IlstrawberrySeed

I just reread the book, and can confirm that there isn't a mention of programtic loops in chalkling commands or about giving a number for how long to wait.

Thanks, no worries. I'll either find it on my rearead or finish without finding it & discover that I'm missrembering.

7 hours ago, Treamayne said:

interior artwork page

The page you provided has the LoS, I'm refering to loops in chalkling commands. I thought I remembered something about it, but could be missremembering.

3 hours ago, Treamayne said:

Hope that helps

Yes in general. For my question, not really.

Thanks though.

On the Coppermind, 

"[A] number below a glyph can be added to determine duration of a Go command or the angle of a Turn command."

I'm not sure if it's mentioned in the book (curently waiting on the library for a reread), but how does the Wait glyph work? Do you give it a number like for Move & Turn or does it work some other way?

Also, I remember the book or a WoB mentioning loops, but that isn't on the Coppermind either. Do we have a description of the standard glyphs for those?

Edit: If a chalkling command is destroyed before it disapears or the chalkling starts executing it, will the chalkling remember that instruction?

On 12/6/2023 at 10:51 AM, alder24 said:

That explains everything.

Tress ch 2:

ch 31:

 

  Hide contents

Escovar

The Iriali left at least three hundred years prior to Tress's story. Xisis was said to have been on Lumar for at least three hundred years, by Crow's book. Is the arrival of Xisis and departure of the Iriali significantly related?

Brandon Sanderson

I did that intentionally, yes.

Tress Spoiler Stream (March 31, 2023)

 

Ah. Ok.

@alder24 How do we know Foil got there after those were invented?

I'm probably forgetting something, but I don't remember anything specifying how long ago they left other than when Foil arrived.

I want to be clear, I understand when Tress takes place - Era 4, and that the Irali migration to Roshar is Era 0 (Pre Era 1). I'm asking how we know that Foil's arrival & the Irali departed during era 0?

On 12/4/2023 at 10:27 AM, alder24 said:

The story takes place in the future. Awakened, sentient AI on a rocketship is a dead giveaway. Not to mention Tress mentioning "Death with spikes in his eyes". Iriali came to Roshar thousands of years ago, long enough to create one of the Silver Kingdoms - which was pre-Aharietiam.

I know both of those. If all we know is that Foil got there roughly the time the Irali left, then how do we know that he hasn't been there since before the sliver kingdoms?

How do we know that Foil hasn't been there long enough that the Irali left Lumar to go to Roshar? Or that he arived that early, left, and came back more recently?

On 12/1/2023 at 2:28 PM, DrPhysics said:

Yeah, many scenes don't work without some way for the allomancer to calibrate the strength of the push. I think I'm going to interpret the scenes where it talks about not controlling the strength to really mean that it's very difficult to go below some minimum strength, but then they can calibrate from that minimum up to flare (maximum).

Your model is an interesting one. I like it. Some of these fine details we won't ever be able to solve without concrete data. Until then, one guess is just as good (scientifically speaking) as another.

The way it's worded, I always assumed that variations in push strength given a set burn rate were difficult, and changing burn rate by small amounts is tough, and going below a burn is really tough.

19 hours ago, Treamayne said:

Is there a specific thing/discussion you have in mind? The most cross I've seen is in Rithmatist.

Several. We know the Rithmatist and the Cytoverse were going to be cosmere, which brings to mind the questions of how they interact. For example:

Also, crossing with out of BS as well would be interesting, such as how the source from James Islington's Licaneous trilogy would interact with the cosmere.

For a while now I've wondered why there isn't a spot to discuss topics that specifically span non-cosmere works or cross the cosmere with non-cosmere works. Is there a reason? If not can we have one?

19 hours ago, therunner said:

I don't think savants can 'turn up' their efficiency. Rather their efficiency is always turned up because they are savants, and their spiritweb is changed because of that.
If it something they can tune, it could be included in the burn/flare scale as that describes how much effort is the Allomancer exerting.

It is possible I am forgetting something however.

It's possible I'm reading into the way Brandon words it, but I specifically remember "can" which implies "but not necessarily."

