My theory on the end of Storm light 5 (Spoilers for everything)

[One who Breaths and Reads she/her]

My theory is based on three key pieces of information from Sunlit man and TLM.

1. Kaladin is alive in some way but is not meant to be anywhere else (on Roshar presumably) 

2. Something bad is happening on Roshar, presumably a war(which would have ended if Dalinar won the battle of champions) that keeps it difficult to interact or gain support from. 

3. Something important is in Shinovar and Cultivation is planning something big

Now to explain, on revision and reading through the various books set after the events of Stormlight 5 that there still is some kind of conflict on Roshar thats keeping it preoccupied with itself and makes it dangerous. We also know that something BIG happens to Kaladin to make it impossible for Kaladin to not be on Canticle (planet its set on) and is implied to still be alive (although he possibly can just be dead, but I feel like Brandon is setting him up for something more, although it could be a martyr) 

From this we can assume that in both the Journey to Shinovar and the Duel that they don't go as planned and effect the plot in major and unseen ways that are hinted at. One of these ways is that Dalinar will lose, as this not only would allow for the war to continue to but also cause Dalinar to be forced onto Taravangians side. While this could simply end there and the majority of the book is set as Dalinar trying to resist and maintain his oaths which eventually leads to him swearing another oath which allows him to break free or fail again, I think something greater will happen. 

I think Dalinar will swear his oaths and once Odium is by his side and someone else or someone figures out how to reforge honor, Dalinar will force Odium to bond with Honor of which I think he was meant to all along due to his condition. Being a person of two minds. Emotion and logic, Odium and Honor. Giving him the ability to utilize both shards intent properly something that Sazed struggles with himself while maintaining the ability to act and moniter each of the shards properly, each being a foil of the other while still allowing agency. Then I think over the course of the book Cultivation(before this event) will interact with and sort of act as a mentor to Todium in his shard ways, but when he becomes Twinshards like Cultivation wanted, he instead turns on her and Roshar once again splits into multiple sides, this time being Cultivation vs TodiumHonor vs those who remain. 

I think this also contributes to what Kaladin does as I think that in Shinovar that Kaladin gains or learns something about the shards and eventually(with some knights like Shallan and Adolin who will probably revive his blade) make a new independant faction for the knights that deny the shards and fight for the people of Roshar instead of anyone else and I think might gain some power that puts them on the same stage as the others, possibly a Dawnshard? 

I think that Dalinar will also take some knights to join Todium as well. probably due to the pact. But I think that most of the spren(at least the Windrunner and Edgedancer orders) will deny Todium and his goals as well as Cultivation(possibly) and make their own faction with Kaladin. Either way I feel like there will be three factions. I do know that Venli and her Willshapers will act as a strange but important piece in this though. 

But tell me what you think and definitely give me all of the criticism and ideas you have as well!!

[Argenti he/him]

27 minutes ago, One who Breaths and Reads said:

My theory is based on three key pieces of information from Sunlit man and TLM.

1. Kaladin is alive in some way but is not meant to be anywhere else (on Roshar presumably) 

2. Something bad is happening on Roshar, presumably a war(which would have ended if Dalinar won the battle of champions) that keeps it difficult to interact or gain support from. 

3. Something important is in Shinovar and Cultivation is planning something big

Now to explain, on revision and reading through the various books set after the events of Stormlight 5 that there still is some kind of conflict on Roshar thats keeping it preoccupied with itself and makes it dangerous. We also know that something BIG happens to Kaladin to make it impossible for Kaladin to not be on Canticle (planet its set on) and is implied to still be alive (although he possibly can just be dead, but I feel like Brandon is setting him up for something more, although it could be a martyr) 

From this we can assume that in both the Journey to Shinovar and the Duel that they don't go as planned and effect the plot in major and unseen ways that are hinted at. One of these ways is that Dalinar will lose, as this not only would allow for the war to continue to but also cause Dalinar to be forced onto Taravangians side. While this could simply end there and the majority of the book is set as Dalinar trying to resist and maintain his oaths which eventually leads to him swearing another oath which allows him to break free or fail again, I think something greater will happen. 

