bmcclure7
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"Their powers do not function as they are now. Sig can't Surgebind. Why not? Did the Dawnshard mutate his spren that much?" His oath are broken, I won't explain here what happened to Your surge binding abilities Once oaths are broken you want to know that read words of radiance. "That's a bad comparison. A better one would be: Why do we say my brother is dead and not I killed my brother." Then why did he say my oaths ended not Some void bringer killed my Spren with anti void light? "And remember that this is his internal dialogue, not some lie he's telling to anyone besides himself." First off wrong. He was talking to wit. Second People use euthanisms all the time when talking to themselves about about difficult subjects.
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"This wasn't due to powers, it was due to the oaths." Their powers wouldn't Have functioned If their oath was completely destroyed. A broken oath is not the same thing as a dead oath. This is why Kalladin was able to get back syl Without saying all the oaths all over again. "Why would he say that his oaths 'ended' instead of saying 'I broke my oaths'." Why do we say my brother is gone and not my brother is dead? "Not proof. And I don't think he surgebound anywhere." Actually he may have. When he jumps from one Hover ships to the next. He comments that he feels like he should not have been able to jump so far. It's possible that he was once again tapped into the surge of gravitation for just a moment.
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"But they did. He was able to summon Aux as a weapon while protecting the raiders, something that he wasn't able to do otherwise" This is easy to explain have you read words of radiance? We know from Kal's and Shallan's experience That Even a foresworn knight's radiant can still sometimes access a portion of Their Knights radiant abilities after breaking thier oaths. This is probably because While their Spren "dead" In a Spren sense It is still A functional cognitive entity. A better term than that would probably be broken, However this is not the case when a Spren Is killed by anti investure. The very fact that he can sometimes summon his shardblade and might have even have surgebinded at one point Is further proof that Aux is his honor Spren "I disagree with those reasons" yet you can not answer them
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"Sigzil's oaths are broken, in your estimation. How, then, is he able to use them in order to overcome his Torment, without re-swearing them first?" I'm confused did you not read the Preview to sunlit man? His oaths aren't overcoming the torment Because he broke them some time before The 1st chapter of the sunlit man. "When oaths are sworn as part of a spren bond, they have an effect on the soul. It's not that they are powered by Investiture that allows them to overcome the Torment, but that they change the Spiritweb, probably in a somewhat similar way to a Dawnshard. When the Spren dies, the effect of the oaths on the Radiant's Spiritweb won't just vanish." Then By your logic they should still be Overcoming the torment even now. In fact if you look at it from your perspective from your perspective breaking your oath should still allow you to suck in the storm light and use surgebinding. After all the ability to do this comes from altering the spirit Web because of the bond. If the effects of On the spirit Web were we're permanent why come killing your Spren Take away your ability of sucking storm light? "I just figured that there's something odd about Aux, and that him being a CS would explain why things are odd." Are you serious I just gave you several reasons why why him being a cognitive shadow only makes it more confusing. It causes more problems not less. The differences in how Aux acts Can all be explained by the dawn shard.
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"Adolin has a bond with Maya, but she hasn't shapeshifted either." She only started speaking recently, he can who knows what else could develop. "No you haven't, at least not that I can see. You said that Sig must have broken his oaths recently, but that doesn't explain how he was able to summon a Shardblade by relying on his oaths." Yes It does, I don't know what about this explanation you don't find satisfactory. Please explain. "No you haven't. You've relied on an baseless assumption, namely that oaths not linked to a spren bond will have no effect on a Torment." You Baselessly assume that they can. If oaths not powered by any investiture Could simply cancel out the tournament why the hell is hoid still under the effect of the torment? Why doesn't he just take an oath saying " I will never be affected by the torment" For that matter why doesn't nomade? Not only is your assumption baseless it makes no logical sense. "Because Aux is the one with the powers." If that's the reason this could still apply weather or not He is a cognitive shadow or a Spren. I don't see how you jump from this to cognitive shadow. "Yeah. And Nahel bonds are the ones that grant Blades. So if you get into a Nahel bond with a CS, it stands to reason that you'd be able to summon them as a Shardblade." Again You baselessly Assume that CS can form Nahel bonds We have absolutely no reason to believe this.
