanaical form of Investiture usage but still can be warped by it. I think this kind of falls into its own category, as they still have real limits to them and don't have the same versatility that Radiant Soulcasters have. Perhaps this is also a danger of using mechanical Investiture, where it might have an easier time corrupting your Spiritweb than innate abilities that could perhaps have some natural buffers in place.)

I agree that the medallions will have limitations. I dont even believe we saw them be used as true metalminds with storing and withdrawing. They seemed to be one way or another usage wise for the most part.  

The bands of mourning dont seem to have the same limits you are describing. If they can be multiplied via the compounding of all 32 powers they hold then there is little reason why they couldn't be duplicated.  

While I dont want to see everyone become fullborn its kind of like the cryptonians all coming and fighting against superman right? Just gods fighting it out.  

 

I dont share the same worries though. I think the amount of powers allowable js a pretty decent limiting factor. And I think it was hinted at in bands of mourning that beyond 3 in a medallion was asking for trouble. Either way, being a natural born metalborn is awesome and efficiency is a big deal. But the things I am.most excited for on scadrial is magitech becoming more common and the entire population progressing towards living lives blessed by magic even though the bloodline is weaker. 

But to each their own in terms of what they want to see. I am just a big fan of everyone having access to life altering abilities.  It would be storied driven by the combinations possible that are fun and each combo would still offer unique, arguably more so than being limited to naturally born users, possibilities. 

[Nitpicking]

57 minutes ago, Trusk'our said:

(I also want to briefly mention that I did not forget about Soulcasting Savants, which use a mechanaical form of Investiture usage but still can be warped by it. I think this kind of falls into its own category, as they still have real limits to them and don't have the same versatility that Radiant Soulcasters have. Perhaps this is also a danger of using mechanical Investiture, where it might have an easier time corrupting your Spiritweb than innate abilities that could perhaps have some natural buffers in place.)

Navani, always analytical, has figured out that old-school fabrials like Soulcasters have a volunteer sapient spren living in them, who voluntarily spends centuries in that useful role. I would argue that a (person called a) Soulcaster has something similar to a Nahel bond with their (device called a) Soulcaster. They aren't just using a machine, even if they think they are.

[Trusk'our he/him]

On 10/3/2025 at 8:58 PM, DoctaDajman said:

The bands of mourning dont seem to have the same limits you are describing. If they can be multiplied via the compounding of all 32 powers they hold then there is little reason why they couldn't be duplicated.  

I forgot about that dadgum Rusting spearhead.

That's a really good point, but I'm not entirely convinced they have the same limits as regular medallions. For one, they actually drain their Nicrosil stores while medallion tech doesn't seem to, relying more wholly on a bonding mechanic.

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/316-general-signed-books-2018/#e11247

Pagerunner

When you tap the nicrosil portion of a medallion, will it run out over time? Or is it like a coppermind, where something discrete is taken, used, and returned?

Brandon Sanderson

Good question! Like a coppermind.

Plus, if you actually pull the Soulbearing power of the Metalmind into yourself, perhaps this eliminates the previous non-adaptive disadvantages, albeit with the cost of more finite Nicrosil. Or at least that's what I'm currently proposing to prop up my strawman theory.

On 10/3/2025 at 8:58 PM, DoctaDajman said:

I dont share the same worries though. I think the amount of powers allowable js a pretty decent limiting factor. And I think it was hinted at in bands of mourning that beyond 3 in a medallion was asking for trouble. Either way, being a natural born metalborn is awesome and efficiency is a big deal.

I mean, yeah, efficiency is a big deal. It's already important limitation with Hemalurgy, which has a lot of other things going for it.

But I'm not sure I'm personally comfortable with the idea of just handing a common weight medallion to any Coinshot off the street to make a building-crushing Crasher, or allowing a Pewterarm to Steelrun their way through all their problems. Having some extra limitations would be beneficial, and could even enrich the overall setting by allowing more thoughts on how to eventually bypass Unsealed Metalminds' limits.

On 10/3/2025 at 8:58 PM, DoctaDajman said:

But the things I am.most excited for on scadrial is magitech becoming more common and the entire population progressing towards living lives blessed by magic even though the bloodline is weaker. 

But to each their own in terms of what they want to see. I am just a big fan of everyone having access to life altering abilities.  It would be storied driven by the combinations possible that are fun and each combo would still offer unique, arguably more so than being limited to naturally born users, possibilities. 

I suppose I can be on board with that idea too, though maybe with some extra caveats.

Pretty much any time I sit down to think about how to hypothetically mess with things on Scadrial I tend to think in terms of a Mistless Skaa. I find it a lot more interesting to think of paths to power and innovation when you have the play the underdog roll and work without fate lending you supernatural genetics.

On 10/3/2025 at 9:06 PM, Nitpicking said:

Navani, always analytical, has figured out that old-school fabrials like Soulcasters have a volunteer sapient spren living in them, who voluntarily spends centuries in that useful role. I would argue that a (person called a) Soulcaster has something similar to a Nahel bond with their (device called a) Soulcaster. They aren't just using a machine, even if they think they are.

