Question about the surge of transportation

[One-Eye-Demon]

If I where a will shaper able to make my self a mini perpendicularity to hop between realms (usually the cognitive realm) than would I theoretically be able to move my self into the spiritual realm as well than come out somewhere else essentially teleporting like how the oathgates work? 

Edit: would this be excesible only if I had a connection to the place I Wana go or would it be like a thing where I have to use it with a bondsmith to get the wanted affect?

Edited September 29, 2024 by One-Eye-Demon

[AlastorBM He]

I don't see it as impossible, but very difficult in itself, since there is no turning back from the spiritual realm. Elsecalling allow a surgebinder to enter the cognitive realm. It may interfere with the spiritual realm and connection at some point but we don't know much about the subject.

In my opinion, having a Bondthsmith on the team would help you orient yourself or move faster towards that location through the connection. It could be something similar to what the pursuer does.

[Treamayne]

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14 minutes ago, One-Eye-Demon said:

If I where a will sharper able to make my self a mini perpendicularity to hop between realms (usually the cognitive realm) than would I theoretically be able to move my self into the spiritual realm as well than come out somewhere else essentially teleporting like how the oathgates work? 

Edit: would this be excesible only if I had a connection to the place I Wana go or would it be like a thing where I have to use it with a bondsmith to get the wanted affect?

Short answer, we do not yet know for certain. (WoBs at the end)

The WoR Jasnah deleted scene provides some additional information, such as referencing the Junction that indicates a Radiant is peeking into Shadesmar (and possibly SR) without fully leaving the Physical Realm. 

Spoilers for Oathbringer and RoW

Spoiler

We see Lezian, the Pursuer usinf the Surge of Transportation in a way that is different from how we have seen Jasnah use it - though we also do not know how practiced Jasnah was in WoR when she used it to escape the Wind's Pleasure.   We do not know how he provides the Intent required to specify a destination.

We also know that the humans that arrived on Roshar from Ashyn used some manifestation of Investiture that operates similar to the Surge of Transportation (at least Rosharans would call what they did Elsecalling). 

Spoilers for Elantris and M:SH

Spoiler

We also know that Aon Tia is a form of Elsecalling and allows for Transportation between two locations on the Physical Realm (likely by shortcutting through the Spiritual Realm). We also see that, for AonDor, the destination has to be defined (Raoden uses direction and distance) to provide the required Intent for Elsecalling to function.

We also see in M:SH that a person with a physical shell can peek into the Spiritual Realm (Kelsier watching Ruin in the Well, and Leras giving his peeks at his Connections and, possibly, Fortune), with the implication that a being tied to a physical shell can't fully enter the Spiritual Realm (there is no time or location) - but it has not been explicitly answered. 

 

Hope that helps

WoBs:

Spoiler

 

Spoiler

tech220

Two quick questions: Will we find out more about the Surges Division, Cohesion or Tension? We know practically nothing about them!

Could an Elsecaller Transport themselves into the Spiritual Realm? Has anyone tried?

Brandon Sanderson

RAFO! (Sorry. I'm not likely to answer questions about the book when we've got it coming so quickly.)

Stormlight Three Update #6 (Jan. 20, 2017)

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Questioner

The spren on the other side of the Oathgate in Shadesmar... One is an inkspren-- I am guessing, no? Because there are two spren that grant the Transportation Surge so that would make the other a Willshaper spren?

Brandon Sanderson

RAFO.

Oathbringer release party (Nov. 13, 2017)

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Argent

In the Syl interlude in Rhythm of War, she is speaking with Dalinar about his powers and the things those powers have done in the past. And what she says is "a Bondsmith bound other Surges". First of all, what other Surges?

Brandon Sanderson

One potential interpretation for you on this, remember they use Surge and spren sometimes interchangeably in-world. Just making you aware of that.

Argent

Yeah I'm aware of that. Bound other Surges....

Brandon Sanderson

That might be what she's talking about. I'm not guaranteeing it.

Argent

Then the term Bondsmith. To me it seems like she's talking about Ishar and the Ashyn stuff. So would they use Bondsmith to describe him in that place?

Argent

And that would be maybe the power of Connection, the way Lightweaving is the power of illusion?

