Marsh's Duralumin Feruchemy

[Trusk'our he/him]

It's been pretty widely accepted on the Shard (as far as I'm aware) that Marsh has access to duralumin Feruchemy. This would explain how he was able to stay unnoticed by the public while walking around in TLM epilogue. 

But, Bendalloy must be used to steal Spiritual Feruchemy. That hadn't been discovered pre Catacendre.

So, either Marsh has a specially designed Unsealed Duraluminmind, or he's been beefing up on more spikes.

So, maybe this WoB has more relevance now.

Spoiler

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/312-orem-signing/#e8954

Questioner

Did Harmony give Ironeyes full Mistborn powers, or anything other than what he has with his spikes...

Brandon Sanderson

Just what he has with the spikes, I believe. No-- okay let's say this: Harmony did not do anything... That doesn't mean that Marsh hasn't done things himself.

Maybe Marsh has taken steps to become a Fullborn?

Edited December 19, 2024 by Trusk'our

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

5 hours ago, Trusk'our said:

It's been pretty widely accepted on the Shard (as far as I'm aware) that Marsh has access to duralumin Feruchemy. This would explain how he was able to stay unnoticed by the public while walking around in TLM epilogue. 

But, Bendalloy must be used to steal Spiritual Feruchemy. That hadn't been discovered pre Catacendre.

So, either Marsh has a specially designed Unsealed Duraluminmind, or he's been beefing up on more spikes.

So, maybe this WoB has more relevance now.

  Hide contents

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/312-orem-signing/#e8954

Questioner

Did Harmony give Ironeyes full Mistborn powers, or anything other than what he has with his spikes...

Brandon Sanderson

Just what he has with the spikes, I believe. No-- okay let's say this: Harmony did not do anything... That doesn't mean that Marsh hasn't done things himself.

Maybe Marsh has taken steps to become a Fullborn?

That's actually a really good question! Most likely he hasn't discovered anything much on unsealed Metalminds, he seems very open to helping others, unlike the others from the original crew, like Kelsier or Harmony, each for various reasons. You also should take into account that spook got interested in Hemalurgy after the Catacandre and Marsh would probably be very welcome to being able to enhance his body. That could also mean that Marsh continued his tweaking as time went on because of spooks original acceptance to doing something like that. That could also be where various new discoveries about feruchemy came from, and maybe even some forwards on unsealed metalminds, given that Kelsier interacted with spook (See Mistborn: Secret History) and with this theory, Marsh too. I still don't think Marsh knows all that much on unsealed metalminds, based on earlier statements, but Hemalurgic testing could be very helpful in moving forward with either feruchemy or allomancy.

In the end, I think it unlikely that Marsh had any contact with unsealed metalminds, but do think it likely that he experimented on himself or someone else did.

[alder24]

16 hours ago, Trusk'our said:

It's been pretty widely accepted on the Shard (as far as I'm aware) that Marsh has access to duralumin Feruchemy. This would explain how he was able to stay unnoticed by the public while walking around in TLM epilogue. 

But, Bendalloy must be used to steal Spiritual Feruchemy. That hadn't been discovered pre Catacendre.

So, either Marsh has a specially designed Unsealed Duraluminmind, or he's been beefing up on more spikes.

So, maybe this WoB has more relevance now.

  Reveal hidden contents

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/312-orem-signing/#e8954

Questioner

Did Harmony give Ironeyes full Mistborn powers, or anything other than what he has with his spikes...

Brandon Sanderson

Just what he has with the spikes, I believe. No-- okay let's say this: Harmony did not do anything... That doesn't mean that Marsh hasn't done things himself.

Maybe Marsh has taken steps to become a Fullborn?

Atium can steal any power. 

Spoiler

Chaos2651

Hemalurgically, atium steals Allomantic Temporal Powers. But, that seems unlikely, since atium is a god metal. It wouldn't fit in with the rest of the magic system. Did Preservation, in addition to switching cadmium and bendalloy for atium and malatium, also switch atium's Feruchemical and Hemalurgic powers with cadmium? Because it seems to me there's not a lot of atium Marsh can use to live for hundreds of years into the next Mistborn trilogy.

Brandon Sanderson

Preservation wanted atium and malatium to be of use to the people, as he recognized that it would be a very powerful tool—and that using it up could help defeat Ruin. But he also recognized that sixteen was a mythological important number, and felt it would make the best sign for his followers. So he took out the most unlikely (difficult to make and use) metals for his sign to his followers. But that doesn't have much to do with Hemalurgy's use here.

Remember that the tables—and the ars Arcanum—are 'in world' creations. (Or, at least, in-universe.) The knowledge represented in them is as people understand it, and can always have flaws. That was the case with having atium on the table in the first place, and that was the case with people (specifically the Inquisitors) trying to figure out what atium did Hemalurgically.

Their experiments (very expensive ones) are what determined that atium (which they thought was just one of the sixteen metals) granted the Allomantic Temporal powers. What they didn't realize is that atium (used correctly) could steal ANY of the powers. Think of it as a wild card. With the right knowledge, you could use it to mimic any other spike. It works far better than other spikes as well.