On 11/11/2023 at 7:56 AM, therunner said:

Savants 'quality' of burn can be included under the variable of 'strength' of Allomancy. Afterall, it just means they can do more with less, i.e. externally they will just appear as if they were stronger.

I brought it up since you say it's the same for a single practitioner, which it's not if their a savant, since they can turn their efficiency up beyond typical levels, which means they can return to regular levels and change it throughout the push. I agree it's best to make the assumption that it's the same throughout the push for the model, especially since we're basing it on "normal" misborn & mistings, but was rather saying it's not necessarily all of the variables at play.

On 11/9/2023 at 8:26 AM, therunner said:

However, Allomancers only push outwards or pull inwards. The only variables are:

• 'Strength' of Allomancy (always the same for single user)
• Mass/weight of user (typically the same for single user)
• weight of pushed object
• burn vs flare (unless you claim subconscious control)
• distance between allomancer and object

Those are the only variables understood in world. However, we know for a Fact this isn't everything, since there is more control than Burn vs Flare in savants, and with hemalurgy. I see no reason why another variable couldn't be introduced to "fix" the model. However, we have to be careful we aren't pulling an epicyclical orbit style fallacy.

On 11/9/2023 at 10:14 AM, DrPhysics said:

When constructing a physical model, you need a justification for each piece. So, we could talk about relative velocity and show that the bigger the relative velocity, the harder it is to push the thing, but that doesn't give us a reason.

Saying that an allomancer is limited by the power they can produce (the rate they can convert investiture into energy), however, tells me that I'd expect the force to be proportional to 1/v, rather than 1/v^2 or exp(-v), all of which get weaker when you have a larger velocity. Those kinds of justifications are especially important if you don't have solid data to put a fit to. If we had a graph of Vin's speed over time and we saw that the fit was actually 1/v^2, then we'd have to figure out why that is, but until then, it's better to find physical, direct cause reasons for any models that you build.

OK, what's the justification for setting something equal to a non-calculous function of itself?

limiting an allomancer by the investiture they can produce is obviously neccessary, but since there is a level of control in the most powerful of cases (Savants/Hemalurgy), and there are no factors that influence the push and the investiture process, I see it as being a simple matter of proportionality: the force of a push of N investiture is equivalent to the force of a push of 1 investiture multiplied by f(N). (Likely a minor degradation, since I resists I)

On 11/9/2023 at 10:14 AM, DrPhysics said:

As another example, since the pushing applies to metals, we'd have to guess that it is at least somewhat related to electromagnetism, so I'd guess that we follow Coulomb-like forces and we'd expect the push to be proportional to 1/D^2.

That makes sense.

On 11/9/2023 at 10:14 AM, DrPhysics said:

So what I was really trying to say is that any model I'd use would have the force proportional to 1/V and 1/D^2, unless I had a really good reason not to.

It would model it more effectively given a static strength, which might be an incorrect assumption, but it is a reasonable assumption until we get a WoB. We need the strength of the push to decrease toward the middle and increase towards the end. And it needs a sharp increase, since it needs to be well below gravity. That sounds parabolic, though since V goes up then down, logarithmic function would look parabolic to an extent.

On 11/9/2023 at 10:14 AM, DrPhysics said:

Part of the problem is that pushes/pulls aren't as consistent over Era 1 as they are through Era 2. I think Sanderson was still developing his model, so we see lots of oddities in Era 1 that don't pop up as much in Era 2. For example, this scene from TFE:

That wouldn't happen if we could describe pushes and pulls as a force exerted on the object that points directly at the allomancer. Instead, we'd see them curve and arc like we do when Vin travels with horseshoes in the next book.

(Except for that Kelsier example. I can't think of any way to justify that other than Sanderson didn't understand inertia when he wrote it.)

He pushes on it and pulls on it only while opposite it? That doesn't sound too hard, and would explain how Kel was able to aim, since he had no practice hitting curves. It's certainly how I read it the first time.

4 hours ago, DrPhysics said:

I misunderstood your notation. It makes sense now. Sorry.

