BasementDwellingRadiant

Returning to Rock, I'm going to submit another possible order for him. Stonward seems too on the nose. So... What if Rock turned out to be a Lightweaver? He certainly treats his cooking like an art. And, he does tend to inspire the rest of Bridge Four towards a less depressed state. Just a thought.

On the page detailing information about the ten orders of Knights Radiant(on Brandon Sanderson's website), every Order's symbol follows a pattern. The edge of the picture is rimmed by the same color as the symbol itself, while the background color is a lighter or darker shade of that color. The Dustbringers are the only exception to this. Their glyph is red, with a grey/black background and slightly darker black outer edge. Do you guys think this could be significant?

If this has already been brought up, I'm sorry. I didn't see it. And, the detail struck me as an odd inconsistency.

Sorry in advance: This gets a little disjointed as a result of a long day at work and me not going to bed at a decent hour.

I would like to second the nomination of Rlain as a possible candidate. Not only would he provide a good go between for humans and the parsh, but his brief PoV in OB is focused on the separation, thematically speaking. Throughout the entire snippet, he is focused on how they can't hear or speak the rhythms, how spren react to them more strongly than to the parsh, and how they just don't get him. Oh, they try. But, it's just a bit off. Him finding a way to bridge(hehe... I'll show myself out...) that gap between the two species would be kinda cool after that.

As for the other suggestions put forward... Navani, Mr. T, and Fen would probably all make interesting Bondsmiths. Though, like others have pointed out, Navani would be yet ANOTHER Kholin Radiant. Truthwatchers seems more her speed, anyway. the whole helping people through knowledge is kinda what she does. That said, I still wouldn't want her to become a radiant. And, I think Rock would make a much better Lightweaver than a Bondsmith. he's referred to his cooking as an art if my memory serves. And, if it doesn't, he certainly treats it like one. Too, he's always the one to cheer up the rest of Bridge Four, give them a bit of advice while handing over a bowl of stew... It just seams to fit him better than something like Stoneward(which is a bit tooooo on the nose) or Bondsmith(though, who's to say after uniting the peaks).

5 hours ago, Q10fanatic said:

I actually really like that theory and I hope it’s correct!

Agreed. Wholeheartedly agreed.

1 hour ago, Q10fanatic said:

This makes the most sense to me. He went off looking for the missing Listeners. Maybe he finds them and has to leave his former duties as Bridge 4.

Assuming he finds them, they are certainly not on Team Odium. They will need someplace to go where they can be safe, since they will be obvious targets by the Fuzed. The Listeners completely undermine the arguments that Odium and Fuzed make to the awakened parshmen, so they represent a serious threat. What is the one place on Roshar that 1: is reasonably safe and 2: has enough space for all of them? Uritihiru. 

Once in Urithiru, Rlain is going to be too busy keeping the peace and acting as the bridge between the Listeners and the humans. He may even have to formally withdraw from Dalinar's forces or Kaladin's squires. If that happens, it makes sense to leave him off a poster of Bridge 4.

This would lend itself really well to the Rlain becomes a Bondsmith theory that floats around every once in a while.

Maybe Rlain leaves Bridge Four? Having him on the Bridge Four poster wouldn't make a lot of sense if that were the case.

2 hours ago, Goatbringer said:

I think I agree that there's like an 80% chance this will happen, but man... I will not be interested in this when it does inevitably show up. Not your theory, by the way, that's pretty hardcore, just Shallan becoming pregnant. Whatever happens in this book I don't want it to be predictable, and I feel like that's the inevitable next step, unfortunately - like a TV show that doesn't have anywhere else to go with two characters (looking at YOU, Brooklyn Nine-Nine). Adolin and Shallan are so interesting on their own, to have two characters just become parents seems so... uninteresting to me. I dunno.

I have a feeling this will happen, but I'd love for it to happen in a timeskip - like when we come back to Roshar in book 6, we have a nine-year-old heir to the Kholin princedom traipsing about. 