I think Dalinar will swear his oaths and once Odium is by his side and someone else or someone figures out how to reforge honor, Dalinar will force Odium to bond with Honor of which I think he was meant to all along due to his condition. Being a person of two minds. Emotion and logic, Odium and Honor. Giving him the ability to utilize both shards intent properly something that Sazed struggles with himself while maintaining the ability to act and moniter each of the shards properly, each being a foil of the other while still allowing agency. Then I think over the course of the book Cultivation(before this event) will interact with and sort of act as a mentor to Todium in his shard ways, but when he becomes Twinshards like Cultivation wanted, he instead turns on her and Roshar once again splits into multiple sides, this time being Cultivation vs TodiumHonor vs those who remain. 

I think this also contributes to what Kaladin does as I think that in Shinovar that Kaladin gains or learns something about the shards and eventually(with some knights like Shallan and Adolin who will probably revive his blade) make a new independant faction for the knights that deny the shards and fight for the people of Roshar instead of anyone else and I think might gain some power that puts them on the same stage as the others, possibly a Dawnshard? 

I think that Dalinar will also take some knights to join Todium as well. probably due to the pact. But I think that most of the spren(at least the Windrunner and Edgedancer orders) will deny Todium and his goals as well as Cultivation(possibly) and make their own faction with Kaladin. Either way I feel like there will be three factions. I do know that Venli and her Willshapers will act as a strange but important piece in this though. 

But tell me what you think and definitely give me all of the criticism and ideas you have as well!!

OHHHH I do like this idea, I suspect that Venli would side with Cultivation.

[alder24]

12 hours ago, One who Breaths and Reads said:

My theory is based on three key pieces of information from Sunlit man and TLM.

The Sunlit Man spoilers are NOT allowed here. This topic should be made in the Spoiler Zone, specifically in The Sunlit Man (Cosmere Spoilers) subforum. I've asked mods to move it there for you.

My response will include uncovered spoilers for the Sunlit Man, as I hope this thread will be quickly moved to the correct section of the forum.

 

 

12 hours ago, One who Breaths and Reads said:

1. Kaladin is alive in some way but is not meant to be anywhere else (on Roshar presumably) 

We don't know this.

12 hours ago, One who Breaths and Reads said:

2. Something bad is happening on Roshar, presumably a war(which would have ended if Dalinar won the battle of champions) that keeps it difficult to interact or gain support from. 

And we don't know this as well. From TLM we know Roshar is dangerous for Ghostbloods, we don't know if that's for everyone. It might mean that Shallan succeeded in her fight against Ghostbloods and expelled them from Roshar. 

12 hours ago, One who Breaths and Reads said:

3. Something important is in Shinovar and Cultivation is planning something big

What's your source on that? I'm asking because you've presented this as one of 3 pieces of information we know from books. And we don't know this - we suspect Cultivation is planning something more for Dalinar and Lift, based on what she did with Taravangian, but we don't know about anything important being in Shinovar. Ishar is there, that's it. 

 

Just so you remember, the events of the Sunlit Man are happening far, far in the future of Cosmere, near the end of the story. Faaar after SA10. The events referenced by the book could happen in the second half of SA, not in KoWT. Nomad became the Dawnshard when he was 38 years old, and this is definitely further in the future than KoWT based on his current age.

12 hours ago, One who Breaths and Reads said:

We also know that something BIG happens to Kaladin to make it impossible for Kaladin to not be on Canticle (planet its set on) and is implied to still be alive (although he possibly can just be dead, but I feel like Brandon is setting him up for something more, although it could be a martyr) 

Here is the problem with that. We don't know what any of this means. It could mean that Kaladin is dead, thus Nomad was surprised that he saw him, it could mean that Kaladin can't leave Roshar, or that Kaladin doesn't know about larger Cosmere/isn't interested in it. Or it might even mean that Nomad didn't believe that Kaladin would ever want to speak with him again. Or it could mean that logic dictates that it's nearly impossible to be on the same planet as Kaladin is, after doing a random Skip. We don't know what that meant, all we know is that Nomad was surprised by the thought of Kaladin being there.