I agree, but I think it makes more physical sense to model the force based on Power (which is proportional to Velocity (P=FV)) and Distance. Power would reflect how quickly the allomancer can convert Investiture into kinetic energy. The faster they can make that conversion, the more powerful they are. Whereas, there is no good physical model that would suggest why velocity alone would matter.

 

It's fine.

I don't understand. You want to model F(P,D), which means that F(FV,D)? I don't understand that idea.
As for no physical model, I thought of this from reference frames/vector addition. However, it would make it similar to air resistance, which is why I thought it made sence physically. I push away from me at 3 m/s, but I'm moving at -2m/s, so what I'm pushing only moves at 1m/s.

On 11/2/2023 at 9:36 AM, IlstrawberrySeed said:

I don't see how the inefficiency can be explained like that. With an infinite supply, they can simply store more investiture in the metalmind while storing to get the 1 to 1.

The issue is in part that Mass as we understand it isn't Mass as it is in the cosmere, since (as I probably misunderstand it) Mass and Matter are functionally equivalent for us, but it doesn't seem like it in the Cosmere, due to Iron feruchemistry keeping the same particles in the feruchemist. I'd contenue, but I have to go, and I do expect that I'm misunderstanding the Mass/Matter functional equivelence for some reason.

23 hours ago, DrPhysics said:

I'd have to find the exact WOB, but he says that in the Cosmere matter, energy, and investiture are all equivalent, but doesn't want to put an exact E=mc^2 equation together because it would limit the storytelling.

Not what I was saying.

(sorry for brusqueness, not trying to be rude, just fast)

23 hours ago, DrPhysics said:

Air resistance is proportional to speed, and while you can have big forces at high speeds, as you slow down they get weaker and will take a very long time to slow you to a "stop" (technically, air drag can never truly stop you).

So it's mostly about timeframe?

23 hours ago, DrPhysics said:

Also, your model seems to be relying on a "force of motion" (i.e. when force is zero, you stop). That isn't the case.

No, I was setting up the requirements. When V=0, A must = 0 for there to be a stop. Since V=0, push must equal gravity for A=0.

Alternitively, you may have been seeing my Air resistence or push forces, which both factor in velocity/delta distance (Which I noted as the same thing since we're working in 1D)

Basically, I postulate that the Force of a 1d push with a mounted object is based on 2 variable, Velocity and Distance. The exact relation in my head is changeing as I try to make more accurate models in my head, currently I'm wondering in inverse proportionality works for them both. That would imply (for the mistborn)

A= 1/(PV)-g-rV     (g gravity, r air resistance)
V=∫ (0, t) 1/(PV) dx -gt - rP
P=∫ (0, t) ∫ (0, x) 1/(PV) dy dx - .5gt - r∫ (0, t) P dx
(This general format works for any push strength function by replacing 1x/(PV) with whichever formula you use)

Anything with recursive integrals is annoying to calculate. I typically end up using a script or chatbot, and having it linearly and quadratically estimate values of V and P and then plug them into the formula for A. Is there a better way to do it?

12 hours ago, therunner said:

Shards can see the future, and they also only see possibilities. However, this could be because of other Shards.

But

Hmm, good point. I retract my statement.

I was thinking that since AI in Cosmere would require proper spiritual aspect per WoB, that means objects don't have spiritwebs. But it probably is more of a 'type' (for a lack of better word) of spiritweb.

Well, body is 3D object, it literally cannot fit in 0D point. However, apparently more recent WoB claims person can exist in SR, but "It's weird" (https://wob.coppermind.net/events/404/#e13522).
So perhaps it is less that you exist as 3D entity in SR, and more that you get 'encoded' into SR information, your Connection changes, and then you are 'decoded' back into PR? So you 'passthrough', but as information, not as material entity.

I am definitely saving that WoB.

12 hours ago, therunner said:

If you map sphere minus point to CR continuously, the entire boundary in CR would be points that are infinetesimaly close in PR. But in CR they would lead to different locations, and are in fact hugely far apart.

So it was just another way of stating the issue. Got it.

12 hours ago, therunner said:

And mapping @idanstark42 proposed would require that all of those boundary points in CR are the same, but they are not. This is the problem.