As for Marsh, he's got a whole bag of atium (taken off of the Kandra who was going to try to sell it.) So he's all right for quite a while. A small bead used right can reverse age someone back to their childhood.

But this was a little beyond their magical understanding at the time.

Barnes and Noble Book Club Q&A (July 8, 2009)

I doubt Marsh wants to become a Fullborn. He knows how dangerous they are, that Sazed is afraid of them and Marsh is a nice guy who wants to atone for all the damages he'd done while being under Ruin's control. 

Edit:

And just like with his F-Atium spike, he probably got his F-duralumin from a spike taken out of dead Inquisitors whom Ruin gave that spike.

Spoiler

zas678

Why on earth does Marsh have a Feruchemical atium spike? You've said that Ironeyes is in fact Marsh. Did Ruin spike someone for him? Or did Sazed grant him the power?

Brandon Sanderson

Dead Inquisitors Vin killed. Some were granted the spike for reasons I haven't spoken of yet.

/r/Fantasy_Bookclub Alloy of Law Q&A (Jan. 17, 2012)

 

Edited December 20, 2024 by alder24

[Trusk'our he/him]

2 minutes ago, alder24 said:

Atium can steal any power. 

  Hide contents

Chaos2651

Hemalurgically, atium steals Allomantic Temporal Powers. But, that seems unlikely, since atium is a god metal. It wouldn't fit in with the rest of the magic system. Did Preservation, in addition to switching cadmium and bendalloy for atium and malatium, also switch atium's Feruchemical and Hemalurgic powers with cadmium? Because it seems to me there's not a lot of atium Marsh can use to live for hundreds of years into the next Mistborn trilogy.

Brandon Sanderson

Preservation wanted atium and malatium to be of use to the people, as he recognized that it would be a very powerful tool—and that using it up could help defeat Ruin. But he also recognized that sixteen was a mythological important number, and felt it would make the best sign for his followers. So he took out the most unlikely (difficult to make and use) metals for his sign to his followers. But that doesn't have much to do with Hemalurgy's use here.

Remember that the tables—and the ars Arcanum—are 'in world' creations. (Or, at least, in-universe.) The knowledge represented in them is as people understand it, and can always have flaws. That was the case with having atium on the table in the first place, and that was the case with people (specifically the Inquisitors) trying to figure out what atium did Hemalurgically.

Their experiments (very expensive ones) are what determined that atium (which they thought was just one of the sixteen metals) granted the Allomantic Temporal powers. What they didn't realize is that atium (used correctly) could steal ANY of the powers. Think of it as a wild card. With the right knowledge, you could use it to mimic any other spike. It works far better than other spikes as well.

As for Marsh, he's got a whole bag of atium (taken off of the Kandra who was going to try to sell it.) So he's all right for quite a while. A small bead used right can reverse age someone back to their childhood.

But this was a little beyond their magical understanding at the time.

Barnes and Noble Book Club Q&A (July 8, 2009)

Ah, that's right.

Wasn't it an alloy of electrum at that point though? I suppose the Eleventh Metal was another Atium alloy, so there is precedence for purifying it to take any power though (which I'm assuming the pure form does rather than the alloy, as alloyed Godmetals have a more narrow field of affect).

9 minutes ago, alder24 said:

I doubt Marsh wants to become a Fullborn. He knows how dangerous they are, that Sazed is afraid of them and Marsh is a nice guy who wants to atone for all the damages he'd done while being under Ruin's control. 

I mean, he's already nearly one with his 22 confirmed spikes. Plus, being Fullborn would give him more potential to do good for Scadrial. 

Not that it means that he has done this of course, just that it's a plausible explanation were he to do so. 

13 minutes ago, alder24 said:

And just like with his F-Atium spike, he probably got his F-duralumin from a spike taken out of dead Inquisitors whom Ruin gave that spike.

  Hide contents

zas678

Why on earth does Marsh have a Feruchemical atium spike? You've said that Ironeyes is in fact Marsh. Did Ruin spike someone for him? Or did Sazed grant him the power?

Brandon Sanderson

Dead Inquisitors Vin killed. Some were granted the spike for reasons I haven't spoken of yet.

/r/Fantasy_Bookclub Alloy of Law Q&A (Jan. 17, 2012)

I do wonder, was Ruin planning on retaining his Inquisitors (or at least some of them) in preparation for attacking another world after he destroyed Scadrial?

Feruchemical Atium isn't terribly useful to an Inquisitor except for longevity (a child with massive steel spikes for eyes isn't a good disguise, and elderly Inquisitors wouldn't need temporary youth for performance since pewter already reinforces the body), which in turn isn't terribly useful if you're planning on blowing up your servants shortly after granting them the power.

I guess there could be other secret uses for F-Atium, but I can't think of any.

Then again, if the spike was taken by an Inquisitor between the time TLR died and Ruin's release, they could have been planning on being immortal on their own volition.