I'm only trying to clarify that we don't know what happened to Kaladin based on TSM. All we know is that Nomad was surprised by his sight, which could indicate dozens of different things. But let's assume something major had happened to him for the sake of your theory. It’s still a fair assumption to make.

12 hours ago, One who Breaths and Reads said:

Dalinar will force Odium to bond with Honor of which I think he was meant to all along due to his condition. Being a person of two minds. Emotion and logic, Odium and Honor.

Bond is the wrong term, merge/fuse Odium with Honor. This is possible and even could be done by a Bondsmith.

Spoiler

CephandriusTW

Stormfather once said that "Three of sixteen ruled but now the Broken One reigns" and that "Odium reigns", is not crazy to think that Odium is the Broken One. My question is, could be possible to fuse Odium's shard (without Rayse) with the remanents of Honor (his Cognitive Shadow) in order to create a new whole Shard? Could Dalinar do something like that? He would be uniting them (two Shards, one of them supposed to be the Broken One and the other that we actually now is a bit broken).

Brandon Sanderson

[That] is possible

General Reddit 2020 (June 18, 2020)

But Honor isn't about logic, he's about bonds and natural laws.

12 hours ago, One who Breaths and Reads said:

Then I think over the course of the book Cultivation(before this event) will interact with and sort of act as a mentor to Todium in his shard ways, but when he becomes Twinshards like Cultivation wanted, he instead turns on her and Roshar once again splits into multiple sides, this time being Cultivation vs TodiumHonor vs those who remain. 

Oh, you mean Dalinar will merge Odium with Honor while Taravangian will remain their Vessel. 

 

Overall that's an interesting theory. While it's mostly based on speculation (like most theories), you cleverly combined them with what we know, what's possible or what we suspect might happen. It sounds more or less plausible in my opinion.

[Thewindrunners5thideal]

after reading the SLM I also thought that nomad seeing kaladin was a hint to him being alive though I know it could be many other things as well. But in a reread of Oathbringer when zahel and kaladin are fighting zahel eventually tells kaladin that he can’t join the ardentia because he won’t be able to stop doing what he’s doing because WAR is in his blood. War light is the mixing of honor and odium So I think this is foreshadowing that Kaladin will take up the shard of honor and odium though this likely wouldn’t be until much later, probably SA 10. 

Edited November 19, 2023 by Thewindrunners5thideal

[alder24]

38 minutes ago, Thewindrunners5thideal said:

But in a reread of Oathbringer when zahel and kaladin are fighting zahel eventually tells kaladin that he can’t join the ardentia because he won’t be able to stop doing what he’s doing because WAR is in his blood

Not exactly. It's not about war, it's about how passionate Kaladin is about fighting - not war, not killing but just fighting, the thrill of competition. RoW ch 15:

Quote

“You can’t join the ardents,” Zahel said to him, kneeling and touching one of the cloths with his finger, then lifting it and pinning it onto the drying line. He did the same for the others, each in turn.
“Why can’t I?” Kaladin asked. He wasn’t certain Zahel had the authority to forbid him, but he also wasn’t certain he wanted to take this path if Zahel —the one ardent he felt true respect for—was opposed. “Do you make everyone who wants to retire to the ardentia fight you for the privilege?”
“It wasn’t a fight about winning or losing,” Zahel said. “You’re not unwelcome because you lost; you’re unwelcome because you don’t belong with us.” He whipped a sheet in the air, then pinned it in place. “You love the fight, Kaladin. Not with the Thrill that Dalinar once felt, or even with the anticipation of a dandy going to a duel.
“You love it because it’s part of you. It’s your mistress, your passion, your lifeblood. You’d find the daily training unsatisfying. You’d thirst for something more. You’d eventually turn and leave, and that would put you in a worse position than if you’d never started.”