Shardlet

<asked in absolute earnestness> Have we seen fabrials that do require stormlight? I personally do not recall any passages regarding infusion of gems being required for the fabrials we have seen (i.e., spanreeds, Navani's massager thing, and Vstim's proximity sensor). Anyone got a handle on that?

Wow, this is like watching a tennis match.

Unless Elhokar has been to Shadesmar, the Cryptics can be seen in the physical realm . They also appear to be able to be in the physical realm since they are seen in Shallan's 'scenes', they follow her, and she can apparently physically feel them. A reasonable explanation as to why the Shardblades are not included in the AA under fabrials is because nobody would ever think of Shardblades as fabrials because 'everyone knows that fabrials are man-made (woman-made actually I suppose)' <to be read in a manner which suggests that this would be the prevailing manner of thinking rather than a direct quote or anything of the like>.

You know, this line of thought brings up some interesting things to me about the nature of the Shards (not the holders). A splinter is a piece of a Shard. Splinters may be formed voluntarily or involuntarily. We have been discussing the sentience of splinters, even going so far as to suggest that sentience may be an essential characteristic of a splinter. This suggests, at least in a backhanded way, that the Shard independent of its holder has a sentience of its own. And, by extension, that Adonalsium is sentient as well independent of any pre-existing sentience directing it. Interesting to think about.

I think that nobody had every thought of a stategy like this before Joel. The separation of the Rithmatists from others and their elite status would effectively prevent any strategy not conceived by a Rhithmatist to be ignored. Further, Rithmatists would likely balk at getting help from a non-Rhithmatist in the chalkling wars other than someone to serve them and carry and throw acid. Also, I'm pretty sure it was only the chalklings formed by capturing Rithmatists which were industructable. I didn't see anything to suggest that the wild chalklings were indestructable. I think the fact that acid is used to destroy chalklings rather than to delay them at nebrask says much on this point.

I suppose it would depend upon how big of a piece of the Shard the splinter is. Indeed some spren are as well. Although it appears that Syl's sentience is derived at least in part from her bond with Kaladin (and formerly others like Kaladin). Most spren seen to be manifestations (of energy?) that are attracted to a specific aspect (small splinters and therefore more of them). It will be interesting to learn more about the spren in WoR. If I am not mistaken, Brandon has said we will get a significant amount of info on spren (from Navani and Axies? and maybe Taln) as well as some serious meat on Shardblades. Edit: added spolier info.

As I understand it, the overwhelming majority of spren on Roshar are parts (or former parts) of Honor (i.e., splinters). While some spren are clearly sentient, I don't see any indication that all spren (like fear, anticipation, growth, fire, etc. spren) are sentient. I don't think sentience is a requirement for a splinter. Now, as far as hunting down splinters in the books, looking for sentience is a great way to find the low hanging fruit (so to speak, not saying 'well, duh!' or anything like that). It is a good rule of thumb for initial inquiry and identification.

If you'll recall, the shardblades have a gem in the pommel which flashes when a bond is formed between the blade and a new holder of the blade. Think about what else has gems and a strong connection to spren, fabrials! Now I would call shardblades Fabrials rather than fabrials because of their significant powers. But really most fabrials we have seen have some pretty amazing abilities. I think that shardblades are splinters of Honor, maybe cultivation (though this seems against her intent, but when faced with an enemy like Odium perhaps some allowances must be made), and possibly Odium (in the case of Szeth's blade). And I think that the splinter is contained within the pommel gem of the blade giving the swords their magnificent power. This would bridge the gap between the definite physical presence espoused by PM and also account for some of the blades sprennish qualities. Now before you say, 'Hah!, fabrials don't disappear when they are released, etc. etc.', consider this. Mere fabrials were created by Rosharians while, I believe, that Shardblades (Honor?) and Shardplate (Cultivation?) were created by Shards. There is a significant skill/power level difference there.

I wonder if someone saw Cusicesh coming up more than once and wondered if there was some regularity to its appearance and measured it once and recorded it and therefore Cusicesh was locked into appearing at the same time everyday because of the act of measuring and recording its appearance.

Thanks Kurk! I figured that was the case. In my mind, I have him placed near, if not at, the Heirocracy.

I hardly think that Nikola Tesla qualifies as a mad scientist. He thought up the charged particle beam accelerator as a means of defending the borders of a nation against an aggressor. The press is what gave it the name "the Peace Ray" or "the Death Ray". His plan was for it to be a counterbalancing response particularly to the rise of aerial bombing. Rather visionary considering how much we are aware now of the critical importance of air superiority.

