Mad_Scientist

How was Sazed able to talk to Vin/Elendel and know they are happy now if he hasn't been able to access the ultimate afterlife that exists beyond the 3 realms? How is it that Nightblood, who is merely a near-sentient awakened object, was able to read minds, something a Shard-God like Ruin was unable to do?

Yah, we disagree on the nature of breaths. If you're right and breaths aren't pieces of Endowment, merely something inherent to humanity that has been influenced by Endowment, then that would easily explain why Nightblood doesn't possess a Splinter. But... since I think that breaths are a part of Endowment, I need to come up with some explanation for what Nightblood is if I'm going to claim Splinter have intent. I think I'm mostly satisified with what I've come up with, though Nightblood is still quite mysterious. I'm not sure if the nature of Seons has anything to do with their Splinter status or not. I have a bunch of different ideas related to that bouncing around in my head, but haven't come up with anything I definitely like yet.

Thanks! Interestingly, I discovered another theory thread, this one regarding Honor, that has a fair amount in common with my theory. Definitely some differences, as that theory's specific to Honor and doesn't deal with the nature of all Splinters, but it does involve pieces of a Shard having their own intents, so I thought I'd mention it.

Hmm. Perhaps Chaos is right as to the reason. Regardless of whether either of our ideas are correct, I still think there's probably some explanation for the way Nightblood interacts with breath's beyond simply the fact that he is an object. It's true that he's just a sword, and thus, to interact with the environment at all in any major way, he'll need breath, regardless of how he does it. The thing is, the entire magic system of Awakening is based upon the concept of objects doing things they normally couldn't. And the usage of breath in Awakening is nothing like the way Nightblood uses breaths. Maybe Nightblood would need more breaths because he works in a unique fashion. Maybe he'd consume the breaths (as opposed to simply using them and then letting them go, like in normal Awakening) because of that. But at the speed at which he consumes them? And he doesn't just consume them, he corrupts them as he does so. That corruption makes me suspect that something about Nightblood goes against the nature of the magic on Nalthas. Bt perhaps Chaos is right, and it's because he steals breath.

Hmm. Nightblood is a tricky one then. Perhaps the difference between the intents of Splinters and the commands used to control Awakening is the direction in which the thought flows. A Splinter is spiritual, and the intent of a Splinter originates from the spiritual realm. From there, the intent influences the mind of anyone holding the Splinter. So a Splinter's intent is the spiritual realm influencing the cognitive realm. A Command is cognitive, and the "intent" of a command originates from the mind of the Awakener. From there, the Command influences the nature of the breath he has commanded. So an Awakener's Command is the cognitive realm influencing the spiritual realm.

I think I can explain why Nightblood and awakened ropes aren't Splinters. The way I see it, a Splinter is a piece of a Shard's spiritual power with a specific intent that is an everpresent, intrinsic part of the Splinter. The intent is attached to the spiritual part of the Splinter, and is always with it, exerting influence, regardless of who or what possesses the Splinter. An awakened rope is different. The rope cannot be a Splinter, because the rope is a physical object. And the breaths inside the rope cannot be a Splinter, because their intent, such as they have, is not an intrinsic parts of the breaths themselves. It is an ephemereal, temperary quality. Tell a rope to hold a person, and it will hold him. Take your breaths out, use the rope to tie that person up the old fashioned way, then put the very same breaths back in with a command to untie, and the rope will untie the person. Assuming you know the right commands, you can use the same rope, and the same breaths, to tie someone up, untie him, give him a relaxing message, tortue him with friction burns, lift him up to a high place, lower him down to a low place, etc, etc. For a Splinter, the intent must be permanent, always there, always a part of the power. Any intent a breath has changes according to the current command of its master. As for Nightblood, the issue with him is that he is a sword, not a fragment of Endowment's power. I think he is closer to a Sliver than a Splinter. The Lord Ruler was a Sliver, someone who once held a lot of Preservation's power, and was forever influenced by it. He always had the desire to preserve, like Preservation, even after he lost the power. Nightblood is a sword who once held a bunch of breaths. Those breaths held the temperary intent of "destroy evil." Even though those breaths were neither a Shard nor a Splinter, and the intent of destruction was a temperary quality, it was still enough to influence Nightblood's mind. Those breaths are now gone, but Nightblood still wants to destroy, just like the Lord Ruler wanted to preserve even after losing the Shard. I'm guessing that oweing to the fact that Nightblood is a sword, not even completely sentient, he is much weaker of mind than a human, and easier to influence in such a drastic fashion. In addition, Nightblood is a sword, and we've seen evidence that everything has a cognitive aspect, albeit a weak one in most cases. I imagine that all swords, by virture of what they are and are used for, want to destroy things, in their own primitive way.

