Amethyst Scorpion Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 10 minutes ago, Pearl Chameleon said: Fine then. Give me a case on why Penguin is village, then. Again, rioting a smoked target makes you lose you vote, so I agree with the conclusion that Tuatara didn't riot D1 I’ve village read his posting since D1. I like the reads lists and analysis he’s producing. It’s distinctly not his e!meta (granted it hasn’t been his v!meta for some time so this is kind of just different but it’s a good different). To be fair, EoD D1 doesn’t look good for them as the Vulture connection is as stark as it was when I first noticed it, but I still don’t feel like Ostrich is evil and as you pointed out, Tuatara didn’t manip D1. Again, I’m not sure they’re not evil, I just didn’t like your case specifically. Most of my village read is gut which is right… some of the time. 10 minutes ago, Opal Lion said: Also just kinda wondering why no one's used the fact that I like, soothed a vote off vullture, as like, a point to push on me for. Oh that was you haha Nah I don’t think you’re evil Ridding Cham’s self vote is entirely fair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sage Kangaroo Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 49 minutes ago, Saffron Iguana said: I'm gonna gut rn here bc I don't really care for your tone right now What exactly about my tone do you not care about? As far as I can see, my tone when I was speaking about you has been pretty normal. The vote exchange between you and Tuatara was quite weird in D1. Also seemed there was familiarity between you two. You had been strangely obsessive over Tuatara in D1-N1, seemingly poking but when Chameleon mentioned they found Tuatara Spiked, you went on a strange tangent asking them about how sure they were of the read and discussing about other inactives. In addition to that, I'll add to someone's point. You stayed away from the entire Vulture argument last cycle. Your voting last cycle was - Heron, Crocodile, Kangaroo, Crocodile, Heron which is weird considering the discussion was mainly around Vulture, Heron, Chameleon and Albatross. 37 minutes ago, Pearl Chameleon said: Don't know everyone who knew, but: Scorp, Iguana, and Zebra were all told by me, that I was doing this gambit and that I am a thug Fuchsia Ostrich knew I was a thug. I'm curious if @Oxblood Beagle did too. Penguin and Lion both have said that they knew nothing of this gambit. Can confirm Penguin sent a message to me asking me if I was the Seeker. Meaning they believed the Mistborn claim to some extent. Seeker searchers are always a bit suspicious. Looking at Vulture's posts prior to surviving the first hit - Quote Amethyst Scorpion, Pearl Chameleon, and Emerald Falcon all seem to be encouraging analysis and village discourse. Good. Ivory Dragonfly and Chartreuse Penguin both spent many words introducing themselves, then went rather quiet. Dragonfly, in particular, spends a lot of time lurking at the edges of discussion. Interesting. Azure Mouse, on three separate occasions (with Salmon Meerkat near the beginning, Indigo Weasel somewhat later, and Sapphire Elephant most recently), has jumped to second someone else's vote with minimal explanation. Curious. Salmon Meerkat contributes to village discussion fairly frequently, but is extremely reticent to point fingers at anyone. Why? Important to note in Spiked posts is when they group a bunch of players together and make a distinction or a differentiation out from one of them, it usually hints at the presence of a Spiked teammate in that bunch. In this instance, they group Dragonfly and Penguin together but makes it a point to condemn Dragonfly with an addition statement. They end this post with a vote on Dragonfly as well. Not a good look for Penguin. Village - Scorpion, Meerkat, Chameleon, Zebra Lion, Ostrich, Beagle Swan, Crocodile Spiked - Iguana, Penguin, Elephant, Albatross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmon Meerkat Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 5 minutes ago, Sage Kangaroo said: What exactly about my tone do you not care about? As far as I can see, my tone when I was speaking about you has been pretty normal. The vote exchange between you and Tuatara was quite weird in D1. Also seemed there was familiarity between you two. You had been strangely obsessive over Tuatara in D1-N1, seemingly poking but when Chameleon mentioned they found Tuatara Spiked, you went on a strange tangent asking them about how sure they were of the read and discussing about other inactives. In addition to that, I'll add to someone's point. You stayed away from the entire Vulture argument last cycle. Your voting last cycle was - Heron, Crocodile, Kangaroo, Crocodile, Heron which is weird considering the discussion was mainly around Vulture, Heron, Chameleon and Albatross. Can confirm Penguin sent a