CameronUluvara Posted February 26, 2021 Report Share Posted February 26, 2021 On 2/24/2021 at 10:02 PM, Andy92 said: I’m pretty sure the storm responding is the Stormlight returning to him, not a literal high storm. Considering that it is literally possible for the storm to respond to Kaladin, like it did in Oathbringer, it seems kinda weak to write that Death Rattle and it only refer to Stormlight 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy92 Posted February 27, 2021 Report Share Posted February 27, 2021 8 hours ago, CameronUluvara said: Considering that it is literally possible for the storm to respond to Kaladin, like it did in Oathbringer, it seems kinda weak to write that Death Rattle and it only refer to Stormlight Given the circumstance I think it fits. We hadn’t seen a character regress in their oaths “on screen” like that before. Losing his ability to use Stormlight was a huge plot point to the story. Plus, death rattles are rarely written super explicitly. Having “I raise my hand. The Stormlight responds.” as the death rattle sounds a bit too on-the-nose. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathiau Posted February 27, 2021 Report Share Posted February 27, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Andy92 said: Given the circumstance I think it fits. We hadn’t seen a character regress in their oaths “on screen” like that before. Losing his ability to use Stormlight was a huge plot point to the story. Plus, death rattles are rarely written super explicitly. Having “I raise my hand. The Stormlight responds.” as the death rattle sounds a bit too on-the-nose. You could have had "the light answer", maybe. But remember that we had that for Kal's 2nd Oath Quote Above the final void I hang, friends behind, friends before. The feast I must drink clings to their faces, and the words I must speak spark in my mind. The old oaths will be spoken anew. And that for Ash destroying a painting of herself Quote A woman sits and scratches out her own eyes. Daughter of kings and winds, the vandal. So I'm not surprised by this level of weirdness Edited February 27, 2021 by mathiau 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy92 Posted February 27, 2021 Report Share Posted February 27, 2021 2 minutes ago, mathiau said: You could have had "the light answer" maybe But remember that we had that for Kal's 2nd Oath And that for Ash destroying a painting of herself Yeah, I know some are less cryptic than others. I still think in the case of his 3rd Ideal and the situation at hand, his Stormlight returning was the big deal given that he had lost it. And it could be a mix of both. I just always read it more in the Stormlight way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CameronUluvara Posted March 1, 2021 Report Share Posted March 1, 2021 (edited) 'Above the final void' is his second oath? that doesn't seem right...I thought that was Dalinar's third oath He must pick it up, the fallen title! The tower, the crown, and the spear! The fallen title being Stormblessed. it was what he used to be called, and immediately after the second oath, Dalinar starts calling him Stormblessed, saying he heard it from the men. He took up the title again. The tower and the crown being saving Dalinar, because those are the glyphs on his house banner. And then the spear, because Kaladin wasn't sure if he wanted to go back to the spear. He wouldn't even pick one up for practice. but eventually he takes up the spear and swears his second oath. This Death Rattle fits very well. Edited March 1, 2021 by CameronUluvara 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathiau Posted March 1, 2021 Report Share Posted March 1, 2021 17 minutes ago, CameronUluvara said: 'Above the final void' is his second oath? that doesn't seem right...I thought that was Dalinar's third oath Kal is literally above a Chasm at that moment Quote He must pick it up, the fallen title! The tower, the crown, and the spear! Could be about Kal yes, I don't think this one has happened yet, not completely at least 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CameronUluvara Posted March 3, 2021 Report Share Posted March 3, 2021 No. That's not right. There are 'friends behind,' but no 'friends before' him waiting on the other side. A chasm is a void, but not the final void. 'The words I must speak spark in my mind' happens literally every single time a Radiant swears an oath. What is 'the feast he must drink?' To whom's faces does it cling? Explain the fit? it doesn't match up well to Kaladin's second oath, but it does match Dalinar's third oath. And as I have explained above, the 'He must pick it up" Death Rattle fits perfectly. I can also explain why 'Above the final void' fits Dalinar's third oath if you like. