Kadrok Posted May 16, 2013 Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 This is something that came up in another thread reply, but I thought it could also be discussed here. Mike Cockrum (23 January 2013)How many shards has Hoid received powers from, whether taken, stolen, given, etc.? Brandon Sanderson (23 January 2013)Well, he has a bead of Lerasium. We know that Hoid has a bead Lerasium...as in... he HAS Lerasium... not had and burnt it, he HAS Lerasium. So he may already have Allomancy, or he may be keeping it for some other purpose, like the secret primary use of Lerasium we don't know about... OR, and here's where it gets interesting... if his Feruchemy DOES utilize metals (See my post in Shardlet's "Shardworld DNA blueprint based on Yolen DNA"), or at least CAN utilize metals, perhaps Hoid is using the bead as a metalmind. (This assumes my other theory which involves Lerasium or an alloy being a Metalmind for the ability to use Feruchemy itself is incorrect... a parallel speculation) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
makromag Posted May 16, 2013 Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 Hmm, that does sound very interesting. It was confirmed by Brandon, that Hoid uses feruchemy to know where he has to be/ to know where important events will happen. I had always wondered what he could possibly be storing, and into what metal, that would give him such information. Perhaps the lerasium has to do with that. I wonder, what can you store in lerasium...? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Monstrosity Posted May 16, 2013 Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 We know that Hoid has a bead Lerasium...as in... he HAS Lerasium... not had and burnt it, he HAS Lerasium. So he may already have Allomancy, or he may be keeping it for some other purpose, like the secret primary use of Lerasium we don't know about... OR, and here's where it gets interesting... if his Feruchemy DOES utilize metals (See my post in Shardlet's "Shardworld DNA blueprint based on Yolen DNA"), or at least CAN utilize metals, perhaps Hoid is using the bead as a metalmind. Well, there's no reason to assume he only took one. It would make way more sense for 16 beads to be produced than only 12 or 13. He could have used any other potential beads. Hmm, that does sound very interesting. It was confirmed by Brandon, that Hoid uses feruchemy to know where he has to be/ to know where important events will happen. I had always wondered what he could possibly be storing, and into what metal, that would give him such information. Perhaps the lerasium has to do with that. I wonder, what can you store in lerasium...? My theory's always been 'luck, a ton of darts, and a map'. He only gets a vague idea of where important things are happening, so... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadrok Posted May 16, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 (edited) I have heard the 16 beads theory before, and I too favour it, it makes a lot of sense (were you the source by any chance?) I like to imagine my MAG team burned the other Lerasium beads... Edited May 16, 2013 by Kadrok 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruffblade027 Posted May 28, 2014 Report Share Posted May 28, 2014 How do we know Hoid has lerasium? I've read and reread Well of Ascension looking for the clue and I can't find it. I mean everyone seems to agree that he went to the Well before Vin, and that he took a bead of lerasium. But how do we know that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Left Posted May 28, 2014 Report Share Posted May 28, 2014 WoB. He gets to the well before Vin and everybody. The broken jar is like the only evidence that he was there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aether Posted May 28, 2014 Report Share Posted May 28, 2014 WoB. He gets to the well before Vin and everybody. The broken jar is like the only evidence that he was there. I seem to remember that there were some footprints as well that would have belonged to Hoid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWS Posted May 28, 2014 Report Share Posted May 28, 2014 All the threads I've read about it seem to agree hoid is either using it for a mind or a spike (or both) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pechvarry Posted May 28, 2014 Report Share Posted May 28, 2014 I seem to remember that there were some footprints as well that would have belonged to Hoid. The footsteps were in the snow of the original ending posted on his site. For the new ending, the annotations state that, as soon as he overheard the well's actual location, he shadesmar-ported there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aether Posted May 28, 2014 Report Share Posted May 28, 2014 The footsteps were in the snow of the original ending posted on his site. For the new ending, the annotations state that, as soon as he overheard the well's actual location, he shadesmar-ported there. But weren't there some footsteps in the dust on the inside of the chamber? I might have to reread the passage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AerionBFII Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 I personally believe Hoid has always had Feruchemy. I think he already had Feruchemy but Allomancy was a fairly recent thing and he was looking for a way to become an Allomancer during the events of book 1 and 2. Which Brandon stated was his goal. He arrived shortly before Vin and took a Bead (hence the smashed jar) but he found a different unique way to use it than he had originally intended. I think he puts the Bead beneath his skin. Disgusting i know but bear with me. By putting the Bead beneath his skin he would be able to use it for Feruchemical purposes and hypothetically make him an Allomancer due to the fact that he used Emotinal Allomancy on the Davars and the common belief he still hasn't burned it. Let me first assure you that the element is quite safe. I have found a good home for it. I protect its safety like I protect my own skin, you might say. This seems like the sort of half truths that Hoid likes to tell and i think it has merit to what i have been saying. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pestis the Spider Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 Are Lerasium beads impossible to split somehow? I mean, normal metal chunks can always be split to smaller chunks. And because Lerasium works in pretty specific way, it shouldn't really matter how much of it you burn it. What I mean is that if you burn lerasium, you become Mistborn, if you don't you don't. I don't think you become less of the Mistborn, when you burn half of the Lerasium bead or something, than when you burn it whole. So I think he could've burn the small part, and keep the rest, really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moogle Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 Are Lerasium beads impossible to split somehow? I mean, normal metal chunks can always be split to smaller chunks. And because Lerasium works in pretty specific way, it shouldn't really matter how much of it you burn it. What I mean is that if you burn lerasium, you become Mistborn, if you don't you don't. I don't think you become less of the Mistborn, when you burn half of the Lerasium bead or something, than when you burn it whole. So I think he could've burn the small part, and keep the rest, really. Lerasium is additive. If you burn it while already an Allomancer, you become a stronger Mistborn than a non-Allomancer who burned an equal chunk. This implies that your strength as a Mistborn is proportional to how much lerasium you burn. Hoid could have burned only a little bit of his bead I think, but he'd be a less powerful Allomancer in exchange. Which might be what happened. He doesn't need to be TLR-level strong for Allomancy to be absurdly useful. Even if he were as powerful as Vin, his Compounding would still be crazy. He'd just need to burn more metals (maybe?) to fill his metalminds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROSHtaFARian2.0 Posted January 19, 2015 Report Share Posted January 19, 2015 Well Brandon has always said that you could do some really cool things with Lerasium if you know what you were doing (and who knows what they're doing more than Hoid? Well possibly Khriss and Frost, but you know what I mean). But given how much Ruin and Preservation paralleled each other in every way, it always seemed likely to me that their magic systems were similarly paralleled. By which I mean, since we know hemalurgy can be used to essentially hack any other Shard's magic system, on any planet, it always seemed to me that there had to be some mechanism by which Preservation's magic could be used to do the same. So if lerasium essentially makes Mistborns by rewriting the spiritual DNA of whoever burns it to reconfigure that person's spiritual aspect to be enough in tune with Preservation's Investiture to allow allomancy, theoretically it always seemed likely to me that with enough know-how, lerasium could be used to rewrite a person's spiritual DNA to allow access to any other Investiture too. I was always thinking of it in terms of allomancy, but feruchemy is of Preservation too, so perhaps the means to accomplish that is using lerasium as a metalmind? And by doing so, Hoid has access to every Shardworld's magic, or can use the magic of other worlds (like Yolish Lightweaving) regardless of the planet he's on? On a related note....I wonder how many other worldhoppers have access to lerasium and atium? We all spent a lot of time trying to figure out if and how a certain Elantrian could use AonDor on Roshar....could an Elantrian use lerasium to make it easier to use AonDor on other Shardworlds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadrok Posted January 19, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 19, 2015 Wow, someone dug up this old thing. I was always thinking of it in terms of allomancy, but feruchemy is of Preservation too, so perhaps the means to accomplish that is using lerasium as a metalmind? I had a similar idea in another thread. I also build on that a little here, suggesting a reason why there were Lerasium beads left in the Chamber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoidhunter Posted January 21, 2015 Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 I've really been wondering where the first allomancers and feruchemists came from to begin with. I mean...I know about Rashek giving beads of lerasium to his allies and taking one for himself...but there were feruchemists around before the ascension...as well as allomancers. Alendi had a hemalurgic spike in him that made him a seeker (he may have also been one beforehand) so there must have been an allomancer around to make the spike from...right? Also...I like the whole "tapping lerasium makes you into a feruchemist" thing...makes sense in a way...and explains why there were a lot of full feruchemists in the terris culture early on. On a separate (but similar) note...when the crystal in the pits of hathsin produce atium...it actually produces a geode that contains atium inside of it...perhaps the weird pottery that was enclosing all of the beads of lerasium is a similar thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadrok Posted January 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 On a separate (but similar) note...when the crystal in the pits of hathsin produce atium...it actually produces a geode that contains atium inside of it...perhaps the weird pottery that was enclosing all of the beads of lerasium is a similar thing. I've heard that theory before, and am inclined to agree. The person who said it before, suggested the Well of Ascension was producing Lerasium beads in much the same way the Pits of Hathsin were producing Atium beads, albeit at a much slower rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze1616 Posted January 21, 2015 Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 I've really been wondering where the first allomancers and feruchemists came from to begin with. I mean...I know about Rashek giving beads of lerasium to his allies and taking one for himself...but there were feruchemists around before the ascension...as well as allomancers. Alendi had a hemalurgic spike in him that made him a seeker (he may have also been one beforehand) so there must have been an allomancer around to make the spike from...right? Also...I like the whole "tapping lerasium makes you into a feruchemist" thing...makes sense in a way...and explains why there were a lot of full feruchemists in the terris culture early on. On a separate (but similar) note...when the crystal in the pits of hathsin produce atium...it actually produces a geode that contains atium inside of it...perhaps the weird pottery that was enclosing all of the beads of lerasium is a similar thing. Just to clarify, there were not allomancers before TLR's ascension. Feruchemists, yes, but not allomancers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeiryWriter Posted January 21, 2015 Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 Just to clarify, there were not allomancers before TLR's ascension. Feruchemists, yes, but not allomancers. Actually there /were/ Allomancers before Rashek's Ascension, Alendi was a Seeker after all. The Mist was snapping people then as it did during the trilogy, but since no one had ever consumed lerasium there were only mistings, and weak ones at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argent Posted January 21, 2015 Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 Actually there /were/ Allomancers before Rashek's Ascension, Alendi was a Seeker after all. The Mist was snapping people then as it did during the trilogy, but since no one had ever consumed lerasium there were only mistings, and weak ones at that. Source Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze1616 Posted January 21, 2015 Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 Actually there /were/ Allomancers before Rashek's Ascension, Alendi was a Seeker after all. The Mist was snapping people then as it did during the trilogy, but since no one had ever consumed lerasium there were only mistings, and weak ones at that. Source Ah, thank you for the clarification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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