Ugg... Part of me really wants a Shadolin baby running around(just to see how things play out with them being very much not prepared for it and as a result needing to grow). Maybe that could be Shallan's last truth? And, because I want an Oroden, Gavinor, and Shallan/Adolin's kid bash brothers thing going on in the latter half of the series. But, dear Honor PLEASE! I don't want there to be a bunch of "Giving mommy a break" lines in there when Adolin inevitably is put in charge of caring for it because Shallan is busy doing Ghostblood and Radiant stuff. I just... hate... those comments. It's not babysitting if it's your own kid. It's being a parent.

Also, love the idea of Awakening Maya. Brandon did - if I remember correctly - say something along the lines of "it would take more than just swearing the oaths."

Lirin, I desperately want him to live. I know it's unlikely. But... fingers crossed. Might be interesting to find out we were theorizing in the wrong direction this whole time, and it's someone from Bridge Four(or elsewhere) that Kaladin can't save when he finally ascends to the next level of Radiancy. Then, getting a scene where Kal is breaking down, and Lirin understands his son's calluses aren't anywhere near as deep as he thought. So, bending down on eye level with Kal, he helps him through swearing the fourth Oath. Or... something. I do think Lirin should be involved in Kal swearing the next Oath... I just don't want him to die. We haven't seen enough of Kal's family on screen yet.

A is for Adhesion

B is for Blushing Furiously

C is for Cenn

D is for Dustbringers

E is for Everstorm

F is for Fire

G is for Gravitation

H is for Honest

I is for Immortal Words

J is for Jam

K is for Kalak

L is for Lasting Integrity

M is for Metal

N is for Next Step

O is for Oathpact

P is for Palanaeum

Q is for Queen Fen

R is for Ryshadium

S is for Shardbearer

T is for Tanavast

U is for Unmade

V is for Vorinism

W is for Windrunners

X is for (WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING STARTING WITH "X" IN STORMLIGHT ARCHIVE)

Y is for Yalb

Z is for Zephyr

... I really should be going to bed. Oh well...

I don't know what "epectations" are.

That said, I expect fun things. Bad, bad, evil destroying fun things. What I hope for? Lift is given Nightblood for safekeeping while Szeth is in jail because... reasons. Maybe they just start a conversation about food or something. And, when she goes crazy with Nightblood battle fun time and they both get really hungry, is when Azure and Vasher reunite. BUT! That would likely ruin the chances of a Dalinar, Lift, Szeth adventure to Shin in the next book. So... I don't know what I want to happen? For context on that idea: I'm thinking Dalinar is the straight man of the trio, wondering how he got involved with the guy who wants to start a crusade and a politically-ignorant friend of the emperor. (No, this wasn't my idea. It's from Shardcast. But, I still want it...)

Not very original I guess, judging from previous posts. And, sorry if this ended up being more about hopes for book five than book four...

"Book Four" Is that the Windrunners' new bookstore?

I've been thinking a lot about the third oath of the Windrunners recently, and Kaladin's progression as of Oathbringer. We've seen that not acting upon the oaths can destroy a spren and the bond. We've also seen Kaladin fail to swear an oath. The thing I'm curious about is... could someone fail to swear the third oath and not destroy the bond? It's fairly straightforward. "I will protect even those I hate, so long as it is right." And, Teft clearly struggled with that one for a while. But... it seems an oddity. Could someone simply not act to protect an individual they hate? Would that be too selfish?

Thoughts?

EDIT: My apologies for the thread's double post. That was not intentional on my part. I'm not sure what happened(or how to remove the second one).

Nope. The 10 is still there. The sword represents the 1 while the circle(planet?) is the 0.

Something else to consider:

It was mentioned in one of Dalinar's PoVs during Oathbringer that the armies had almost hunted the chasm fiends to extinction. It was also mentioned by Navani(?), though I don't remember where, that the chasm fiend gem hears were the first significantly sized gem hearts discovered in quite some time. The combination of these two factors might actually end up leading to famine depending on how often gemstones shatter during soul casting. If enough large gems break, the populous might need to resort to alternative methods of food transportation and development.