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejarden Posted March 3, 2021 Report Share Posted March 3, 2021 13 minutes ago, CameronUluvara said: No. That's not right. There are 'friends behind,' but no 'friends before' him waiting on the other side. A chasm is a void, but not the final void. 'The words I must speak spark in my mind' happens literally every single time a Radiant swears an oath. What is 'the feast he must drink?' To whom's faces does it cling? Explain the fit? it doesn't match up well to Kaladin's second oath, but it does match Dalinar's third oath. And as I have explained above, the 'He must pick it up" Death Rattle fits perfectly. I can also explain why 'Above the final void' fits Dalinar's third oath if you like. Yeah please do 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathiau Posted March 3, 2021 Report Share Posted March 3, 2021 14 minutes ago, CameronUluvara said: No. That's not right. There are 'friends behind,' but no 'friends before' him waiting on the other side. A chasm is a void, but not the final void. 'The words I must speak spark in my mind' happens literally every single time a Radiant swears an oath. What is 'the feast he must drink?' To whom's faces does it cling? Explain the fit? The friends before are Dalinar's army and the feast is the Stormlight in the Parshendi's beards 14 minutes ago, CameronUluvara said: I can also explain why 'Above the final void' fits Dalinar's third oath if you like. Please do, Dalinar seems more at the bottom of the final void than above it at this moment. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CameronUluvara Posted March 3, 2021 Report Share Posted March 3, 2021 No doubt, no, huh? Okay, at that section (which I don't have in front of me) I am assuming the wording of 'the final void' to refer to Odium, yah know, the final void that consumes all emotions? the big purple End of It All? and Dalinar does start rising up in the air with the gloryspren, above this odious final void that he almost fell into, no? and that line about Odium looking small? So he hangs, with his army and his wife and his allies and-a lot of people really-behind him, and Amaram, his traitorous friend that he's still trying to redeem, as well as the Sadeas army that should have been friendly, and his boi Nergoual before him. And the feast he must drink, that's The Thrill, and its clinging to their faces, they're all twisted up in horrible grimaces from the influence. He has to drink of Nergoual, his old friend, one last time in order to capture him, and get rid of those red eyes in their faces. If I had the book here, I could find the exact phrases in that scene...but oh well. I might add to this later. I don't deny that practically anything could match practically anything, and you've got decent arguments for this one. I just think 'He must pick it up' matches better. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathiau Posted March 3, 2021 Report Share Posted March 3, 2021 12 minutes ago, CameronUluvara said: No doubt, no, huh? Okay, at that section (which I don't have in front of me) I am assuming the wording of 'the final void' to refer to Odium, yah know, the final void that consumes all emotions? the big purple End of It All? and Dalinar does start rising up in the air with the gloryspren, above this odious final void that he almost fell into, no? and that line about Odium looking small? So he hangs, with his army and his wife and his allies and-a lot of people really-behind him, and Amaram, his traitorous friend that he's still trying to redeem, as well as the Sadeas army that should have been friendly, and his boi Nergoual before him. And the feast he must drink, that's The Thrill, and its clinging to their faces, they're all twisted up in horrible grimaces from the influence. He has to drink of Nergoual, his old friend, one last time in order to capture him, and get rid of those red eyes in their faces. If I had the book here, I could find the exact phrases in that scene...but oh well. I might add to this later. I don't deny that practically anything could match practically anything, and you've got decent arguments for this one. I just think 'He must pick it up' matches better. That does make sense, I still think your version of 'the feast I must drink' is weirder than mine, but your interpretation is possible. Though if that Death Rattle is indeed about Dalinar's 3rd Oath then "friends before" is about Venli and not Amaram. Quote End of It All? Odium is not the End of All, Ruin is. (Odium still works as a final Void though) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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