A fair point. I don't think this is terribly different from current Unsealed tech, which also uses a bonding mechanism to gift people access to Investiture.

So, perhaps using "mechanical Investiture" when I spoke about Metalminds wasn't terribly accurate. True mechanical Investiture is probably closer to using a Fabrial clock, heating Fabrial, or Spanreeds. Still, I believe that the use of Unsealed Metalminds, at least in their current iteration, have notable pros and cons compared to the innate Metallic Arts.

[Qianweilian He/him]

9 hours ago, Trusk'our said:

I forgot about that dadgum Rusting spearhead

I don't think that the BoM are normal metalminds. We still don't know why they mysteriously ran out in TLM.

[Sythrin]

On 10/4/2025 at 4:06 AM, Trusk'our said:

Sythrin asked a question about Nomad's weight-enhancing shackles in TSM and why they seemed to restrict him so much since Feruchemy is supposed to shield the user from that sort of thing. My initial thought was that it was simply a matter of the Spiritual Aspect not adapting as quickly as the added mass racks up, which is still true when tapping a lot

Just for the interest. What do the implications for other metalminds mean if you thought about this?
Do you think you can force somebody to tap their attribute into a metal mind?`Like make them slower because they are storing their speed?

 

[Trusk'our he/him]

2 hours ago, Sythrin said:

Just for the interest. What do the implications for other metalminds mean if you thought about this?
Do you think you can force somebody to tap their attribute into a metal mind?`Like make them slower because they are storing their speed?

Well, we've seen the TSM that weight can be forcibly tapped and heat can be forcibly stored, which alone is pretty powerful.

Steel, as you mention, could be scary because forcibly storing could reduce someone to a snail's pace, pewter could weaken you too much to let you stand or otherwise lift your own bodyweight, iron when tapped makes you too heavy to move effectively and tapping could make you a bit weaker and definitely more clumsy, and brass can freeze you into unconsciousness. All very good to immediately rendering a person's physical resistance irrelevant.

Bronze might be similar, but more enduring, as you can knock them unconscious more humanely and keep them asleep, plus if kept for prisoner transfer prevents them from scheming or being able to act pretty much at all.

Zinc is probably best just for keeping a planner under wraps, Taravangian style.

Tin could be interesting, as you could forcibly heighten a specific sense like hearing to easily overwhelm a person, though storing could automatically blind or deafen an opponent.

Chromium storing might make someone more susceptible to others' plans, since their innate ability to sense good or poor situations is a bit messed up.

Aluminum makes you more susceptible to "all kinds of things" in the Cosmere, and combining it with nicrosil might let you steal their power(s) for yourself. Speaking of which, nicrosil might be the best when disabling powerful Invested, since it literally focuses on removing their power. Even those like Nomad that could normally resist other attributes could probably be countered with a hostile Nicrosilmind combined with another attribute dampener.

A hostile Duraluminmind covertly placed on a person might be able to force friendly Connections away from someone, making them unlikable or unnoticeable to specific individuals, or maybe force a friendly internal response like Emotional Allomancy can without an Allomancer needing to be present.

Gold and cadmium are just evil, where gold would probably have a lot less of an immediate effect (other than preventing regeneration on enemy Invested and stealing it for yourself) and if used continually would slowly kill a person via illness. Cadmium is basically a manual breathing spell. Which just sucks and while it can absolutely knock your enemies out, other attributes would probably be just as effective (like bronze).

Bendalloy could specifically counter Lift or Sandmasters and Aetherbound, but other than that I don't see being amazingly powerful as an offensive weapon.

Copper is particularly devious, as you could take much of what makes a person them. Or, implant a false memory to trick them into an action, maybe even fully brainwash a person better than any Emotional Allomancy could. This one at least may have some checks put on it though, as it might be too OP without such (though some extra tampering might negate this limitation).

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/524-brandons-bookclub-yumi/#e16338

Jackson Dickert

We learn [Yumi]'s repeated this day for 1700 years, and her memory is patched over by the father machine. If memory and Investiture are so closely tied together, is the father machine also taking her Investiture? How does that work, because she's such a highly Invested individual, it seems like if it could take any Investiture from her, it would take all of it, like the nightmares did.

Brandon Sanderson

When I play with this, with tweaking memory and things like that, my go-to in the cosmere, in the three cases where you've seen it happen, is that those excising memories have to be really, really careful, or the body will reject what you're doing. So, all three times you've seen it happen, it's been one little sliver of memory is getting changed. The father machine might even just be overwriting it each day, basically blanking that Investiture, but not stealing any of it. Vasher does pull a little bit out when he takes the memory, and the same thing happens with Wit when it happened to him. But I think the father machine's doing it in a slightly different way, and it has to be really careful, or it'll be too obvious, and the whole illusion, the facade, will collapse.

So, I think most of them could be good for neutralizing enemies in different, somewhat redundant ways, but a few might have other interesting capacities. You could probably also make use of the stolen Investiture if you could blank it with aluminum, which is quite useful.

Edited October 7, 2025 by Trusk'our