How do you mean?
Higher dimension won't solve this problem, the problem is fundamental to the fact you are trying to map two surfaces of different topologies, which cannot be done continuously.

 

I don't think it is litteral topology in the 3d nature of the word. I don't see any perfect solution to crop up, unless you go with the Seeker's answer:

or use high Demensional rotation for identical topology in sub-spaces using 3 dimensions.

Before I wrote the Seeker's answer out, I thought that the latter was more likely. Now I'm not sure.

First off, I understand about 1/10 of the conversation's backend, but I can follow the frontend. Please let me know if I'm misunderstanding something. Also, @idanstark42.

On 10/31/2023 at 2:19 PM, therunner said:

Fair enough, I agree.

The issue is more retrocausality, i.e. Kaladin is so good with spear when young, because he will be very good with spear (to some extent).
I.e. you can have sort of retrocausal echoes, through SR.

Per Brandon it should not break causality directly though.

The cosmere is deterministic given no one can see the future. Once the future impacts the present, the future splits - They do something to change the future which changes the future they see and changes what they do to change the future, Ad infinitum. This is why Atium shadows split when multiple people see the future. This is known as fortune, and is how Free Will seemingly takes shape in the cosmere.

The cosmere's future is therefore a self-referential function, which manifests itself as possibilities, which further muddles itself. Think about how Vin's split worked - either he does A and she does a, or he does B and she does b. It's a self referential function based on which future he reacts to, which is (theoretically) deterministic.

With regular Atium, it's more complex, but follows similar principles. You see they do A, so you do a. They see you do a, so they do B, so you do b, so they do C, so you do A again. It looks like lots of choices, but it's just a deterministic loop (as long as "free will" is deterministic). But since they all start at the same time with the same origin and no obvious cause and effect order (since you would also need to decide what your doing independently of other atium shadows.

If someone decided what they were doing, programmed it into an exosuit, and then burned atium, their opponent burning atium wouldn't get split shadows, because nothing changes based on the one seeing the future. The one in the suit would see 1 or 2 shadows, the one that would happen if the one outside the suit wasn't burning atium, and one because he's burning atium. The former is always accompanied by the latter.

On 10/31/2023 at 2:19 PM, therunner said:

• Objects can be Invested even without having spiritweb (e.g. metalminds, gems).

Objects have spiritwebs. (Except maybe aluminum?!) All forging does is change its SW, and that works on objects.

On 10/31/2023 at 2:19 PM, therunner said:

Body cannot be there, but that does not mean QF's cannot be there.
If SR has zero spatial dimensions, body could quire literally not be there, but there could be quantum 'field' over that point.

Body can't stay there, but why couldn't it pass through it as point? (PS, asking because that's how I see teleportation working.)

On 10/31/2023 at 2:19 PM, therunner said:

If we want to describe PR with QFTs, we need to describe stuff from SR in terms of QFs as well (or at least classical field if we don't care about dynamics too much, and treat SR as background field).

As far as we know, yes.

Yes, but then you are no longer mapping sphere to plane, but sphere minus some point.

This is problematic condition, since different points around specific subastral lead to different subastrals (see map of Rosharan CR).

The mapping probably does work somewhat like that,

I don't understand the bolded line. I also don't see how 4d wouldn't solve the continuous projection problem immediately. A 3d projection would look like a sphere tangent to a plane.

On 10/31/2023 at 2:19 PM, therunner said:

But Stormlight, Breaths, Godmetals are Investiture and existed since the moment Shards did.

Technically they could exist as of investiture, since Ado could prioritize certain parts of inves when allocating.

I personally believe that primary intent is the E of intents of the component investiture, and due to the connection to the shard, their intent is overridden by the shards. However, factors can change the shard's intent (When mixing inves) that casues it to override the component intents. In other words, starting from ado and breaking it down, without mixing it, you would find that Ado is the sum over a space, the shards are sums over subspaces, etc, until you have the smallest unit of intent over some value of investiture. Each part of the intent "graph" would be split over all the shards, on a sliding scale from even to isolated. 

