Kobold King Posted May 19, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2015 Aww man, I was planning on revealing that in the next game day. Thanks for ruining the surprise. Sorry. I left out the part about how Neverthere is the incarnation of Echidna, the mother of monsters in Greek mythology, so I guess you can still pursue that plot line... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer Posted May 19, 2015 Report Share Posted May 19, 2015 Earliest possible is fine. If that means giving her a completely unnecessary power to sense when an Epic is going to have a child and teleport there, so be it. So nothing about the child enslaving its not Epic sibling? Sorry. I left out the part about how Neverthere is the incarnation of Echidna, the mother of monsters in Greek mythology, so I guess you can still pursue that plot line... What's next? Will you reveal Voidgaze's true nature as the mother godess? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kobold King Posted May 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 What's next? Will you reveal Voidgaze's true nature as the mother godess? Well I don't want to give too many spoilers, but... For a while now I've been planning on having Sam get mysteriously pregnant and give birth to the Spawn of Typhon, who upon birth will emit the Piercing Wail that will end all life in Oregon. But don't tell anyone. It's a secret. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistrunner Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 I thought this would be a theory about whether babies can become epics. This is slightly better. Slightly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarcasm Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) I thought this would be a theory about whether babies can become epics. This is slightly better. Slightly. Actually, you bring up an interesting point. I think that babies could become Epics, unless Calamity didn't choose them because they "weren't worthy" of such great power. However, I'm feeling some deja vu with Elantris, here, where (minor minor spoiler) People of all ages were taken by the Shaod (though how children could be dedicated to something, I don't know. Dedicated to peek a boo? Edited May 21, 2015 by Sarcasm 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mistrunner Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) Actually, you bring up an interesting point. I think that babies could become Epics, unless Calamity didn't choose them because they "weren't worthy" of such great power. However, I'm feeling some deja vu with Elantris, here, where (minor minor spoiler) People of all ages were taken by the Shaod (though how children could be dedicated to something, I don't know. Dedicated to peek a boo? True. And behind the tone of my response, I really was interested to see if there was some base for this. And what about other magic systems? Roshar? If Lift, who's thirteen, can become an edgedancer, what about younger people? I think kids can Snap, if (Mistborn spoiler) Vin's baby sister could be a seeker. Anyone up for baby-based theorizing? Edited May 21, 2015 by mistrunner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voidus Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 True. And behind the tone of my response, I really was interested to see if there was some base for this. And what about other magic systems? Roshar? If Lift, who's thirteen, can become an edgedancer, what about younger people? I think kids can Snap, if (Mistborn spoiler) Vin's baby sister could be a seeker. Anyone up for baby-based theorizing? Should probably be moved to the cosmere theories board if it's going to get into a meta-discussion. For Roshar though I doubt it, babies aren't particularly notorious for honorable acts. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackhoof Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 I still think Epic babies aren't and won't be a thing, nor will they be a possible thing. I think he just wants to be vague to keep up guessing. I'm of the opinion that Calamity will die at the end of Calamity, and all Epics will lose their powers. Therefore making the Epic-baby question irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 I still think Epic babies aren't and won't be a thing, nor will they be a possible thing. I think he just wants to be vague to keep up guessing. I'm of the opinion that Calamity will die at the end of Calamity, and all Epics will lose their powers. Therefore making the Epic-baby question irrelevant. Given that in the conversation was specifically aware of the RP and offered to look through his notes for it I don't think he'd make such a bait and switch just to rebouf it again in the next book. Because honestly, that would be pretty mean. Something like only redeemed Epics I could see but flat out impossible? Nah, not at this point. Maybe but maybe David becomes the new Calamity and repools Epics so they don't turn evil and gives them a focus instead of a weakness. (So Steelheart would have needed a sidekick that isn't afraid of him and would have lost his powers if that sidekick got afraid of him.) It ain't impossible. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voidus Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 Given that in the conversation was specifically aware of the RP and offered to look through his notes for it I don't think he'd make such a bait and switch just to rebouf it again in the next book. Because honestly, that would be pretty mean. Something like only redeemed Epics I could see but flat out impossible? Nah, not at this point. Maybe but maybe David becomes the new Calamity and repools Epics so they don't turn evil and gives them a focus instead of a weakness. (So Steelheart would have needed a sidekick that isn't afraid of him and would have lost his powers if that sidekick got afraid of him.) It ain't impossible. I'm inclined to agree, Brandon can be particularly careful of his wording sometimes but I doubt he'd say something like this just to flat out contradict it in what may well be the last book in the Reckoners universe, it just wouldn't serve any purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwiLyghtSansSparkles Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) I still think Epic babies aren't and won't be a thing, nor will they be a possible thing. I think he just wants to be vague to keep up guessing. I'm of the opinion that Calamity will die at the end of Calamity, and all Epics will lose their powers. Therefore making the Epic-baby question irrelevant. That would be a horrible ending. Every area that needed an Epic to remain standing (Babilar with Dawnslight) would be screwed. Sure, they'd learn to adjust, but the initial blow would kill thousands. And then what do they have? A broken world, with areas that won't be inhabitable for centuries, millions of people emotionally broken and dependent on gods who aren't even gods anymore. The resulting riots would kill hundreds, if not thousands more, and by the time humanity adjusted to the new normal, humanity could very well be an endangered species. Edited May 21, 2015 by TwiLyghtSansSparkles 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackhoof Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 Well I've certainly been wrong before, so it isn't out of the question haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackhoof Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) That would be a horrible ending. Every area that needed an Epic to remain standing (Babilar with Dawnslight) would be screwed. Sure, they'd learn to adjust, but the initial blow would kill thousands. And then what do they have? A broken world, with areas that won't be inhabitable for centuries, millions of people emotionally broken and dependent on gods who aren't even gods anymore. The resulting riots would kill hundreds, if not thousands more, and by the time humanity adjusted to the new normal, humanity could very well be an endangered species. I don't know, worse than what is currently happening, slow death by Epics? Is a long war where the Epics are defeated and killed one by one going to cause less destruction than if they all lost their powers in one hit? It isn't like humanity isn't already broken and endangered. And if the corruption is removed, I'm not sure things would be much better. I mean, could any normal person remain sane after realising what they have done? Maybe this would be the best of the outcomes, but it still leaves a broken world, with an entire caste of damaged, emotionally scarred, horrified and self-loathing super-humans, some of whom might do good with their powers, some of whom would shrug their shoulders and keep being evil (looking at you, Nighthound). Maybe the corruption being removed would be the best of three potential outcomes, but in none does the world end up ok and without massive upheaval. Heck, Prof foreshadowed the consequences of removing tyrants during Steelheart, and accepted it as a necessary evil. The same logic and morality should apply world-wide, one would think. And the inability of humans to fight back (well more importantly, win) on their own has constantly been re-inforced, especially in Firefight. Edited May 21, 2015 by Blackhoof Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwiLyghtSansSparkles Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 I don't know, worse than what is currently happening, slow death by Epics? Is a long war where the Epics are defeated and killed one by one going to cause less destruction than if they all lost their powers in one hit? It isn't like humanity isn't already broken and endangered. And if the corruption is removed, I'm not sure things would be much better. I mean, could any normal person remain sane after realising what they have done? Maybe this would be the best of the outcomes, but it still leaves a broken world, with an entire caste of damaged, emotionally scarred, horrified and self-loathing super-humans, some of whom might do good with their powers, some of whom would shrug their shoulders and keep being evil (looking at you, Nighthound). Maybe the corruption being removed would be the best of three potential outcomes, but in none does the world end up ok and without massive upheaval. There'd be massive upheaval and enormous fallout no matter what happened to the Epics, but at least an ending where they keep their powers allows humanity a chance at quicker recovery. Yes, it would be horrible, losing the corruption and being faced with what you'd done, but which is worse: being faced with what you've done and having the power to repair some of the damage, or being faced with what you've done and being just as powerless as anyone else to fix it? And yes, there would certainly be Nighthound-like Epics who wouldn't be much different after losing the corruption, but there would be others who changed profoundly, leading to a more traditional superheroes vs. villains dynamic. The world is never going to be the same no matter what happens, but Epics losing their powers permanently seems like the worst possible outcome to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackhoof Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 I think a long war would be worse. You have inability to rebuild the world with helpful superheroes combined with a whole heap of destruction caused by having to wipe out Epics all over