Do we know which came first, the Sunmaker or the Recreance? If the Sunmaker came first, the changes he made to Alethi society could well have resulted in the Radiants abandoning the people. Also, was the Sunmaker before, after, or contemporary with the Heirocracy? If he was contemporary, then he very likely would have had a significant impact and voice in the changes to Vorinism. We know very little about the Heirocracy except that the priesthood was corrupt and loaded with false prophesies. This led to ardents becoming chattel rather than having direct power, the rise of the devotaries, and the proscription of trying to fortell the future. The best real world example of something like this (though admittedly it is still a clunky comparison) is the decline in influence of the Catholic Church in Europe. (The only reason I consider this a comparison at all is the political power that the Church held Europe prior to the reformation.) That took a looooong time to come about. It was a gradual change. WoK suggests, in comparison, that the Heirocracy was almost an event. It suggests a short timeframe. So we are talking major religious revolution happening. The fact that the ardents took their new place in society leads me to believe it was a pretty ugly situation. As to Honor saying "To speak of what might be is forbidden", I suspect that this was one of the terms of the Oathpact. I doubt it has anything to do with the intent of his Shard. Even if the Oathpact was broken at that point, I could still readily see Honor sticking to his part of the agreement regardless of the actions of others. He is of course, Honor. I also doubt that it has anything to do with anything outside of Roshar since I don't see any evidence of anything in the Cosmere being bigger than Adonalsium. I doubt Tanavast had to sign a contract to take of Honor. Edit: 100th post WOo HoO!

I'm not sure about the mechanics of how he did it. But he held it after Leras died (body dropped out of the mist) before Vin held it in HoA. Edit: He (Kelsier) was such a medler that he hung around after death to influence what he could.

I read the Silmarillion (in fact I have a first edition of the US publication). I had a hard time getting into it. too much of it was historical rather than Narrative. Just didn't do it for me. I have not read Children of Hurin, though. I very much enjoy LotR and the Hobbit.

EDIT: Crapflapnasty!, this post was supposed to go in as an edit to the previous post, not a double post. Sorry. I suspect that Syl is at least more Honor. Spren that are obviously, to me, more Cultivation would be the spren which bod to the greatshells enabling them to grow to larger sizes than would be normally physically possible (i.e., chasmfiends, , etc.). Edit: The above examples are only referring to spren that act to cause an actual effect rather than simply a manifestation. In the "Writing for Charity" thread, link provided courtesy of Skaa (see above), Brandon says: So it appears that spren, whether they are acting spren or just manifesting spren, are all of Honor or Cultivation. Though, perhaps some notable spren, which will be seen by Dalinar in WoR, have been corrupted by Odium. It also appears that the spren communicate and debate with one another (factions?). It also seems that honorspren is not a cut and dry designation and several varying types of spren see themselves as 'honorspren' in contrast to other spren. I think this weakens the idea that there is an absolute standard (at least functionally for spren bonding) for what 'honor' means

I suspect that Syl is at least more Honor. Spren that are obviously, to me, more Cultivation would be the spren which bod to the greatshells enabling them to grow to larger sizes than would be normally physically possible (i.e., chasmfiends, , etc.).

For clarification I believe that Syl is the way she is because she is a splinter of Honor or Cultivation. I can see it both ways. In a number of posts I have directly ascribed her to Honor. I'm not saying that we are wrong when we ascribe her to Honor. And I don't have a particularly different view about her nature that is contrary to what we have been discussing (except that I could readily accept that she is of Cultivation). My point was that I feared that by capitalizing honorspren, we were pigheon-holing them within somewhat rigid boundaries. We have general enough info at this point to allow for a variety of hypothesis. But when we capitalize something we ascribe particular importance to the name of that thing (i,e,, 'Honor' vs. 'honor', one is a Shard, one is an attribute). This causes us to narrow our view. I don't recall seeing anyone posit that honorspren might be more of Cultivation than Honor. The link to Honor was so strong in our minds. Already we have seen a broadening of the discussion (i.e., is honorspren a genus or a species, so to speak). I was not trying to upset any apple-carts but only to allow for a shift in our thinking. I think we have been getting to focused on a somewhat narrow interpretation. That being said, I personally believe that many of things discussed will prove to be accurate.

