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Dragonborn

Belandrius Ohhmar

By Belandrius Ohhmar
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Nitpicking

Nitpicking

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Are you in the right area? This is the forum to discuss the novel Wind and Truth, and how it relates to other Cosmere books. We only see dragons on-screen in ... let me think ... Tress of the Emerald Sea. And the non-canon Dragonsteel Prime. And I guess in WaT, in the form of Endowment.

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SpartanBrigade

SpartanBrigade He/Him

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11 hours ago, Bel Oh said:

Possible not Possible? Overpowered or not? What would they look like? anything Dragonborn Here

Hey! Next time you might want to have this in the Cosmere Discussion area just underneath Cosmere Q&A. Dragonborn are almost certainly possible as Cultivation’s Vessel Korevellium Avast was in a romantic relationship with Tanavast, Honor’s Vessel. Both were involved prior to Ascending and continued their relationship afterward as well. Cosmere dragons all have a human/very human like form as well as a classic winged dragon form. Anyways TLDR we’ve seen a human and a dragon in a relationship already so a dragonborn is almost certainly possible.

2 hours ago, Nitpicking said:

Are you in the right area? This is the forum to discuss the novel Wind and Truth, and how it relates to other Cosmere books. We only see dragons on-screen in ... let me think ... Tress of the Emerald Sea. And the non-canon Dragonsteel Prime. And I guess in WaT, in the form of Endowment.

Edgli/Endowment isn’t a dragon. Brandon confirmed there was only one dragon Shard, confirmed to be Koravellium Avast/Cultivation

Dragonsteel Mini-Con 2021 (Nov. 22, 2021)

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/452/#e14564

We know there were  only three sentient species on Yolen; Sho Del, humans, and dragons. Given Sho Del naming conventions seem to be two short words (Uli Da, Jan Ven) and we know she’s not a dragon, Endowment is lost certainly human

Nitpicking

Nitpicking

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1 hour ago, SpartanBrigade said:

Hey! Next time you might want to have this in the Cosmere Discussion area just underneath Cosmere Q&A. Dragonborn are almost certainly possible as Cultivation’s Vessel Korevellium Avast was in a romantic relationship with Tanavast, Honor’s Vessel. Both were involved prior to Ascending and continued their relationship afterward as well. Cosmere dragons all have a human/very human like form as well as a classic winged dragon form. Anyways TLDR we’ve seen a human and a dragon in a relationship already so a dragonborn is almost certainly possible.

Edgli/Endowment isn’t a dragon. Brandon confirmed there was only one dragon Shard, confirmed to be Koravellium Avast/Cultivation

Dragonsteel Mini-Con 2021 (Nov. 22, 2021)

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/452/#e14564

We know there were  only three sentient species on Yolen; Sho Del, humans, and dragons. Given Sho Del naming conventions seem to be two short words (Uli Da, Jan Ven) and we know she’s not a dragon, Endowment is lost certainly human

If you think about it, you could argue that the Sibling is half-dragon, since Kor is a dragon and Tanner a human.

I don't think that's right, what with the Sibling being a spren, but ....

SpartanBrigade

SpartanBrigade He/Him

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Just now, Nitpicking said:

If you think about it, you could argue that the Sibling is half-dragon, since Kor is a dragon and Tanner a human.

I don't think that's right, what with the Sibling being a spren, but ....

Oh yeah that’s a good point. Every Radiant spren except honorspren and cultivationspren would technically be dragonborn too. I think the original poster was talking about dragonborn as the biological children of a human and a dragon rather than spren though

Jult

Jult

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16 hours ago, Nitpicking said:

We only see dragons on-screen in ... let me think ... Tress of the Emerald Sea. And the non-canon Dragonsteel Prime. And I guess in WaT, in the form of Endowment Cultivation.

There are also some 'offscreen' dragons:

  • Hoid exchanges letters with Frost (a dragon) and Frost's sister in WoR
  • In the Epilogue of WaT Hoid uses a Tamu Kek to contact "the meditative realm of the dragons" for "wisdom of the ancient dead"... Whatever that means.
13 hours ago, SpartanBrigade said:

Brandon confirmed there was only one dragon Shard, confirmed to be Koravellium Avast/Cultivation

Oh, I've been meaning to bring this up somewhere. Tanavast refers to Medelantorius (Valor's Vessel) as "the great dragon god" in Chapter 115 of WaT. I assumed this was just some kind of title and not literal because of the WoB you referenced, but now his Coppermind page has him listed as a dragon too. 