I highly doubt the whole KaladinxJasnah pairing ever happening. If for no other reason then... Kaladin is barely 20 and Jasnah is in her mid-to-late thirties. It's kinda creepy, actually.

As for predictions:

(I'm trying to think of things I haven't seen everywhere)

- Ash or Shallan's brother begin down the path of Dustbringers.

- Bridge 4 finds out the truth of what happened between Moash and Kaladin

- The resistance takes back Alethkar(or just Kholinar), maybe using Navani's flying boat

- There are more developments involving the church, but the plot line's culmination happens in book 5 along with Szeth's crusade and removing Ishar as a threat(either through violent or peaceful means).

2 minutes ago, old aggie said:

I agree with some others that the "cloud bursting with energy and light" is Honor and the "woman in the shape of a tree" is Cultivation. I wonder if the "large blue disc" isn't a shardpool? No guess as to the "figure" embracing it. Maybe the 10 kinds of spren relate more to the 10 Heralds? Ishar wouldn't have had 3 types of spren while the other Heralds have just 1. And maybe we're having difficulty because at this point Shallan doesn't know enough to be a reliable narrator, even if the chamber wasn't so dark.

This is a great thread & question @Master_Moridin !

It sounds like the art we got of Ishar, actually...

1 hour ago, Booknerd said:

Unless Kaladin Accends.

Well, his name does mean "He who is born unto eternity."

That said, I don't think Syl will "die" so much as be assimilated upon the swearing of Kaladin's final Oath. And, even that's a bit of a stretch.

I absolutely lost my sh*t reading this. It's absolutely hilarious. I very much look forward to your updates.

Sunreavers

Battlefield Role: Support troops used to fill holes in the front lines until order is reestablished

Spren: Starspren

Surges: Illumination and Division

Ideals: "I will bring light to the darkness"

"I will destroy Evil"

An Oath of Crusade. What evil will the knight dedicate their lives too destroying?

"Not all who do evil are guilty. Some have been misled. To these, I will show compassion."

Resonance: An ability to read people. Not a lie detector. But, to get a sense of who a person is within minutes of meeting them.

About: The Sunreavers were an odd order to be sure, with a wide array of mindsets and beliefs. And, though their squires and less accomplished members tended to disagree heartily with the Windrunners, their more prominent members got on quite well with that most noble of orders. (From, Hessi's Mythica)

Nightshapers

Battlefield Role: Night time air support

Spren: Nightspren

Surges: Gravitation and Transformation

Ideals: "I will serve where others cannot"

Resonance: An almost inhuman ability to see in the dark

About: Little is known about this order, even when compared to the others. From what records I have found, however, they appear to have been a reclusive group. That is not to say they isolated themselves. No. There are several tales that emphasize their generosity and spoke of them "walking among the people unseen." (From Hessi's Mythica)

I'm not sure if this has been brought up before, but...

I've been wondering recently: How powerful were the Knights Radiant as an organization? I'm not referring to our modern day "only a couple knights in a tower" group, but the olden days. The times when there were hundreds of knights in each order with even more squires to back them up. Brandon has said that a knight who has sworn the 5th oath could probably 1v1 a mistborn(or so I keep seeing everywhere). And, we've seen what individual knights can do, though none of them have sworn the final oath of their order. Thoughts? General power level? Compared to other fantasy magic user organizations?

I just want other people's takes on this, 'cause they seem EXTREMELY powerful at a glance.

Harry Potter - Windrunner or Edgedancer

Firstly, let me apologize for the massiveness of the post and its unorganized nature.

I'm not sure how the Sanderson fandom feels about fan fiction. But, with the approach of the fourth book I've been on something of a Stormlight Archive kick. And, while I lack anything resembling followthrough(though I'm trying hard to change that), my brain has started throwing up ideas for crossovers. The idea that caught my imagination is a bit cliche as a Harry Potter crossover, simply for being a Harry Potter crossover. But, my brain won't let go of it, like an axehound playing with a cremling. While it's still very much in the early planning stages, I wanted to seek out the advice of those wiser and with more critical thinking skills or Cosmere knowledge than I.

