Could Hemalurgy Kill Hoid?

[Trusk'our he/him]

Hemalurgy can be used to remove chunks of Spiritweb from others, including Spiritweb pieces that allow for magical healing. So, if someone like Kelsier were to use Hemalurgy to rip off the power or Connection that allows for Hoid's magical healing, could he be killed?

[Weltall]

The closest thing we have to an on-point WoB is that Hoid can heal the Spiritual damage caused by Hemalurgy, with the side note that Weird Things could happen with Hoid and Hemalurgy.

[Quantus he/him]

21 hours ago, ShardlessVessel said:

That depends on how aluminum spikes actually work. You may need to place a spike in each bind point for each power you want to remove, and for Hoid that would be a large number of spikes in non-standard placements (as his spiritweb is warped from being a Dawnshard).

Possible I suppose but I doubt it.  The charts says All powers and it differentiates Any vs All in other instances.  Plus it worked to shut down a kandra's hemalurgy powers on the first try.  And they can move their spikes to different bind points at will so it would need to be perfect on that first try if it's one for one.

Edited May 25, 2022 by Quantus
I was Wrong...

[Returned he/him]

All we know about Hoid's immortality is that it's different from the others we've seen in the Cosmere, so I don't think we have enough information to talk about what effects specific mechanics would have (though I may have missed some newer information). It seems like it's not just magical healing in the vein of a goldmind or something though, so even if that power were removed from him it might not be enough to allow him to be killed.

[Quantus he/him]

He is almost certainly subject to Hemalurgy.  That being said, if his healing makes him as resistant to lasting Spiritual damage as was implied by his statements on Shardblades hurting him, then he might be able to recover from the damage. Anything that could bridge the gap enough to heal his Spiritweb and repair Hemalurgic Damage should get him going again, so you'd need to shut all those things down.  Offhand you'd probably need to neutralize Stormlight/Radiant healing, Feruchemical Gold Healing (from a Medallion if not innate), and for safe measure you probably need to steal his Breaths too. Sounds bad but one aluminum spike should be able to do most of that...  It becomes another question if his "original' immortality is something that could be removed by any single Spike (Mundane or Atium), and possibly whatever other benefits he may have gotten from being a Dawnshard (which still may or may not be his "original" immortality, iirc?). 

Given enough time with him imprisoned (and a lack of moral restraint), you could probably pincushion him enough to make it happen, and get some valuable spikes out of the deal. Alternatively, if you haphazardly Implant enough spikes in him and no Lynchpin Spike, his spiritweb should unravel all on its own.  That should do it regardless of whatever else he has going on.  

 

Edited May 24, 2022 by Quantus
Awful spelling...

[+ShardlessVessel]

5 hours ago, Quantus said:

Sounds bad but one aluminum spike should be able to do most of that... 

That depends on how aluminum spikes actually work. You may need to place a spike in each bind point for each power you want to remove, and for Hoid that would be a large number of spikes in non-standard placements (as his spiritweb is warped from being a Dawnshard).

[+ShardlessVessel]

3 hours ago, Quantus said:

Plus it worked to shut down a kandra's hemalurgy powers on the first try.

Can you provide me a quote for that? I'm not doubting you, but I don't remember the specific instance you are referring to.

Agreed on the language, though. According to the Hemalurgy table, atium "steals any power" while aluminum *removes all powers", so it might be that just having an aluminum spike in your body makes you unable to Invest.

[Quantus he/him]

4 hours ago, ShardlessVessel said:

Can you provide me a quote for that? I'm not doubting you, but I don't remember the specific instance you are referring to.

It didnt, I was wildly mis-recalling the details of the Shadows of Self Climax. That scene was just about getting a spike into the Kandra to restore Harmony's control/influence, but wasnt Aluminum and didnt impact the Kandra's powers.

4 hours ago, ShardlessVessel said:

Agreed on the language, though. According to the Hemalurgy table, atium "steals any power" while aluminum *removes all powers", so it might be that just having an aluminum spike in your body makes you unable to Invest.

That's my impression of the realmics of Aluminum, that it sort of Grounds out the investiture like an electrical circuit, negating powers by virtue of blanking the Investiture involved, removing the differential that makes any Kinetic motion (energy or otherwise) possible.

 

Hmmm, I wonder if a Returned can survive an Aluminum Spike?

[Arsteel]

On 25/05/2022 at 9:45 PM, Quantus said:

Hmmm, I wonder if a Returned can survive an Aluminum Spike?

I doubt it, but given what BS has said on spikes having a limit to the Investiture they can contain, maybe it depends on the number of Breaths a Returned has (i.e. the spike would absorb Breaths up to its limit, and if the limit was lower than the number of Breaths they had at the start, they'd survive). However, if aluminum spikes work the way @ShardlessVessel has suggested, then the number of Breaths they have wouldn't matter. They would stop being able to hold Investiture and all their Breaths would be purged, including their divine Breath.