Oops. I really need to re-read those annotations. I read them after I first finished the book, and have been reading the new ones when they came out, but I first read Warbreaker was a while ago, so I've forgotten many of the older ones. And I just re-read Warbreaker a few days ago and couldn't remember that the answer to that had already been confirmed.

@zas678 I had forgotten about that, it's been a while since I read the annotations. I think it still fits in with my idea. Nah, my next post is about Splinters. But I think I know why Nightblood needs breath. It's because his powers go against the Intent of the Shard on Nalthas. We know that the Shards have some pretty potent abilities, and can fuel a variety of powers. But it's harder for Preservation to fuel ruinious stuff. I seem to recall a quote that was something like "doing x will use up the power of a Shard in a way they are reluctant to do," but I can't find it now. If Shards go too far against their intent, it causes trouble for them. Anyways, the point. Nightblood is a magic swords that destroys. He doesn't endow, he doesn't bring life. He just utterly wipes out whatever he touches. His power is nothing like Awakening. And in order to destroy in such a fashion, he needs energy of some sort, spiritual energy. And on Nalthis, the only thing available to him is the breaths, the power of Endowment. But destruction is rather different than endowing. So to use the power of Endowment to destroy (at least directly) is wasteful, inefficient. It corrupts the power, burns through it in the way Shards are reluctant to do. But why does Nightblood even exist, then? How was he possibly created? Because though destroying is not of Endowment, giving something an ability, including even an ability to destroy, is. The breaths endowed Nightblood with the capacity to destroy. Had there been another Shard on Nalthis, one with a power more in line with destruction, Nightblood probably would have been able to use its power for destruction, and thus would have worked much better. For example, imagine if Endowment and Ruin were on the same world and someone forged a sword of pure atium and brought it to life with Awakening using the command "ruin everything." That would be kind of scary, I think.

Welcome to part 2 of my Universal Theory of Everything! Previous theory threads of mine can be found in the spoiler. Something's been bugging me for a while now: just what the heck is a Splinter? Based on what we've read and had hinted to us by Brandon, they are a piece of a Shard's power, it seems, but there is more to them than that. Afterall, in Mistborn, everyone has pieces of Preservation and Ruin in them. But they are not Splinters. The mists themselves are parts of Preservation. Is each individual particle of mist a Splinter? Of course not. We know that we haven't seen any Splinters in Mistborn. So then is the thing that makes a Splinter a Splinter an issue of quantity, or perhaps quality? Assume for the moment one of those is the case. Where is the cutoff point? In Warbreaker, we have the only 100% confirmed Splinters, the divine breaths. We also have regular breaths. Assume for the moment that regular breaths are also a part of Endowment. If one combined 10,000 of them together, would that make a Splinter? 10,001 maybe? And does the difference between a-piece-of-Endowment-that's-almost-a-full-Splinter-but-not-quite and a Splinter of Endowment even matter, if it's only a difference in quality/quantity? None of this made sense to me, I just couldn't fathom what made a Splinter so special, until I saw that someone had made a new post in Chaos's Principle of Intent thread. And then it hit me, the obvious answer as to what makes a Splinter special: Intent. Every Splinter has its own Intent. This is different from other pieces of a Shard's power, which are related to the overall Intent of the Shard and influenced by it, but lack their own unique individual Intent. If you think about something like Endowment, aka giving, there are many different possible variations. Variations in what to endow: knowledge, money, life, hope, courage, laughter, sadness, leadership. Differences in how to endow: give someone money directly, or give them the skills to earn money, endow courage by inspirational example, or by making jokes that take the sting away from fears. Endowment the Shard encompasses all that, every form, every variation. Splinters of Endowment represent more specific, exact things. For example, Lightsong could have the Splinter "endow courage by using humor to make situations seem less scary and cheer people up." (Though I'm not sure the Splinters get quite that specific) And just like a Shard's Intent influences its bearer, so to does a Splinter's Intent. Of course, a Splinter is much slower and weaker, and so the effects are less drastic and noticable. But over time, they will have an effect. The Seons, likely Splinters of Devotion, are all incredibly devoted to their masters as we can see. The effect on them is obvious, as they have been around for hundreds of years. The effect on the Returned is less visibile, it is the reason all the Returned eventually give up their breaths. Even the most selfish Returned is slowly driven to follow his specific aspect of Endowment, and if he ignores it, the desire builds to the point where it drives him nearly mad, and he has to do something, anything, that is at least vaguely close to his Splinter's Intent. Ironically enough, the Returned that could live the longest would not be the selfish ones, but the unselfish. Those who give to others and fufill their Intent will not be so driven to give up their lives just to finally do something inline with it. So there you have it: every Splinter contains an Intent, representing an aspect of the larger Intent of the Shard. This is the difference between a Splinter and another piece of a Shard's power, not quality/quantity of power.