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"Shallan doesn't get a shapeshifting Shardblade." She has only just begun to explore her bond with testament. We can't say what she can and can not do. "If they're broken, how come they let him overcome his Torment?" I already answered this "He never broke them, so they should still have an impact on his spiritweb great enough to overcome his Torment" I have already explained why this doesn't work. "One of his Squires? Yeah." Then why dose nomad call him knight and he call nomad squire? And do you really believe he would kill his own squire? "They didn't make Surgebinders until some time into the Desolations, so no true Nahel bonds till then." we have already established that not all bonds are Nahel bonds
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"Sig shouldn’t have a bond if he broke his oaths." Wrong shallan Still has a bond even after breaking her oaths. "The oaths shouldn’t work if Sig completely broke them" They aren't that's the reason why he can't surgebind . "Doesn’t explain the weird squire/knight thing Sig and Aux have going on" I don't see how this is answered by Auxiliary been cognitive shadow. If anything it makes it more confusing. "If that was the case, Aux would be a little more annoyed with him, don’t you think? And he wouldn’t be as confident in using his powers as he is. And that’s ignoring the fact that when Aux said “what oaths” Sigzil’s reaction was not “oh right, I just killed my spren and broke my oaths.” If that is the case what is your explanation for the fact that he Thinks his oath should override the torment. "Alright, so it could be some random person. Or they could have had a connection beforehand (perhaps one of Dog’s squires) and then Sig bonded the Dawnshard and that connection was immensely strengthened and Aux was preserved by its power." Wouldn't that imply that his connection to a random stranger we've never even seen in the books is somehow stronger then his connection to bridge 4. "Actually, it took spren thousands of years to figure out how to bind humans. Blades were probably pretty quick." actually the singer songs suggest that the Spren first started bonding humans before the 1st desolation.
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"Why would broken oaths have any effect? Why would Sig think they should have an effect, when he knows that he's broken them? How does he still have a bond when he broke it?" This exactly my point, He must have broken his oaths very recently probably only a world or 2 before sun lit man. "They're similar, but weaker." Doesn't matter how similar they are, if one is weaker then the other then by definition they are not the same. "If they're friends, not a big deal." Speak for yourself if one of my friends killed me I would consider that a very big deal. We know all his friends which one do you think it is. Don't answer we know it couldn't be one of his friends Because Sanderson gender swapped him which he wouldn't have been able to do he was a character already introduced. "Not that hard, as long as you know what to do." First he doesn't, second you're wrong It is incredibly hard to make a CS. In fact it usually takes direct shardic intervention. "If he can bond a CS and that allows him to summon a Blade, that shouldn't be hard." Again we have no reason to suppose this is possible. As we demonstrated not all Bonds give shardblades It took the Spren thousands of years To figure it out and that was after They saw how honor did it. What makes you think a cognitive shadow would be able to just figure it out. "admit that my theory isn't completely plausible. However, I don't think it's as simple as Sig breaking his oaths and killing his Honorspren, only for Dawnshard weirdness to cause it to transform into Aux. That just doesn't really add up." What about those things doesn't add up.
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Based on what was reviled in sun lit man here is my best guess at Nomad's story post RoW. 1. The unite dawnshard is found and hoid convinces Sigzil to take it up and take it off world. 2. The dawnshard alters both his and his Spren's spirit web this unlocks new powers but brings the torment. 3. He gives up the dawn shard 4. The night brigade starts hunting him. 5. Nomad loses faith in his ideals as a result his Spren dies. 6. The event of sun lit man If I missed anything or you have a alternative time line let's discuss.
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Why would Words without power behind have any effect? Without a Spren the ideals are just ideals. How could mere human words override the commands of God. The even if could learn how they haven't yet so clearly the bonds there making now aren't Nahel bonds. I'm jumping to conclusions your the one who concluded sigzel will 1. Kill a rando for no particular reason 2. Will some how figure out how make a cognitive shadow. 3. Will succeed in make a cognitive shadow, dispite this been next to impossible. 4. Will figure out how to bond said cognitive shadow. 5. Will some how convinced the man he just killed to bond him. 6. Will figure out how to summon a cs as a shard blade (dispite us not knowing this is even possible). All this in a book he isn't even a main character in. All because he call axillary knight, and I'm the one who is jumping to conclusions?
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The bond dose different things that's the evidence. "Of course not, but where is the qualitative difference? Surgebinding may just be stronger because luckspren are stupider than Radiant spren." This make no difference I don't know what cause the bond to be different maybe you are right and it is the intelligence of the cognitive entities but regardless i do not see why what causes the bond to be different matters.
