Tanavast Mistakes (Or How Not to Handle a Shard)

[Dofurion]

A couple of things before we start.

1. Part of this post will be based on my guess that Honor fits as a shard influenced by a hypothetical Dawnshard named『Act』(way of acting, behavior, demeanor). But still the conclusions are the same even if you ignore that part.
2. While I'll focus on the Tanavast/Honor case, this applies to the other Shards as well.

Well I think we can all agree that Tanavast made many mistakes as a vessel of Honor. Starting with the central axis of the test that Honor (power) instructed Stormfather to perform, a test that had to conclude with the most important words a man can say (I understand you).

Given what we saw in the 5th book, Honor is a splinter whose intent is defined by oaths, not by honorability, integrity or nobility. Only and exclusively by oaths and pacts. This would put Honor's way of acting on a scale closer to the Skybreaker's and not so much to the Windrunner's or Bondsmith's.
Now, one characteristic of the Skybreaker's and Elsecaller's oaths is that they are the most intentionally malleable oaths:

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Questioner

Can Skybreakers vow to follow a code of rules some might consider outlaw-ish, like the Pirate Code. Are they obliged to adhere to changes in the law after their vow?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes and yes.

What you're running into with what's happening right now, the Skybreakers are under the thumb of someone who has a much more rigid interpretation of what they should do than is necessary for the Order. And so you could totally be a Skybreaker who is not of this group, and this group would not look kindly on something like the Pirate Code necessarily. (Though the Pirate Code kind of works for them, because it's in international waters, so even with the current crop of Skybreakers you could probably argue the Pirate Code, and they'd probably be okay with it.)

But you could have even less, codes that's like, "I'm going to follow the code of the criminal underground. I'm going to follow the Mafia code." Current crop of Skybreakers, that would not fly with them. But in the Order in general, and the way that highspren work, and things like that, you would totally be okay.

Which is kind of dangerous, yes. But you would have to follow the code as the code changes. So that could get you into trouble, also. Skybreakers, they've got an interesting way of going about all this. Hopefully, all the Orders do; that's one of my goals with them.

YouTube Livestream 9 (May 28, 2020)

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Elsecallers

Is it bad to say that I don't like one of the Radiant Orders? Because I don't like Elsecallers. It's not that I don't trust them, per se, it's that I don't know what they're doing or why they're doing it or what their final goals might be. So yes, fine, you're right, I don't trust them. 

Elsecallers are all about potential and progress. What can you become, and how can you work to be a better version of that thing? Which sounds great and all I guess, especially if you want to be a scholar or something. Elsecaller oaths and values can help you become the best scholar you can be. But what if you want to be a king? (That's a bad example; kings can be good.) What if you specifically want to be a tyrant? A thief? A criminal mastermind? A murderer? The Elsecaller oaths and values can help you be that too.

And, no, I am not talking about anyone in particular. All of the Elsecallers I know are kind. Well, maybe "polite" is a better word. All of the Elsecallers I know are polite, and... careful. Cautious? Wise, certainly and- what's the word I'm looking for? It's not "well-adjusted," goodness no. Well-considered! All of the Elsecallers I know are careful, cautious, and well-considered. That's an endorsement. Right? 

Let's put it this way: if you have an Elsecaller on your side, you're going to better off than if you didn't. They're smart, strategic, and capable. They know logistics, they know tactics, and they can travel through other cultures and mindsets and literally other worlds better than almost anyone. They're ambitious, and they have the skills and the power to back that ambition up. And if you don't have an Elsecaller on your side? If you're so unlucky that you've got an Elsecaller on the opposite side? Well... watch out.

Sixth Epoch, Year 31, Palahakah 5.8.5.

#SayTheWords (Feb. 7, 2024)

With this in mind, let's return to Tavanast's particular situation. Before ascending, he made an oath not to meet with other Shard vessels, an oath that he breaks and receives a slight scolding from Honor (Power), but since the oath was made before the ascension, this was nothing more. From here on we have... nothing.

Tanavast does not make a direct oath from here on in regards to his way of acting as a deity, which leaves him vulnerable to the base nature of the shard. Although we also have the OATH in between, this is what encourages the belligerent tendency of Honor (Power) and causes that in the case of a clash of Shard's the destruction of the planet is assured.

Let's step back from this case and look at another one to put it into perspective.

Bajerden's projection tells Dalinar that the confrontation between Shards has happened before without the consequence of the destruction of the worlds they were on, but, that required that at least one of the Shards (Power) wanted to preserve. Here a possibility comes into play, what would happen if instead of Dalinar the one who opted for Honor was Kaladin or Lopen...? What would happen if it were a Windrunner? Here the entire paradigm would change since in the first instance Honor (Power) would feel the same discontent that he felt when he met with Cultivation, if the recipient analyzes that feeling and understands the mechanics he would simply have to reaffirm his oaths so that in the collision the damage be minimized. (Which by the way, was also a solution to the final situation of the book)

To sum up my guess: Tanavast's mistake was not understanding his Shard and not having an oath framework ready to deal with Honor in the long term.

Note: In reality Tanavast made many more mistakes, such as limiting the Radiants excessively and not giving them importance despite being its main social and military force. Not counting all the other things seen in the book. But in my opinion this mistake was the one that originated the chain of events that we all know.

Edited January 18, 2025 by Dofurion

[JohnnyKaizen he/him]

On 1/14/2025 at 9:55 PM, Dofurion said:

Though the Pirate Code kind of works for them, because it's in international waters, so even with the current crop of Skybreakers you could probably argue the Pirate Code, and they'd probably be okay with it.

First and foremost, this is absolutely the funniest thing I've ever read in a WoB I am sitting here picturing someone like Lift, arguing to Nale that all of the Skybreakers need to follow the Pirate Code at see, and him just crumbling. She'd have them out there yelling "ARG!" and "AVAST!" and it's truly a beautiful thought. So I thank you for that!

 

On 1/14/2025 at 9:55 PM, Dofurion said:

Note: In reality Tanavast made many more mistakes, such as limiting the Radiants excessively and not giving them importance despite being its main social and military force. Not counting all the other things seen in the book. But in my opinion this mistake was the one that originated the chain of events that we all know.

Having read this (it's well put together and reasoned) I am having a realization. I have been spending a lot of time on threads about Cultivation and her planning prowess, and I honestly am seeing a lot of similarities in character flaws between Tanavast and Taravangian. I believe Taravangian to be far more intelligent than Tanavast, but both of them seem to make decisions with the believe that it's their godly right to do so. And, when they make a mistake they either ignore it or hide it. I am wondering if Cultivation chose Taravangian, in part, because he seems to share some similarities to Tanavast, and if she intended to cultivate Honor, then that would be another layer to her planning, that I'd not noticed before.

Honestly, Tanavast the person confused me by his decisions. I think that what you've written here is on point, but it's difficult for me to understand the why of his decisions.