This topic isn't very cosmere specific, but as it is the first part in a planned series of threads I intend to make as part of an insane attempt to explain nearly every mystery in the cosmere, I am putting it here. Why do the Returned need breaths to live? The short answer is: because they are dead, and their bodies are now incapable of using physical energy. Every being needs energy to survive and function. If I raise my hand, walk to another room, or run a marathon, I use energy up. I get the energy I need to continue on from eating food, of course. The people in the cosmere are no different, in most cases. But there are at least two classes of energy available to them. There is physical energy, the normal energy one gets from eating, etc, and there is also spiritual energy, the more unusual energy that comes from Shards, Splinters, the Dor, Breaths, and who knows what else. Generally speaking, spiritual energy is used to power the magic systems of various worlds. It can also be used in place of physical energy to supplement and/or boost the normal energy ones body needs. An example of this is Stormlight, when a person infuses it into their body. But spiritual energy can also sometimes not just supplement, but completely replace physical energy for sustaining a body. Case in point, the Lifeless. A lifeless does not eat. It is incapable of getting its normal source of energy from the physical realm. As a result, the only reason a lifeless can still function is because of the spiritual energy provided by a breath. It replaces the physical energy and provides for it. But you may be wondering now, "Why do the Returned need to be constantly supplied with new breaths, when a single breath can sustain a lifeless forever?" Well, first of all, a single breath cannot sustain a lifeless forever. It's easy to miss, but in Warbreaker there's a chapter (when Jewels repairs Clod) where we learn that the lifeless can, oddly enough, heal from their wounds, at least somewhat. But if they sustain enough wounds, they will cease to function properly, and will require a new breath to continue working. The way I figure it, spiritual energy is very efficient. A single breath is certainly the equal of who knows how many meals, and can sustain a lifeless for a very long time normally. But eventually, it will run out, sooner rather than later if the lifeless is damaged a lot or otherwise excerts itself too much, as healing takes up a lot of physical energy. Even a lifeless that never suffers injuries will eventually need a new breath, but it won't need one for a long, long time, and given the nature of what the lifeless are used for, none will ever go that long without suffering some minor injuries and wear and tear that will hasten the process. The Returned are like the lifeless in some ways. They can eat, but they don't need to, and get nothing from it. So it seems their bodies, despite seeming quite alive, are still incapable of getting energy from the physical realm, and are forced to rely on the spiritual. But why do they go through breath so quickly when compared to the lifeless? Well, first, consider the Royal Locks. We know that when Siri uses them to grow her hair and make big changes, it causes her to become very hungry. In other words, she uses up a lot of energy. And the Royal Locks are directly linked to the ability of a Returned to change their shape, are in fact descended from it. If simply changing ones hair uses up a bunch of energy, how much does it take to change ones entire body? But, the Returned aren't constantly changing themselves, right? Most of them don't even know how, and just remain the same. But the fact that they remain the same is actually an indication that they are changing themselves. Their ability is just on all the time, and they don't realize it. Consider that the lifeless have to be exercised, which implies that despite being sustained by breath, their muscles will still atrophy unless worked out. The breath provides the lifeless a replacement for food, but their bodies still needs other things to work and maintain good function. But a Returned will never need to exercise, his muscles will never atrophy. Or, to be more precise, as a Returned's muscles start to atrophy slightly, he unconsciously uses his ability and returns the muscles to good shape. A Returned is almost like a car with the motor running and the engine idling. Burning gas, but not really doing much of anything other than powering the dash lights. Even guys like Vasher have probably not come close to unlocking the true potential of a Returned. Afterall, if a Returned can reshape his whole body based on how he views himself, could he perhaps recover from injuries by viewing himself as someone uninjured? Why do so many Returned drink alchohol if they can't get drunk or even buzzed, unless they are unconsciously influencing their bodies to mimic the effects of drink slightly? A Returned is constantly using his power, just not efficiently, and thus, he is constantly burning spiritual power. And thus, a Returned needs to regularly replenish it: with breath.

