Forgery hacking Hemalurgy?

[Trusk'our he/him]

Hemalurgy uses a smaller portion of power, just enough to hotwire the spiritweb.

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Questioner

I've got a list of various Cosmere bits of metal and I was wondering if you would rank them from like one to ten or just easy to difficult on how hard it would be to steelpush on them. So with one being just a regular coin, ten being like when the Lord Ruler was moving bits of glass on the floor, so like metal inside a person's body.

Brandon Sanderson

It depends on how strong the Investiture in them is.

Questioner

Is that gonna be the answer for all of these?

Brandon Sanderson

Probably!

Questioner

How about a spike charged with Hemalurgy?

Brandon Sanderson

A spike charged with Hemalurgy... that depends on...

Questioner

Not in a person.

Brandon Sanderson

Depends on how strong, yeah, a spike is moderately, (in the realm of these kinds of things) moderately easy to push on because a spike does not rip off very much Investiture. Only enough to short circuit the soul, and less it over time. I would put that at the bottom, with the top being very hard, to be one of the easier things.

Questioner

How about a metalmind that is full?

Brandon Sanderson

That is full? That is going to be middle of the realm of the, yeah. Generally easier than, for instance, a Shardblade which is going to be very hard.

Questioner #2

A Shardblade is [inaudible] actually metal? [metal]-ish?

Brandon Sanderson

Ish. Is Lerasium a metal? Yeah.

Questioner

So that'd be the same for Shardplate too?

Brandon Sanderson

Shardplate and Blade are very hard. Blade is probably gonna be a little harder.

Questioner

A Half-shard?

Brandon Sanderson

A Half-shard shield? That's gonna be moderate.

Questioner

Nightblood? I imagine that being hard.

Brandon Sanderson

Hard, of all the things you've listed, that is going to be the hardest. Far beyond even a Sharblade.

Questioner

Far beyond metal inside a person? 

Brandon Sanderson

Uh, yes. Depending on how invested the person is.

Questioner

If somebody was invested as much as Nightblood?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, for instance the God King, right. At the end with all those Breaths. Pushing something inside of him, getting through all of that? Gonna be real hard. Average person on Scadrial? You've seen how hard that is. A drab? Much easier.

Questioner

That was my next one, or no, sorry not a drab. A lifeless?

Brandon Sanderson

A Lifeless, yeah. Even... yeah. Lifeless are kind of weird because they've had their soul leave but then they've had a replacement stuck in in the form of Breath which leaves them in a very weird position compared to a drab which has had part of their Investiture ripped away but a majority remains, so, anyways. I'm going to give you one more. Pick your favorite.

Questioner

A soulstamped piece of metal?

Brandon Sanderson

A soulstamped piece of metal is going to be on the lower, easier side. Not a lot of Investiture going on in a soulstamp.

 

 

So, could Forgery reasonably be used to create a hemalurgic spike that functions as any other spike would?

[NameIess]

It probably could be used to make a hemalurgic spike, although it might not function as a normal spike would, given that it would have the Dor in it instead of whatever investiture it would otherwise have.

[Honorless he/him]

Instead of stealing an attribute, you want to Forge an attribute?

I... honestly don't know. A spike isn't Hemalurgically charged until you pierce someone, I think. So you might have to charge it via Forgery as well.

[Trusk'our he/him]

13 hours ago, Honorless said:

Instead of stealing an attribute, you want to Forge an attribute?

I... honestly don't know. A spike isn't Hemalurgically charged until you pierce someone, I think. So you might have to charge it via Forgery as well.

What I meant was, could you place a forgery on a metal spike and turn it into a hemalurgic spike, but fueled by the Dor, not Ruin.

[Honorless he/him]

On 12/16/2021 at 11:59 PM, Trusk'our said:

What I meant was, could you place a forgery on a metal spike and turn it into a hemalurgic spike, but fueled by the Dor, not Ruin.

Yeah, same thing, you want to Forge a Hemalurgic charge.

Brandon's kept relatively mum about Forging a Connection to a Shard and a location and how well that would work out to access a magic:

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Questioner

If you Stamp yourself, to have another, overwritten spiritweb, and you get Spiked-- *laughter* What would happen?

Brandon Sanderson

We actually worked this out. *laughter*

Questioner

Well, you'd die, or very close to it, but would it revert when the Stamp reverts?

Brandon Sanderson

So what’s probably going to happen here is that you’re going to rip off the Investiture you’ve put on your soul, and your own soul will have less damage. Now, the spike is only gonna get the-- the spike, you're like "What will it do?" It will do what you've been overwritten with, but again remember, becoming an Allomancer takes so much energy, and things like-- But it is theoretically possible in the cosmere to rewrite yourself "You're an allomancer", someone spikes you to get this. The Investiture doesn't care that it was fake on you, you have managed to get that Investiture to work. Uhh, this is really tough. And really, like, you need Connection, and you need, like, the right kind of Investiture, but then it rips off and yes you have made a spike that makes you an Allomancer, even though the person was a Forger. So yes, okay? But this is the kind of stuff that is like the thought experiments for physicists in the cosmere as opposed to, y'know--

Arcanum Unbounded Chicago signing (Dec. 6, 2016)

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Questioner

If you Soulstamp somebody to give them a Connection to Arelon, and they became an Elantrian, could they become and Elantrian, and if the Soulstamp is removed, would they remain?

Brandon Sanderson

Okay, so you're asking a better one than people have asked. So you say "You get Soulstamped, you move to Arelon, your soul thinks that it is this, you do have spiritweb of Connection" I will go ahead and RAFO this with the caveat of why it might not work, is because, you might think you’re something, right? That doesn't necessarily mean-- Like, this is not completely invisible and things like this. And so, whether the power is going to follow those lines of Connection or not I will leave up to discussion, but it is a possibility worth theorizing upon.

Questioner

So a Soulstamp doesn't necessarily change the core of your spiritweb.

Brandon Sanderson

It does, but it's overwriting it. It's like Hemalurgy. What you are is still there underneath when it's ripped away, right?

Arcanum Unbounded Chicago signing (Dec. 6, 2016)

(Note to the second one as there's a bit more to the Shaod and becoming Elantrian and he has since confirmed Connection shenanigans to make AonDor work off-world iirc)

It wouldn't be as difficult as accessing the Dor or Allomancy as anyone can become a Hemalurgist, you won't need a connection to Scadrial and not too significant of a connection to Ruin, just knowledge, Intent and spiking. Without the spiking, you'll need to Forge a bit of Connection. We know that creating Connections is possible at least: the Connection orb in Secret History. So it might be possible to Forge a Hemalurgic charge, yeah

Edited December 17, 2021 by Honorless

[Trusk'our he/him]

One other little quirk of using Forgery to create a 'clean' Hemalurgic spike might be that it doesn't cause you to ache from Ruin's investiture, since you're not using his investiture in this case, you're using the Dor, and whatever sensory effect it grants.

[Trusk'our he/him]

Part two! When you use a Soulstamp, it can grant you memories and skills of another possible life you could have led. Could you then use a Soulstamp on yourself that gave you memories of you testing Hemalurgic bind points, then before the stamp fades away, write down the information and use it for later? This way you'd be able to "experiment" with Hemalurgy without needing to actually hurt anyone.