message to me asking me if I was the Seeker. Meaning they believed the Mistborn claim to some extent. Seeker searchers are always a bit suspicious. Looking at Vulture's posts prior to surviving the first hit - Important to note in Spiked posts is when they group a bunch of players together and make a distinction or a differentiation out from one of them, it usually hints at the presence of a Spiked teammate in that bunch. In this instance, they group Dragonfly and Penguin together but makes it a point to condemn Dragonfly with an addition statement. They end this post with a vote on Dragonfly as well. Not a good look for Penguin. Village - Scorpion, Meerkat, Chameleon, Zebra Lion, Ostrich, Beagle Swan, Crocodile Spiked - Iguana, Penguin, Elephant, Albatross hmmmm... interesting. good point. and interesting that they were nked that night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Chameleon Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 1 hour ago, Amethyst Scorpion said: I’ve village read his posting since D1. I like the reads lists and analysis he’s producing. It’s distinctly not his e!meta (granted it hasn’t been his v!meta for some time so this is kind of just different but it’s a good different). To be fair, EoD D1 doesn’t look good for them as the Vulture connection is as stark as it was when I first noticed it, but I still don’t feel like Ostrich is evil and as you pointed out, Tuatara didn’t manip D1. Again, I’m not sure they’re not evil, I just didn’t like your case specifically. Most of my village read is gut which is right… some of the time. Oh that was you haha Nah I don’t think you’re evil Ridding Cham’s self vote is entirely fair Why have you village read his posting? Because you're basically grasping at straws to read penguin village. Tbh ostrich being evil is entirely defined by the EoD vote, which I reread and it turns out it was a misinput, and also, since ostrich knew about the gambit ahead of time (sorta), that would've meant penguin wouldn't be searching for a false seeker in PMs if they're e/e. In other words, I think Ostrich penguin not e/e Also I can't believe you wouldn't let me self vote Lion smh @Opal Lion what actions did you take c1, and c2? Coral Swan: smoker Pearl Chameleon: Thug Opal Lion: Soother Quartz Zebra: Coinshot Chartreuse Penguin: Non-coinshot, non-mistborn, non-vanilla, non-seeker role Role claims thus far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opal Lion Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 I didn't take any actions other than d3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuchsia Ostrich Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 (edited) Eh I personally think Penguin is village (as did Mouse before he died) but I'm not as committed to that read as I was my Heron read to bother fighting their exe, and if Mouse was alive he'd be trying to reevaluate his early v!reads anyway. I'd rather flip Albatross before Penguin tho, as Penguin was pushing Alb's exe C3 and I found it compelling. Either way there's enough dead elims now that I can be lazy again. Oh and I like Kangaroo's posts today so far Edited January 12 by Fuchsia Ostrich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmon Meerkat Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 im giving myself a headache reading through vultures posts lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuchsia Ostrich Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 (edited) Should note that in my Vulture PM they also stated that Scorpion and Chameleon were their top village reads on D1 Edited January 12 by Fuchsia Ostrich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmon Meerkat Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 i found this interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuchsia Ostrich Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 Any VCers in chat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffron Iguana Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Fuchsia Ostrich said: Any VCers in chat? Vote Tally Chartreuse Penguin (5): Mauve Crocodile, Opal Lion, Pearl Chameleon, Quartz Zebra, Salmon Meerkat Saffron Iguana (4): Amethyst Scorpion, Chartreuse Penguin, Fuchsia Ostrich, Sage Kangaroo Magenta Albatross (1): Oxblood Beagle Opal Lion (1): Magenta Albatross Sage Kangaroo (1): Saffron Iguana edit: sorry for being outed as dark theme user. (There’s things. I wanna get to but I’m eating rn so ~) Edited January 12 by Saffron Iguana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Chameleon Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 35 minutes ago, Fuchsia Ostrich said: Eh I personally think Penguin is village (as did Mouse before he died) but I'm not as committed to that read as I was my Heron read to bother fighting their exe, and if Mouse was alive he'd be trying to reevaluate his early