This gets muddled when recombining, since the reason Harmony should be Creation is that is what the parts did together, rather than an emergent property of the investiture, which is what Sazed wants/expects it to be.

21 hours ago, DrPhysics said:

Couldn't you just apply the inefficiency constant to the process of storing/removing mass from the spiritual realm? So maybe priming the pump was a bad analogy. Instead, imagine it like an electrical relay. We use a little bit of investiture to open access, but keeping the access open uses up the stored investiture.

Really, the point I was trying to make was that if you literally stored all of the mass in the metalmind as investiture, you would see a large increase in the mass of the metalmind. If it follows an E=mc^2 like relationship as Brandon has said, then the metalmind's weight would increase just as much as the mass you stored, and storing mass would have no meaning. You'd still be just as heavy, it's just that some mass would be in the metal, and the rest would be in your body. Something else must be going on, and as far as what that something else is, your guess is as good as mine.

I don't see how the inefficiency can be explained like that. With an infinite supply, they can simply store more investiture in the metalmind while storing to get the 1 to 1.

The issue is in part that Mass as we understand it isn't Mass as it is in the cosmere, since (as I probably misunderstand it) Mass and Matter are functionally equivalent for us, but it doesn't seem like it in the Cosmere, due to Iron feruchemistry keeping the same particles in the feruchemist. I'd contenue, but I have to go, and I do expect that I'm misunderstanding the Mass/Matter functional equivelence for some reason.

On 11/1/2023 at 11:44 AM, DrPhysics said:

In order for the velocity to reach zero, the push must already be less than gravity in order forher to slow down. Therefore, she has to push with less force, and then increase it. 

I'm have a hard time following your notation here does f(distance) mean force as a function of distance? or does it mean force times distance? And how is g different from G?

I guess I don't understand why Air resistance cannot bring it to 0 at the right time, for the first model.

For the second, f() and g() are functions, G is gravity. Sorry for the confusion. I'm sure there is a model that works based on these, it just might not be the simplest (and therefore the one that works based on actual principles). For example, a cubic that spikes at velocity=0, and then slowly increases again as a function of velocity (Or perhaps distance') over a function of distance would allow it to decrease as she approaches the top, then land on the constant |G|.

Edit: I just spent a while trying to figure out a set of functions that worked, but It's hard since I'm having trouble finding a calculator OK with recessive integrals. However, I realized that if it's force oscillates about V=0, then bobbing would be cut to neigh even with a linear or quadratic decrease based on distance.

On 10/27/2023 at 2:33 AM, therunner said:

One additional note, in the scene in TFE where Vin first jumps using a coin (chapter 8), she mentions that she decelerates as the line grows sufficiently weak. But at the same time she simply stops eventually, left hanging over the line.

That deceleration (despite pushing) implies that the force of the Push is less then gravitational force, but at the same time the force of push must be equal to gravitational force once Vin reaches peak. So the force would have to decrease with distance, and then increase again. Or we can say she was unconsciously modulating strength of her push.

On 10/27/2023 at 2:37 PM, DrPhysics said:

I can see two interpretations of that (and the exponential wouldn't fix either)

1) Brandon just got the science wrong. In the early books, he made a lot of mistakes with Newton's first law, and Peter didn't catch them. There are some pretty egregious examples all the way up through Starsight. They are better at it now.

2) Vin panics a bit when she asks herself "What happens if it disappears?" and either consciously or unconsciously backs off with her push.

The reason why the exponential won't work is that it doesn't consider her inertia. With the exponential, she'd be at equilibrium at 30 m, but wouldn't come to a stop. She'd overshoot, fall, overshoot, fall, then repeat until she either changes how she is pushing or wind resistance lows her down over hours.

Personally, I think #1 is boring, so I like explanation #2 better. We do similar things with our muscles all the time. We don't choose a force and go, instead, we make tiny adjustments to match the motion we want without thinking about it. 

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't either of these work:

As V->0, if Push=G, then stationary would be acheived. So one would only need solve for Push modulation based on distance. Personally, it seems that if it decreases tetratively, then some factor would allow it to equal Gravity at the same point velocity roughly hits 0. And crept to a halt doesn't imply single direction either, I envisioned her bobbing slightly for a second.