Here are a couple of thoughts. We frequently in these posts use the name 'Honorspren' (note capitalization), however, Syl and Nohadon both say 'honorspren'. It may be possible that we are trying too hard to link honorspren to Honor. Maybe not, but I think it is an important point to be aware of. If it were capitalized, I would say that there is an empirical standard of honor sourced in the driving intent of the Shard Honor. However, Syl gives a more fleshed out understanding of honor for her purposes (prhaps by extension for Honor as well) in ch. 67 (hardcover pg. 913): "...I've remembered what kind of spren I am...I bind things, Kaladin, ...I am honorspren. Spirit of Oaths. Of promises. And of Nobility." Sounds a lot like integrity. (Also sounds a lot like Dalinar). So, how come Dalinar does not have a spren friend? Especially since he is almost universally ackowledged by both lighteyes (whether they like him or not) and darkeyes to be honorable and to act with integrity. His shardblade may have repelled an interested spren. But I think it is largely because the world is changing and has been for at least the last seven years. I think spren like Syl are only just becoming active again. This is, of course a tangent topic, so I'll leave it there for now.

I think there are spren that act (honorspren, greatshell spren, voidspren?) and spren that merely are (flamespren, fear spren, anticipationspren, etc.). I think the spren that act are able to do so due to a direct influence (past or present) from Honor, Odium, and Cultivation. I suspect that all spren are attracted by a particular concept, emotion, principle, etc. As far as Syl and the deathspren (name of a Rosharian metal band?) go, I think it is important to recognize that Syl has emotions and an emotional attachment to Kaladin. She knows that deathspren are attracted to the dying. I don't think that the deathspren cause death, and I think Syl thinks so either. But, when faced with something that terrified her (Kaladin's impending death), she simply lashed out and fought against his death in the only way she could, even though she knew it would not actually help. People commonly have a similar response to situations and events which they have no control or influence over. They lash out at the nearest viable target in order to address their pain and feel like they are gaining some measure of control over the situation.

I agree with Isomere. Nalizar's comments to Joel at the end of the book suggest that Joel is something altogether new (rithmatically speaking).

I suppose it depends on whether or not Joel was wearing his street clothes underneath the robes. If so, I expect he had the coin. But even then, I do not think that that would have been enough to scare off the Shadowblaze. The other examples of the use of the coin indicate no particular effect until the coin is shown to the chalklings. In other words it is not the fact or the act of the measurement of time that is confusing, but rather the concept. Nalizar is unaffected because he has come to understand the concept of measuring time. So, unless Joel was holding the coin in view, I would not expect it to have had an effect on the Shadowblaze.

None of these lists include Alloy of Law and it's subsequent book(s). These books are not a part of the Mistborn Trilogy of Trilogies even though they are all on the same world, use the same magic systems, and are in the Cosmere. While events of Cosmeric import may not end up being played out in these books, they should not be overlooked since there have been and, I expect, will be more Cosmere tidbits included in them.

It is a depiction of an effect discovered by http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ernst_Chladni'>Ernst Chladni. In his original work and presentation of the effect, Chladni used a bow for an instrument such as a violin to generate the frequencies that created the patterns on the plate. Cool find SR! Edit: Here is some more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cymatics'>Cymatics is a real world term. Galileo was the first known person to discover the effect (~1632) when he scraped a chisel on a brass plate to remove spots on the plate and noticed the formation of parallel equidistant lines of crud forming. Robert Hooke conducted similar experiments (1680) with a glass plate and a violin bow. But, Chladni (pronouned Klawdnee) what the first to describe the effect on metal plates with an instrument bow (1787). The term 'cymatics' was coined by Swiss medical doctor and Anthroposophist, Hans Jenny in 1967.

Sounds like a variant of the Prisoner's Dilemma.

I've read thew Malorian, but not the Belgariad (I thought Eddings was ok but kind of meh). I like Stephen Lawhead. I've read all of Sir Pterry's Discworld. I love the first three Dune novels. The other three by Frank Herbert were good, but not as good as the first three. I've read all the Brian Herbert and Kevin Anderson Dune books as well and thought they were alright (some skipped parts). I've read some of the Shanara books and thought they were fine in absence of something better. I read the Mercedes Lackey and Andre Norton dragon books, they were good. I enjoy Tolkien but I think the Silmarillion is a little thick. I love the Ender Saga and the Shadow (Bean) series. I enjoyed Asimov's Foundation books and the Robot books (although the Lige Bailey books has a couple of parts I skipped over). I also enjoy Kristen Britain's Green Rider books. That is the bulk of it. I know, not very well read, but I only really started reading again about 15 years ago and I reread a lot. I'll check out Farland and I will probably get around to the Belgariad. Thanks again Trizee. I have been contemplating WoT. Thanks for the heads up Yados. Edit: By way of clarification, I don't mind if sexual encounters occur. I just don't like it when they are described.