the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwiLyghtSansSparkles Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 I think a long war would be worse. You have inability to rebuild the world with helpful superheroes combined with a whole heap of destruction caused by having to wipe out Epics all over the world. What about the Nighthounds of the world? If losing their corruption wouldn't change them much, do you really think they'll stop maiming and killing just because they've lost their powers? Now you have unrepentant serial killers stalking a post-apocalyptic landscape, and even though they don't have supernatural powers anymore, neither do those trying to stop them. Ridding every Epic of their powers doesn't negate the possibility of a long war; it just removes powers from the mix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackhoof Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 Its much easier to kill murderous psychopaths when they have no superpowers. They're just regular ones then. And if they were well-known or prominent psychopaths or rulers, then they wont be hard to identify. and now I have an image of all the twisted baddies in the world donning disguises to hide their identities "is that.... TIMEPORT? With a fake mustache!?" "what, no, never heard of him..." 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwiLyghtSansSparkles Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 Its much easier to kill murderous psychopaths when they have no superpowers. They're just regular ones then. And if they were well-known or prominent psychopaths or rulers, then they wont be hard to identify. and now I have an image of all the twisted baddies in the world donning disguises to hide their identities "is that.... TIMEPORT? With a fake mustache!?" "what, no, never heard of him..." Sure, but that's assuming an infrastructure that supports large-scale weapons manufacturing and a halfway decent law enforcement system. If redeemed Epics kept their powers, it would be easier to put both those in place, the former because of powers that make weapons manufacturing easier, the latter because the Epics could provide protection, greater stability, etc. for those communities out to hunt these serial killers. Make all Epics normal, and you have no large-scale weapons manufacturing until you get a factory up and running, which means you need some semblance of stability, which will be hard to come by with all the danger stalking you from every turn. Sure, these former Epics can't heal from major wounds or travel large distances anymore, but neither can those hunting them. The playing field is no more level than it would be if Epics kept their powers, and I'd argue they'd be worse off because hunting Nighthound with a bow would be harder than it looks, even when he's lost his powers. I think Timeport would do that anyway. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apepi Posted May 21, 2015 Report Share Posted May 21, 2015 My best guess is that they would be normal until they end up having their rending. Thought technically, Dawnslight is a child epic, as when he got into a coma he was a little kid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackhoof Posted May 22, 2015 Report Share Posted May 22, 2015 Like I said, the removal of corruption would be a little better, but its not like either ending leaves the world in a good place or doesn't involve mass chaos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwiLyghtSansSparkles Posted May 22, 2015 Report Share Posted May 22, 2015 Like I said, the removal of corruption would be a little better, but its not like either ending leaves the world in a good place or doesn't involve mass chaos. No, not at all. It's going to be a rough transition, no matter what happens. I just think that removing Epic powers along with the corruption would be the worst possible outcome, because the lack of powers would make the transition a thousand times harder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer Posted May 22, 2015 Report Share Posted May 22, 2015 No, not at all. It's going to be a rough transition, no matter what happens. I just think that removing Epic powers along with the corruption would be the worst possible outcome, because the lack of powers would make the transition a thousand times harder. Which is why reversing the polarity of the lotus eater within Calamity's comic book matrix, to achive a moral double wobble and turn all the Epics good would be a way better ending. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwiLyghtSansSparkles Posted May 22, 2015 Report Share Posted May 22, 2015 Which is why reversing the polarity of the lotus eater within Calamity's comic book matrix, to achive a moral double wobble and turn all the Epics good would be a way better ending. Have David and Megan pull some wibbly wobbly Epic ethics, turning every one of them into a hero? I like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackhoof Posted May 22, 2015 Report Share Posted May 22, 2015 Lol, reverse corruption. Instead of being creatures devoid of empathy, Epics become creatures of full empathy, being forced to empathise with everyone around them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwiLyghtSansSparkles Posted May 22, 2015 Report Share Posted May 22, 2015 Lol, reverse corruption. Instead of being creatures devoid of empathy, Epics become creatures of full empathy, being forced to empathise with everyone around them "Backtrack, why are you crying?" "Because...someone...in this room...they...they want a sandwich and...and they can't leave to get one!" Probably not the best ending either. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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