Alternatively, push strength is also based on velocity, such that it decreases as you speed up, which is why it seems like constant acceleration for longer than a point, and so f(distance) increase and g(velocity) increase would be roughly equal at the start, but at a point f(distance) gets larger than g(velocity), and then G(velocity) starts to decrease as well, causing the g(v)/f(d) approach G. That means that g(0) != 0, but we have the value of both g(0)/f(~0) and g(0)/f(~30), which should let us get some approximate points to play with.

On 10/26/2023 at 2:51 PM, DrPhysics said:

When you shove that much energy into a confined space (especially so that it can't move) it will bend spacetime and start acting like it has mass (or just change forms so that it has mass). Some of the other books 

  Reveal hidden contents

The Sunlit Man, especially

suggest that investiture follows the same rules, even if we don't know the exact conversion rate.

You're right.

I had a longer edit that talked about how the investiture stored in the metal mind would probably be just enough for them to access the spiritual realm for the extra mass they are storing/tapping (like priming a pump, you need a little bit of water to start it, but the bulk of the water is pulled from the ground), and just felt like too long of an answer.

The infinite energy supply referred to the amount of energy in the spiritual realm, and I didn't correct that when I cut out the extra. Oops.

I disagree. I don't think Feruchemistry accesses the pool of investiture, though because I haven't read that book I couldn't provide arguments against the evidence presented there. The main reason I believe this is the inefficiency constant - Feruchemistry isn't 1 + 1i to 1 + 1i, it's 1 + 1i to 1 + 0.9i or 0.9 + 1i (Decimals truncated, go on as 9s for too many digits) (i is the investiture, R is time). If it converts attribute into Inves, uses that inves to pull from the SR and put some into the metalmind, and then uses that to access the SR Inves pool, then it is easier to say it's equal than inefficient.

(PS. I don't mind minor spoilers like that, it builds anticipation.)

On 10/26/2023 at 6:37 PM, Underwater_Worldhopper said:

That's a reasonable argument, but can you link the WoBs and sources you're basing these ideas off of?

On 10/23/2023 at 9:24 AM, IlstrawberrySeed said:

I personally disagree with this.

First, Burning a pure Shardmetal isn't Alomancy, it's another magic system. Thus, burning a shardmatal-base alloy would be a hybrid magic like compounding. This other shardmetal magic is universal.
Additionally, more recent WoB suggest that connection isn't required. That said, there is a nugget of evidence suggesting that pure Shardmetals burned by an allomancer can either do the shardmetal thing or something else. The latter may require connection to the shard, but this seems unlikely to me.
As such, allomancy isn't unnaturally universal when used with shardmetals, since it's a different magic system.

Quote

Brandon Sanderson

Chapter Thirty-Eight

Preservation's Power

All right, so maybe I lied about there only being three magic systems in this book. It comes down to how you term the powers of Preservation and Ruin, who kind of blanket the entire system. There are a lot of things going on here, and—well, the truth is I don't want to mention all of them, for fear of spoiling future books. However, I'll give you a few rules to apply.

First, to these forces, energy and mass are the same thing. So, their power can take physical shape—as Preservation's did in the bead of metal Elend ate. Second, there is a bit of Preservation inside of all the people—and it's this that allows the people to perform Allomancy. It needs to be awakened and stirred to be of use, but when it is, a proper metal can draw forth more of Preservation's power. It's like the metal attunes the bit within the person, allowing it to act as a catalyst to grab more power.

Allomancy is not fueled by metal; it is fueled by Preservation. The metal is the means by which a person can access that fuel, however. If there were another way to access it, then the metal wouldn't be needed.

Preservation's touch on people differs. Some have more, some have less. This doesn't make them better or worse people—indeed, some most touched by Preservation have been among the worst people in the world. As Ruin later points out, there is a difference between being evil and being destructive.

Regardless, if a person can get more Preservation into them, they become better Allomancers. Hence Elend becoming a Mistborn. Like all people, he had the potential within him—it was just too small of a potential to be awakened through normal means. That little jolt of Preservation's body, however, expanded and awakened his Allomancy.