v!reads anyway. I'd rather flip Albatross before Penguin tho, as Penguin was pushing Alb's exe C3 and I found it compelling. Either way there's enough dead elims now that I can be lazy again. Oh and I like Kangaroo's posts today so far Explain why penguin is village Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coral Swan Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 Seems like a decent place to start is with reactions to Vulture surviving the first attack. We have: Zebra seems pretty obviously village Heron brings up the possibility of a WGG, which seems more of a village-aligned thing to do Ostrich voted Vulture, and it sounds like this is continuation of a PM with Mouse. Very village. Penguin's post here: seems off to me. It seems to kinda defend Vulture while going after someone that, at the time, it seems people thought had been scanned. I don't quite understand this post coming from a village perspective. This post from Beagle seems suspicious to me: They both village read Vulture and push to execute either Chameleon or the Seeker. If Cham is village, then a Spiked Beagle knows that these are both village exes. And if Cham is village, they are likely honest about being a Thug, so this just wastes an execution. But if Cham is Spiked then this On the flip side, the only reason we think Cham is a Thug is because they claimed it. The fact that the claim also happened in PMs D1 doesn't really add credibility, since a Spiked can easily pick a role to fake having and then just be consistent with that fake-claim. Since Cham derailed much of the discussion during D3, I'm inclined to think one of Cham/Beagle is a Spiked, and that they aren't on a team. Gonna vote Beagle for now. Later in D3 they double-down on not wanting to vote Vulture, and they fit into my guess about a Spiked voting early on Hyena during D2 as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Chameleon Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 35 minutes ago, Fuchsia Ostrich said: Should note that in my Vulture PM they also stated that Scorpion and Chameleon were their top village reads on D1 Sheeping general reads. What time was this at? Pre-rollovet or post-rollovet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffron Iguana Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 1 hour ago, Sage Kangaroo said: What exactly about my tone do you not care about? As far as I can see, my tone when I was speaking about you has been pretty normal. The vote exchange between you and Tuatara was quite weird in D1. Also seemed there was familiarity between you two. You had been strangely obsessive over Tuatara in D1-N1, seemingly poking but when Chameleon mentioned they found Tuatara Spiked, you went on a strange tangent asking them about how sure they were of the read and discussing about other inactives. In addition to that, I'll add to someone's point. You stayed away from the entire Vulture argument last cycle. Your voting last cycle was - Heron, Crocodile, Kangaroo, Crocodile, Heron which is weird considering the discussion was mainly around Vulture, Heron, Chameleon and Albatross. Can confirm Penguin sent a message to me asking me if I was the Seeker. Meaning they believed the Mistborn claim to some extent. Seeker searchers are always a bit suspicious. Looking at Vulture's posts prior to surviving the first hit - Important to note in Spiked posts is when they group a bunch of players together and make a distinction or a differentiation out from one of them, it usually hints at the presence of a Spiked teammate in that bunch. In this instance, they group Dragonfly and Penguin together but makes it a point to condemn Dragonfly with an addition statement. They end this post with a vote on Dragonfly as well. Not a good look for Penguin. Village - Scorpion, Meerkat, Chameleon, Zebra Lion, Ostrich, Beagle Swan, Crocodile Spiked - Iguana, Penguin, Elephant, Albatross idk i just kinda wanted to say something to say something and idrc to not be volitile with reads atm. i dont know how much i believe it but i dont like the current wagon state and its making me antsy. also again im prone to omgus LOL uhhh full disclosure i dont know like... a lot of ppl. i did not and do not have tuatara's id. iirc i voted tuatara there because i saw them lurking but memories fuzzy. but also wasnt that one of my bideo bame votes??? would you say that everyone else i bideo bamed has partner equity with me? I got dissauded off a tuatara SR in pms by like... mouse and beagle from an ID read there. my point on chameleon was how they could sr something that was tangibly nai, and i was worried that was e!cham trying to push miscondemn bait (and i had my pet scumread of crocodile so i wanted people to agree with me there >.