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I'm reading The Stormlight Archive for the first time
bmcclure7 replied to Amira's topic in Stormlight Archive
Well no or at least not exactly. Hearing from God is a thing in Judaism, In fact the whole religion begins when a man named abraham hears from God. That said, because Christianity is essential post messianic Judaism, the Christian and Jewish view dose differ in how available they believe the gift of prophecy to be. -
I'm reading The Stormlight Archive for the first time
bmcclure7 replied to Amira's topic in Stormlight Archive
Well the person you quote sounds confused about christianity and Jewism, (a comon problem in the modern world) but I try and explain the reality that his comment was loosely biased on. With in the Jewish law there is the concept of the prophet a choose individual who has been a vision or a word from God form the such as Jeremiah, Isaiah, Joha and so on. Now let's talk about the prophet Joel he writes "And afterward, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your old men will dream dreams, your young men will see visions." Joel 2:28 For jews this is a prophecy yet to come, When the messiah comes to his people. For christians however the messiah has already arrived. So this isn't a future prophecy anymore but a president reality so as this verses describe any all the people of God have them capability of been prophets and can hear from God directly like old testament prophets did. -
Reducing Mass is not the same as have surgebind powers, and even if it were how about painspren, gravity Spren and seons. "Aviars? There is no reason to believe that multiple forms of bonds exist." I literally just gave you 3 and you just gave me a 4. "The reason you don't get a Surge from other spren may just be that they don't fit, not the nature of the bond." I don't understand what your trying to say what do you mean by "don't fit" and how is different from "the nature of the bond"?
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"Or he started out by following his oaths fairly consistently despite his belief that they had ended, but over time became more pessimistic and slowly drifted away from them." That makes no sense, He wasn't talking about following his oaths he was talking about his oaths overriding the torment. Meaning his oaths were functioning magically. For that to work they could not have ended yet. Dead oaths even dead oaths he was keeping would not have overrided the tournament. "Other spren form bonds by going inside a creature's gemheart, something humans don't have. Seons could have a different kind of bond, or their bond could just be weaker than a Radiant bond." Exactly my point Other cognitive entities form bonds a either weeker or Fundamentally different from the Nahel bond Only one of the radiance Spren can form a Nahel bond For accelerate To do the things he does he could not be cognitive shadow.
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Bond yes Nahel bond no. Pain Spren, luck Spren and seons all form bonds. But this must be different from the nahel bond because neither warforrm, great shells, or selish humans have access to surgebinding or shardblades. The very fact that nomad expects his oaths to override the torment means that at one time they did. For that to happen whatever "ended" his oaths must have happened after becoming a dawnshard.
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"When?" Im pretty sure his high Spren calls Zeth squire but I could be wrong. But what human could nomad possibly me a squire of? His spen blade isn't hoid or Kaliden so I don't think it could be human. "Or it means that he never directly broke his oaths, as implied by him saying that his oaths ended rather than saying that he broke them. Losing a spren will do that to you." This make no sense. Even if he didn't directly break his oaths if his spren was dead it would still be that he was not bond by oaths when he took up the dawnshard which is not what the text describes. "No CS nor non-Roshar spren has ever been in a Nahel bond, at least that we've seen." Why do you think non rosharen Spren can even form Nahel bonds Seon can't so why would an non rosharen Spren much less a connective shadow be able to? Also Auxillary says Sigzil killed him? Unless you think he is going to kill some rando who happenes to become a cognitive shadow (despite this the fact that this is supposed tp be really difficult) what could this be other then his Spren.
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No Auxillary is stated to be a Spren, He is no cognitive shadow. Also We've seen sprints refer to themselves as Knights and the bonded humans as Squires before. Also Sigzil Says his oaths should override the tournament. Meaning that at 1 time they did meaning that he must have been a functional knight's radiant when the torment first started. Also Auxillary is a shard blade. No cognitive shadow or non rosharen Spren has ever show such an ability. Also a shard blade is said his truest form that would not be the case for a cognitive shadow.
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Shards involved in the Secret Project worlds
bmcclure7 replied to Benkinsky's topic in Cosmere Discussion
Why would it be out of character for ruin I was thinking that's exactly what he would do. I say ruin because 1. The magic system is very close to hymoergy. (The invested warriors vs inquisitors) 2. Magic system is inherently destructive. 3. It opens you up to mindcontrol something so far only ruin can do. 4. There is evidence that Scadrians were on this planet at some time. -
Why are people confused about Tal's honor blade?
bmcclure7 replied to bmcclure7's topic in Stormlight Archive
She would be the only one other then wit in kolinar who would know enough to want to trade a shard blade for an honor blade (that is if she is vedel). -
Why are people confused about Tal's honor blade?
bmcclure7 replied to bmcclure7's topic in Stormlight Archive
Is there any proof that she was even in the area? -
The original post was about the "wisdom" shard, Both the author and me assume that that is the same thing as the "survival" shard. If it isn't then the survival shard isnt relevant to this discussion.
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No he was able to stay awake cause he was close to the 4th ideal and because His 2nd surge is unaffected by the tower's power
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Are you really suggesting that he has broken his oaths twice? Also what exactly a about him that you found to be not honor Spren like? To me felt just like a masculine version of Syl
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Auxiliary It's pretty insistent that A. He is dead B . Sigzil killed him If he was just released from his oaths these 2 things wouldn't be the case. So then he must have broken his oaths at some point.