As a tidbit, that was a side effect of what that bead of metal did. It wasn't the main purpose of the bead, and if another Allomancer were to burn it, it would do something else.

The Hero of Ages Annotations (Nov. 12, 2009)

Quote

Brandon Sanderson

Atium's Mechanism

Atium is, indeed, different from the other metals. When you burn most Allomantic metals, it opens a conduit through which you can draw upon Preservation's power and use it in very specific ways.

Atium doesn't do that. Atium is, itself, a fuel. When you burn it, the metal itself provides the power. A subtle distinction, I know, but it has to do with where the power is coming from. Most Allomancy is fueled by Preservation, but atium and malatium are fueled by Ruin.

This metal doesn't quite belong on the table where it has been placed.

The Hero of Ages Annotations (April 1, 2010)

Quote

NeedsToShutUp

What would happen if Hoid tried to burn the shard that came off Ishar's Honorblade?

Brandon Sanderson

If you were able to get a hold of that piece and burn it, it would act like burning... You would be burning a very pure form of a God Metal, and those have some very interesting effects. RAFO.

YouTube Spoiler Stream 3 (Dec. 16, 2021)

Quote

mail-mi

We know that any person can burn lerasium. Are there other God Metals that any person can burn?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes.

Dragonsteel Mini-Con 2021 (Nov. 22, 2021)

Quote

Kuron (paraphrased)

Is it possible for a full Mistborn to ingest and burn a Shardblade?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

It is possible, and it is possible that I might be able to see that in the future if I can fit that in.

Dragonsteel 2022 (Nov. 14, 2022)

 Compare these responces (and dates) to this:

Quote

word_thief

What would happen if a Mistborn ingested the metal of a Shardblade/Plate?

Brandon Sanderson

A Shardblade is Invested. A Mistborn isn't likely to have a tie to that type of Investiture. So probably nothing would happen…

General Twitter 2013 (Oct. 24, 2013)

He immediately brings up the issue of it being like a metalmind. Same with brining nightblood (though I don't have that WoB). 

On 10/23/2023 at 9:24 AM, IlstrawberrySeed said:

Secondly, Hemalurgy is an unusual magic system in that it's naturally universal, just like shardmetal burning. There is no need for shardmetal versions of hemalurgy (if it's hemalurgy instead of shardmetal magic) to be unnaturally universal.

Quote

 

Spoiler

Questioner

Hemalurgy is mentioned as something that has "broad implications." But that's of Ruin, right? (Or now it is of Harmony.)

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, but don't take the "of Ruin" and "of Preservation" too strongly, but yes.

Questioner

But, I mean, somebody couldn't just walk along with a metal spike on, say, Nalthis, and stab 'em and now they have the power, could they?

 

Brandon Sanderson

If they knew where to stab them, yes, they could.

Questioner

Anywhere in the cosmere?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes.

 

Spoiler

Questioner

You can stab someone and get their power?

Brandon Sanderson

Hemalurgy has been built in such a way that it rips off pieces of the soul. If you can rip off the right piece of the soul and attach it to somebody else, it will change your Identity, and it can rewrite anything that's attached to your soul. Identity, Connection, it can rewrite Investiture, all of this stuff it could potentially do.

Questioner

And do the things you stab people with—are they always metal or does that depend on the planet?

Brandon Sanderson

No, that's metal, that's—

Questioner

*inaudble*

Brandon Sanderson

Well yes, you could make it do something like that. That is totally possible. But the metal— Yeah. Anyway.

Questioner

With the other Shards you kind of have to be near that Shard to get that—there's no Allomancy.

Brandon Sanderson

To get it, yes. To have that part of your soul. But, for instance, Allomancy would work on other planets. The only one that's going to have trouble working on other planets, right now, are the ones on Sel because of the way that the magics are built.

 

Firefight Seattle Public Library signing (Jan. 7, 2015)

On 10/23/2023 at 9:24 AM, IlstrawberrySeed said:

As neither Hemalurgy nor "Allomancy" being made unnaturally universal when used with shardmetals, I don't see feurochemistry being unnaturally universal with shardmetalminds.