Spiritwebs Change Over Time, But the Spiritual Realm Doesn't Have Time?

[logicalpencils]

Forming new Connections, using an Invested Art that can alter a spiritweb, highstorms sending Investiture into gemstones: things in the Spiritual Realm seem to move and change often. How does this square with the Realm's timelessness? Is it because the spiritwebs are tied to temporal beings? And if that's true, do spiritwebs only appear to change but have really always been one constant reality outside of time?

[alder24]

11 hours ago, logicalpencils said:

Forming new Connections, using an Invested Art that can alter a spiritweb, highstorms sending Investiture into gemstones: things in the Spiritual Realm seem to move and change often. How does this square with the Realm's timelessness? Is it because the spiritwebs are tied to temporal beings? And if that's true, do spiritwebs only appear to change but have really always been one constant reality outside of time?

Time still is in the Spiritual Realm, but not really in the same way as it is in the Physical Realm. In SR the time and space are compound into one - time and distance doesn't matter. But Shards still can't travel back in time, they are still moving forward in time, just like you do. However because of this weirdness, sometimes things can start happening as an echo of future Connections that will form, but aren't formed yet - that's why Syl knew Kaladin before they met, because this future Connection was echoing.

Changes still are happening in the Spiritual Realm over time - future sight is the proof of it. The fact that you see a split future the further away you look, or you're influenced by someone else seeing the future, tells you that the future isn't set in metal even in the Spiritual Realm (because that's where you look when seeing the future). Changes are happening, souls are developing, forming new Connections and stuff like that. Things aren't constant in SR, they move through time but just different.

Spoiler

Questioner

Mistborn travels to Roshar, what does he or she use to get Invested?

Brandon Sanderson

*pause* So. *pause* I think I've talked about this before on the 17th Shard, but I'm not 100% sure and so I don't want to anything right now, not knowing what I've said. But you can look it up. You can ask Peter. Hey Peter, have I talked about someone using-- Have I ever in an interview before talked about using metals... A Mistborn travels to Roshar and uses the metals there?

Peter Ahlstrom

I think that you have said that they could do it.

Brandon Sanderson

I said it.  Okay, so the thing about the metals you have to understand is the metals are a key, the metals are not magical themselves, except for specific ones. If I've already said that I can tell you, go to Roshar and you could use the metals that are there to power your Allomancy because the difference is in your soul and you're actually drawing directly from Preservation. Remember that on the Spiritual Realm, this is the big tidbit--they're listening. On the Spiritual Realm time, distance, and space are irrelevant. It's a place where time and space are compounded in one. So anything that exists on the Spiritual Realm, space doesn't matter for it.

Shadows of Self release party (Oct. 5, 2015)

 

Spoiler

Questioner

Why is Kaladin so proficient-- Like naturally born to wield a spear. Is that a weapon he likes or is it a destiny for him?

Brandon Sanderson

So destiny is a strong term... I would say he has natural aptitude, but no more so than a normal person who has a natural aptitude for something. But the way the Spiritual Realm works in the cosmere and the way Connection works, there were certain things that were happening to Kaladin before they happened...

It's like Syl says in one of the books. "You didn't know me then, but I knew you then. Even though we hadn't met yet, I still knew you." You see some weird Connection things too. And these are mostly just for fun sort of cosmere connections. Like when you see Syl take on the look of Shallan standing on the beach. There's gonna be a connection there. It's forming, it doesn't exist yet, but all things are one in the Spiritual Realm, and we're just kinda seeing echoes of that. It's not meant to be destiny, it's more meant to be, "Hey there's little connections happening".

I would not say Kaladin is any more naturally gifted in that than your average professional sports player is naturally gifted in what they do.

Emerald City Comic Con 2018 (March 1, 2018)

 

Edited March 15, 2024 by alder24

[CtrlAltDepressed]

32 minutes ago, alder24 said:

But Shards still can travel back in time,

i might be misinterpreting what you mean but want to point out that traveling back in time is not ever going to be a part of the cosmere, as stated by brandon. 

 

source:

Xluxaeternax

Is the chronology through the whole cosmere fairly linear, or are there some Interstellar-relativity timey-wimey stuff at play?

Brandon Sanderson

Relativity is in play for sure, but I am not allowing time travel into the past in the cosmere. So while you might find places that move at slower/faster speeds, and while foreseeing future timelines is in play for sure, nobody will not be pulling serious time travel shenanigans.

Worldbuilders AMA (Dec. 5, 2015)

[alder24]

1 minute ago, CtrlAltDepressed said:

i might be misinterpreting what you mean but want to point out that traveling back in time is not ever going to be a part of the cosmere, as stated by brandon. 

I meant CAN'T! Thanks for pointing that out. Yes, that's why SR isn't really timeless as even Shards are experiencing time.

[Argenti he/him]

11 hours ago, logicalpencils said:

Forming new Connections, using an Invested Art that can alter a spiritweb, highstorms sending Investiture into gemstones: things in the Spiritual Realm seem to move and change often. How does this square with the Realm's timelessness? Is it because the spiritwebs are tied to temporal beings? And if that's true, do spiritwebs only appear to change but have really always been one constant reality outside of time?

It's not truly timeless; it's just not exactly... Solid? In the physical and cognitive realm, causality works mostly how you would expect, with X leading to Y. However, in the spiritual realm, X leads to Y or Z, or sometimes Y leads to X or Z. Time is not linear in the spiritual realm; you have a connection to your past as well as to all of your futures.

[alder24]

3 minutes ago, Argenti said:

It's not truly timeless; it's just not exactly... Solid? In the physical and cognitive realm, causality works mostly how you would expect, with X leading to Y. However, in the spiritual realm, X leads to Y or Z, or sometimes Y leads to X or Z. Time is not linear in the spiritual realm; you have a connection to your past as well as to all of your futures.

You reminded me of this quote from Yumi ch 32:

Quote

“We can slow or speed up time relative to other places or people,” Design said. “That’s easier in the Spiritual Realm, where time flows like water into whatever container you provide. But you can’t go back. Nobody, not even a Shard, can do that.”

 

[Argenti he/him]

Just now, alder24 said:

You reminded me of this quote from Yumi ch 32:

 

That's one of the quotes I was looking at!