>) i did! uhm. i didnt rlly know what to make of it and didnt really care. vulture wasnt my problem bevause i wasnt the coinshot, and i was aware of the cham thing. admittedly i didnt put a l;ot of focus on alb either (maybe? idr). ill offer a converse of thats poor positioning on my part though, especially when as an elim there id look to bus or actually convince people off of vulture and not spend my time scrambling like a chicken with its head cut off. full disclosure of i was on mobile w bad service at eod yday and asked lion if they were sheepable, which was where i wanted to go (and subsequently got jabaited) why is ele an elim to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Chameleon Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 3 minutes ago, Coral Swan said: Seems like a decent place to start is with reactions to Vulture surviving the first attack. We have: Zebra seems pretty obviously village Heron brings up the possibility of a WGG, which seems more of a village-aligned thing to do Ostrich voted Vulture, and it sounds like this is continuation of a PM with Mouse. Very village. Penguin's post here: seems off to me. It seems to kinda defend Vulture while going after someone that, at the time, it seems people thought had been scanned. I don't quite understand this post coming from a village perspective. This post from Beagle seems suspicious to me: They both village read Vulture and push to execute either Chameleon or the Seeker. If Cham is village, then a Spiked Beagle knows that these are both village exes. And if Cham is village, they are likely honest about being a Thug, so this just wastes an execution. But if Cham is Spiked then this On the flip side, the only reason we think Cham is a Thug is because they claimed it. The fact that the claim also happened in PMs D1 doesn't really add credibility, since a Spiked can easily pick a role to fake having and then just be consistent with that fake-claim. Since Cham derailed much of the discussion during D3, I'm inclined to think one of Cham/Beagle is a Spiked, and that they aren't on a team. Gonna vote Beagle for now. Later in D3 they double-down on not wanting to vote Vulture, and they fit into my guess about a Spiked voting early on Hyena during D2 as well. Do you seriously see the Elim team having: - a rioter - two thugs (8 lives total) - A seeker Again, I think there are easier ways to derail discussion than a Gambit double reversal + also why would I vote on vulture + also I could've condemned heron earlier+when everyone discovere penguin is elim why would I bus penguin that hard+also apparently tilting is village+also this is not my e!meta since people are bringing this up for penguin too+why would I derail discussion when heron was up for exe+why would i sus both tuatara and amber vulture and bus penguin + more Again, I can and will make a wallpost defending myself if need be, but I don't think Beagle is elim- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffron Iguana Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 41 minutes ago, Fuchsia Ostrich said: Should note that in my Vulture PM they also stated that Scorpion and Chameleon were their top village reads on D1 I just realized when looking back on my pm with Vulture that they also mentioned being in PMs with (scorpion) and heron btw. but also i had a thought that their comment abt chameleon made to me in their (mid d1, i asked abt the vote on chameleon despite claiming them a village leader) read kinda unpaired, which is why i dont rlly think its cham? idk 2 minutes ago, Pearl Chameleon said: Again, I can and will make a wallpost defending myself if need be, but I don't think Beagle is elim- tbh i think a defense of beagle might be a bit more useful here when theyre being brought into contention more /shrug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuchsia Ostrich Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 15 minutes ago, Pearl Chameleon said: Explain why penguin is village At this point because you think he isn't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Chameleon Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 1 minute ago, Saffron Iguana said: I just realized when looking back on my pm with Vulture that they also mentioned being in PMs with (scorpion) and heron btw. but also i had a thought that their comment abt chameleon made to me in their (mid d1, i asked abt the vote on chameleon despite claiming them a village leader) read kinda unpaired, which is why i dont rlly think its cham? idk tbh i think a defense of beagle might be a bit more useful here when theyre being brought into contention more /shrug Beagle is not Elim because of their response to my gambit Penguin is elim because of their response to the gambit End of discussion Just now, Fuchsia Ostrich said: At this point because you think he isn't No because there isn't any defense for penguin because penguin is an elim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffron Iguana Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 (edited) 1 minute ago, Pearl Chameleon said: Beagle is not Elim because of their response to my gambit Penguin is elim because of their response to the gambit End of discussion Why is Beagle's response specifically a towny response as opposed to an uninformed elim response? Walk us through it. Edit: And the reverse for Penguin tbh. Edited January 12 by Saffron Iguana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Chameleon Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 Just now, Saffron Iguana said: Why is Beagle's response specifically a towny response as opposed to an uninformed elim response? Walk us through it. Edit: And the reverse for Penguin tbh. I have multiple times and will not again 3 hours ago, Pearl Chameleon said: Don't know everyone who knew, but: Scorp, Iguana, and Zebra were all told by me, that I was doing this gambit and that I am a thug Fuchsia Ostrich knew I was a thug. I'm curious if @Oxblood Beagle did too. Penguin and Lion both have said that they knew nothing of this gambit. Penguin was saved d1 by ostrich EoD voting ivory. Penguin and Ostrich could be e/e Penguin said they have a non-coinshot, non-mistborn, non-seeker, non-vanilla role. They also said not to send the coinshot after them. Penguin's "analysis" posts consists of one post counting the number of times someone said the word falcon (and making a poe out of it) and reposting all the vote counts. Penguin's Reasons for voting me d3 seemed insubstantial, and came off to me as "I'm going to vote chameleon anyways but let me attach my master's thesis to it" Penguin defended Vulture when they had a vote removed from them, and I think we can assume the elims have a soother as well, or a mistborn who drew brass. Verdict: Penguin is elim Here. Read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffron Iguana Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 Just now, Pearl Chameleon said: I have multiple times and will not again im lazy :[ link me.? 50 minutes ago, Salmon Meerkat said: i found this interesting. How so? What are you gleaning from it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Chameleon Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 2 minutes ago, Saffron Iguana said: im lazy :[ link me.? How so? What are you gleaning from it? I did Tbh another suspicion of penguin is that they aren't responding to when I case them Because mafia hate being tunneled because they can't say anything because they know the tunneler is right Like It's obvious 2 hours ago, Amethyst Scorpion said: I’ve village read his posting since D1. I like the reads lists and analysis he’s producing. It’s distinctly not his e!meta (granted it hasn’t been his v!meta for some time so this is kind of just different but it’s a good different). To be fair, EoD D1 doesn’t look good for them as the Vulture connection is as stark as it was when I first noticed it, but I still don’t feel like Ostrich is evil and as you pointed out, Tuatara didn’t manip D1. Again, I’m not sure they’re not evil, I just didn’t like your case specifically. Most of my village read is gut which is right… some of the time. Oh that was you haha Nah I don’t think you’re evil Ridding Cham’s self vote is entirely fair I was right about Tuatara, and amber vulture I don't see anything wrong with my case because it's right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quartz Zebra Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 Meta side note, there's two components to the game: solving and cooperation! If you think you've achieved the first part, it's time to focus on the second! Cooperation requires communication with people in a way that convinces them! Aka not absolutism. And it might require compromise! And as Mouse would tell you, it might require being mad at everyone for not understanding what you understand. But you should do that in your GM PM, not in thread. Right now, people are pushing their personal agendas based on their differences in information and perspective! And some are acting in bad faith because they have to as elims! It is unfair to the elims to react to their efforts with excessive emotion! And since you don't know for certain who the elims are, you should give everyone some grace! In other words, solving the game is half the battle. Achieving your desired outcome, in a way that is fair to everyone, under difficult circumstances, playing with people of varied levels of investment in the game, is the second half. It's important to focus on both components. Please just remember that as we move forward! We're just here for fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saffron Iguana Posted January 12 Report Share Posted January 12 sage kangaroo b4 i forget Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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