Brandon Sanderson

So one other thing to keep aware of in the cosmere - for instance they call "Lightweaving" any illusion-based magic working on the same fundamentals. And so you could argue - and people will use it that way in-world - that Bondsmithing is both an order [of Knights Radiant] and a power that exists outside the order.

Brandon Sanderson

Yes. And for instance, there were not Elsecallers to get people between Ashyn and Roshar, but on Roshar they would explain what happened there as Elsecalling. Does that make sense?

Argent

I mean, as much as these things make sense, yes.

JordanCon 2021 (July 17, 2021)

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Bromo_Sapien

When somebody travels into the Cognitive Realm, what happens to their physical self? To their body? Like Elsecalling or through a Shardpool?

Brandon Sanderson

Well it depends on the way they’re doing it. The two ways you’ve mentioned transport the physical body. It’s actually creating a rift and slipping them through. But there are other ways that you kind of peek in, where your body’s saying it’s a little more astral projection-y in those cases.

Bromo_Sapien

So their physical self would also be in the Cognitive Realm?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes.

Bromo_Sapien

Okay.

Brandon Sanderson

Which is weird.

Bromo_Sapien

As opposed to somebody like Kelsier who died and no longer has a physical self.

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, right. Or when Shallan is Soulcasting and peeking in, and things like this. It can still be dangerous, because what’s happening is that little soul bubble there that’s manifesting into a version of your soul and then things can get at it in different ways and stuff. So... But yes, going in physically means you just pop between realms, and yeah, yeah…

Bromo_Sapien

And when they leave the Cognitive Realm their Physical self just leaves the Cognitive Realm the same...

Brandon Sanderson

Yep, mhm, yep.

Bromo_Sapien

Perfect.

Brandon Sanderson

Basically you’re transferring into Investiture and popping out of Investiture, so...

Boskone 54 (Feb. 17, 2017)

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Questioner

Could you use AonDor to manipulate Connection? If so, would a real AonDor smarty be able to do something similar to a Bondsmith?

Brandon Sanderson

The short answer to your question is: yes. Let me give some explanation.

Even when you are seeings some things happening in Elantris itself, you are seeing them manipulate Connection. It is mostly reinforcing Connection, but it is, in a way, manipulation. Rewriting Connection, rewriting Identity are both things that they can do. So with enough power, with enough smartiness, what a Bondsmith can do can be done.

In fact, we have seen short-range Elsecalling done by… Obviously Elsecalling’s not Bondsmithing, but you know that a Bondsmith powered a big Elsecalling [to migrate from Ashyn], one of the big things you’ve seen a Bondsmith do is get people between planets. And you have seen people use AonDor to Elsecall. You’ve seen them Lightweave, you’ve seen them do a lot of these things. They also could do some of this same stuff.

Basically, rule of thumb is: almost anything in the cosmere that is possible can be replicated with AonDor with the right program. But you may need an injection of Investiture in certain ways.

Dragonsteel 2022 (Nov. 14, 2022)

 

 

[One-Eye-Demon]

Sorry I diden't explain it well I was just wondering if a willshaper/elsecaller would be able to basically teleport by elsecalling through the spiritual realm instead of the cognitive realm. I was wondering since that is how the oathgates transport people to uritheru (by sending them through the spiritual realm.

Edit: sorta like how in sulitman sigzil can world hop to other planets (teleport) with a whole lot of investiture

Edited September 29, 2024 by One-Eye-Demon

[Treamayne]

21 minutes ago, One-Eye-Demon said:

Sorry I diden't explain it well I was just wondering if a willshaper/elsecaller would be able to basically teleport by elsecalling through the spiritual realm instead of the cognitive realm. I was wondering since that is how the oathgates transport people to uritheru (by sending them through the spiritual realm.

Edit: sorta like how in sulitman sigzil can world hop to other planets (teleport) with a whole lot of investiture

Right, that's what I was trying to explain - we have seen Transportation do what you are talking about (In Elantris, Oathgates, and with the Pursuer) but we do not yet know how an Elscaller like Jasnah, or a Willshaper like Venli could accomplish the same thing. The surge should be capable of such  - but the methods all differ and we do not yet have enough information on what their method would be or how they could accompish such use of the Surge.

[One-Eye-Demon]

Makes sense thanks.