A couple of Warbreaker questions which I don't think have been answered yet. When Vasher rescued the priest's daughter, why did she instinctively trust him and run to him? When Vasher returned said priest's daughter to her father, how did he quiet and calm the dogs? I'm guessing the answers to both questions are related to Vasher's status as a Returned, but we don't see any similar abilities from other Returned. But then again, we don't see the other Returned interacting with children or animals much.

A little late to the party here regarding the cover discussion, but I thought I'd share my two cents. I really like the look of the European cover... or I would, if I had no idea what the book was about. I too question whether it really fits the style of the book itself. However, I've come to realize that I should have expected a cover like that, because for some reason, all of the European covers have followed the exact same artstyle. All the covers except mostly Black and White, with a single* additional color adding some variety. For Elantris, it's green, for Way of Kings, it's red, for all the Mistborn books, it's blue. *Warbreaker is a slight change in that it has a handful of additional colors, purple, red, orange, and blue, rather than a single extra one, but none of them are as apparant as say, the blue in Mistborn, so the cover is still mostly black and white. They are also all done in a very wispy, ethereal style. It works for the original Mistborn books maybe, but looks oddly out of place for something like Way of Kings. I'm sure most of you already knew this about the Eurepean covers, but for me this is new info, and it seems kind of an odd decision to make all of Brandon's different series look so similiar to each other.

I don't know, Chaos. It is true that some of the members of the Seventeenth Shard are obviously much, much younger than Hoid or the Person Being Addressed. But that doesn't mean that the Person Being Addressed can't be a member, or even the founder/leader, of the Seventeenth Shard. Afterall, assuming that the Seventeenth Shard is currently recruiting, they are certainly under no obligitation to only recruit people as old as their founder. And if the founder was immortal and the initial members were not, it would be pretty much a requirement that he'd be older than anyone else in the group. I don't have Way of Kings on hand, but fortunately Hoid's letter is easy to find online. I'd like to direct your attention to a couple of sentences from it. That bolded part implies a very strong connection between the Person Being Addressed and the Seventeenth Shard. It sounds as if he's the one giving them orders, not just a friend advising them.

If you don't like Unity, how about some of these possibilities: Solidarity In terms of names, I really like that one, it just sounds right for some reason. Synthesis Consolidation These ones I like because they imply not just unity, but combining together into a single whole, which definitely fits aspects of the Fjordell.

Adding more evidence to the idea that everything has a cognitive aspect, even apparantly inanimate objects, we have these lines from Elantris. Elantris, page 276, mass market paperback. Interestingly enough, Galladon's words imply the possibility that the Dor is somehow controlling/manipulating the cognitive aspect of every lifeform (except for man) and every inanimate object in existance on Sel. Wonder if this has something to do with Shadesmar being dangerous there. Just what is the Dor? Well, that's a topic for another thread I suppose. The main point I wanted to make was that even as far back as Elantris, we had references to things like rivers wanting to do things.

I kind of agree with you that spiritual power is needed to generate sentience, but, I don't think it is needed to maintain sentience once it has been created. I'm kind of working on a theory similiar to what you said, with some additional connections to Warbreaker, but I need some time to think it over.

Here's another question, related to a theory I'm working on. If someone dies while they are a drab, is it possible for them to Return?

I guess I should have clarified and said major/main viewpoint character, along the lines of what we've gotten for Kaladin. If that does happen, it probably won't be till near the end of the series.

In a recent interview released by Fantasy Faction, you were asked about the main viewpoint characters for the series and whether we had seen them all yet. http://fantasy-faction.com/2011/brandon-sanderson-interview (At around the 7:40 mark for the first video) At the end of your list, after saying that you thought we had met them all, you said "and of course Wit." Does that mean Wit/Hoid is going to be a viewpoint character?