Belandrius Ohhmar

Belandrius Ohhmar He/Him

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this is so cool, also what type of abilities because assuming they have access to lots of different investiture forms (I think he said that during FanX Utah like last year.) they would be exceptionally powerful, like if the dragon from tress were to "mate" with a human and create a dragonborn what specifically do we think they would look like; tall and magestic, human sized with talons a tail and scales. and also their investiture would be crazy how do we think that would work?

SpartanBrigade

SpartanBrigade He/Him

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1 hour ago, Jult said:

There are also some 'offscreen' dragons:

  • Hoid exchanges letters with Frost (a dragon) and Frost's sister in WoR
  • In the Epilogue of WaT Hoid uses a Tamu Kek to contact "the meditative realm of the dragons" for "wisdom of the ancient dead"... Whatever that means.

Oh, I've been meaning to bring this up somewhere. Tanavast refers to Medelantorius (Valor's Vessel) as "the great dragon god" in Chapter 115 of WaT. I assumed this was just some kind of title and not literal because of the WoB you referenced, but now his Coppermind page has him listed as a dragon too. 

My best guess is that Valor has been taken up by a different Vessel since the Shattering. We got this WoB confirming Harmony is not the only Shard who's held by a new Vessel
https://wob.coppermind.net/events/370/#e11795
Most likely Medelantorious no longer holds Valor but was an actual dragon.

Edited by SpartanBrigade
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Jult

Jult

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, SpartanBrigade said:

My best guess is that Valor has been taken up by a different Vessel since the Shattering. We got this WoB confirming Harmony is not the only Shard who's held by a new Vessel
https://wob.coppermind.net/events/370/#e11795
Most likely Medelantorious no longer holds Valor but was an actual dragon.

Oh that's VERY interesting. I hadn't seen that WoB yet. I wonder how he lost it. Anyone who could take down 'the great dragon god' sounds like a big threat. Although I guess there are other ways to lose a Shard (e.g. Virtuosity).

 

1 hour ago, Bel Oh said:

this is so cool, also what type of abilities because assuming they have access to lots of different investiture forms (I think he said that during FanX Utah like last year.) they would be exceptionally powerful, like if the dragon from tress were to "mate" with a human and create a dragonborn what specifically do we think they would look like; tall and magestic, human sized with talons a tail and scales. and also their investiture would be crazy how do we think that would work?

Well, we have this WoB from Brandon:

Quote

Parshendi of Rhuidean

Do dragons always go through their early life in human form? Or would being a Sho Del also be possible for a young dragon?

Brandon Sanderson

The way I have it right now (which, we’ll give this as a Word of Brandon that could change, because I haven’t written Dragonsteel yet), it’s a human form. I imagined dragons like amphibians, that they have part of their lifecycle… the Yolish dragons, they mate in human form, they bear children in human form, raise children mostly in human form, but their dragon form is equally part of their identity.

YouTube Spoiler Stream 6 (Dec. 19, 2023)

And we have quite a few saying that there could be dragons hiding amongst the 'humans' in the books we've already read. My guess is that most of the time a dragonborn would appear like a normal human. But it would be cool if their 'dragon' form was closer to a dragon-human hybrid like you're describing. Maybe they'd be incapable of fully transforming but could sprout wings or tails or horns or scales on command?

Belandrius Ohhmar

Belandrius Ohhmar He/Him

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I found the WOB I might have misheard it but the bottom part says it (I don't know how to do the "Quote thing So I'm just going to copy paste it and put in quotation marks.)

"Question 5: 'Are the dragons of the Cosmere compatible with the current Investiture systems you’ve introduced?'
 

"Brandon’s Answer: 'There are two branches of dragons in the Cosmere. If you take the dragons from Yolen, they predate humans and are deities. People worship and pray to them. They can send things through the air to soothe others, bolster them, or take away their fear when they pray. This is one style of dragon. You’ll find dragons on other planets that have been created in their image, so to speak, who don’t have those deity powers. The Yolen dragons aren’t interested in Investiture—they’re highly Invested themselves. They can’t use the other magics because they’re already so full that they can’t access most of them. What you would call the 'lesser dragons' could theoretically use some of the other systems.'"

So as you can see lesser dragons can use some of the systems theoretically.

AlmightyGir

AlmightyGir

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16 hours ago, SpartanBrigade said:

Oh yeah that’s a good point. Every Radiant spren except honorspren and cultivationspren would technically be dragonborn too. I think the original poster was talking about dragonborn as the biological children of a human and a dragon rather than spren though

What if spren are dragonborn? What if that's how they ultimately manifest?

SpartanBrigade

SpartanBrigade He/Him

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38 minutes ago, AlmightyGir said:

Not turn into, *are*.

Well yeah in a way since they were created from Honor and Cultivation’s poster. They’re not biological Dragonborn which is what we meant here though 

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