Has Endowment been passing the Shard onto new people after a certain period of time has passed, to ensure that the power/nature of the Shard doesn't have enough time to completely consume and corrupt her/him?

Well, in an earlier quote Brandon confirmed that Aona was a love synonym (though I can't find it right now), so I agree that the ironic part was likely that one of the guesses for Skai (Devotion) was actually Aona's correct name. Devotion is a love synonym, afterall. I don't think Brandon has ever responded to a guess for Unity for either shard. And the only things we know for certain about Skai is that it is not Order/Devotion/Obedience. But I suspect it will turn out to be Unity or something similiar. Regarding your point about the Seons and the Skaze, that actually fits if Aona is Devotion and Skai is Unity. The Seons are extremely devoted to their masters, and the Skaze (which apparantly are related to Skai) do work to help the Fjordell unite the world under them.

I can't seem to find the exact quote where Brandon originally talked about Aona's shard, but many people think that Aona holds Devotion based on the following twitter exchange. Devotion, Compassion, Love, Charity... depending on context they can all mean similiar things.

Hmm. I think he was probably just talking about Ruin/Preservation specifically there, and that we shouldn't assume other worlds that have more than one Shard are because the Shards are something opposite of each other. For one thing, we know Aona is a Love synonym and Odium is in fact a synonum for Hate, but they were not found on the same world. (Of course, Odium later went to Sel and killed Aona) Also, on Roshar, we have Odium (Hate), Honor, and Cultivation, a very odd combination of three Shards. I do actually agree with you that Skai powers the Dor and Aona provides a way to channel it in AonDor, that was kind of what I was trying to get at when I said I felt AonDor is a combination of their powers. I'm not totally sure how the connection works though.

I came up with this idea when reading Elantris for the first time recently. I found some posts written in this forum that suggested the same thing, but no one has started a thread to really examine the topic that I could see. This isn't some super organized perfect theory like some of the posts I've seen here. I'm afraid I haven't yet come up with any definite idea as to how everything works. But I figured it couldn't hurt to post here anyways, and what other people think and if they can maybe fill in some of the gaps or figure out what I have not. Anyways... What makes me think Skai is Unity (or something similiar)? Well, for one thing, there are a lot of references to unity throughout the book and in the magic system. Let's start with the obvious: Shu-Keseg, Shu-Dereth, and Shu-Korath all preach unity in various ways. The Fjordil in particular seem obsessed with a forced unity, uniting the world underneath their rule. But let's consider AonDor. Based on it's name, one would assume that AonDor is associated with Aona, who held a Shard that was a synonym for Love. But oddly enough, there are a lot more associations with unity/oneness in AonDor than there are with love. There is the obvious fact that AonDor is based on the land itself, requiring that the Aons be drawn in such a way that they mimic the land. There is the fact that the users of AonDor, the Elantrians, are directly connected to and one with their city. There is the fact that Aons are based on constellations and the land of Arelon, meaning that either Arelon was shaped to resemble certain constellations or that the constellations were shaped after Arelon. There is the fact that the sheod only takes those in Arelon, and only those who have Arelish blood, and both Arelon and Arelish have the Aon "Are" in them, which means "Unity/Cohesion." Then there is the Dor itself, which is described as some universal force that is in everything and is everywhere. And it desires to make everything a part of it: "Raoden smiled; the explanation sounded too religiously mysterious to be useful. But then he thought of his dream, his memories of what had happened so long ago. When the Elantrian healer had drawn her Aon, it appeared as if a tear were appearing in the air behind her finger. Raoden could still feel the chaotic power raging behind that tear, the massive force trying to press its way through the Aon to get at him. It sought to overwhelm him, to break him down until he became part of it. However, the healer's carefully constructed Aon had funneled the power into a usable form, and it had healed Raoden's leg instead of destroying him." Elantris, page 276, mass market paperback. I realize my thoughts have probably seemed a bit rambling, and I apologize for that. As I said I'm afraid I don't have a good idea what all this means in the larger scheme of things. I suspect that AonDor has some connection between both Aona and Skai, but I'm not sure how exactly. Anyways, what do people think? Does my speculation have merit, or is it all a bunch of nonsense.