IDEA: Harry and a few others find their way onto Roshar.

Yes, that's a bit vague. But, going a bit more in-depth with this: The early chapters will likely be the group of Harry Potter characters getting themselves trapped in(and wandering through) the cognitive realm until they can find a way out. Essentially, they're world hoppers. But, Earth as a shard world was very isolated, even though it has a... customs department I think is how Brandon referred to it, within the cognitive realm. But, because of its isolation, the planet is largely a Mystery one might say(not that that has anything to do with the shard there...or does it. It's a mystery.). So, the cognitive realm is - for the most part - new to wizards, though their powers are rather closely linked to it. Transfiguration, for example, is soul casting from a different source(or at least that's how I'm going to run with it).

While in the cognitive realm, they stumble their way into Shadesmar, and eventually onto Roshar(after some shenanigans). I'm playing with the idea fo them encountering some honor spren, and Jasnah(though not at the same time). This is their first encounter with a language barrier. Fudge needing a translator in Goblet of Fire suggests there aren't any translation spells. Or, at least none in common usage. So, Bondsmith hacking isn't really an option. Culture clash will likely be a big thing, too. Though, that will probably happen more once they actually get to Roshar. Again, the beginnings of the planning stage leave specific events here to be decided.

I'm thinking the group will leave Shadesmar either through an Oathgate or somehow stumble upon Honor's Perpendicularity randomly after giving up. Alternatively, this is when they stumble upon Jasnah, and she "else calls" them out. The first "arc" for lack of a better word, will be dedicated to getting a firm grasp of the world around them. This does not mean shard blades for all! Or... any of them. No. They are... oddities... on Roshar. Only the Shin are caucasian in coloring, but their facial features are notably different from late nineteen-hundreds English standard. Facial structure-wise, the Potter characters likely look more Alethi(if my memories of the art is accurate). They are also a mix of light and dark eyed individuals, which is strange in eastern Roshar. Assumptions about social status will likely be made quite frequently. And, the group might have to play into these to remain unnoticed until they can get their feet under them.

The obvious first requirements are shelter, food, and financial security. Faked or real legal papers couldn't hurt either. But... how to get all this is probably extremely dependent upon where they end up. Currently, I'm thinking Kharbranth Transfiguration might make a good source of cash if they had anything to transfigure. They can't exactly use the Davar stratagem reliably. To ease the transition, it might be prudent to implement the "goblins make things easy" cliche found in so much HP fan fiction, and place a Gringotts bank in the Cognitive realm? "Just because wizards ignore possible income sources, human, does not mean goblins will do the same." It's an idea, at least. Start them off with some spheres, converted from Harry's vault at a steep price... Or not. Seeing what alternative sources of income they could come up with without resorting to particularly unsavory methods might be interesting, too.

I'm thinking the Palanaeum might make a fun way for the group to get their "studying" done. Language and the written word. Culture and history.  I don't intend them to stay with Jasnah after meeting her the first time. Though, having them run into her again after a while on their own might be interesting. "You!" "You." Perhaps start the story a year or two before WoK, and have them set up in Kharbranth? The majority of WoK happened on the Shattered Planes. It might be fun to see what trouble the Harry Potter characters could get up to in Taravangian's town. Hermione's parents were doctors(dentists more specifically). Maybe she tries to get a job with the surgeons  when they're running low on cash and ends up recruited by the diagram? Or, accidentally overhears a death rattle? Or, maybe one(or more) of them gets sick because they aren't used to Rosharan diseases? Both? I'm thinking the wizards - being from a completely different shard world - would be another blindspot for the diagram. That might be the end of that "arc." Have them need to make an escape from the Diagram(organization) and flee the city after getting one of their number out. Or, maybe they don't get one of their number out? Seeing friends on opposite sides of a war is always heartrending. 

That's... about as far as my rough plans go. Some questions I have, or aspects of the story I'd like advice about are:

Firstly, who should be in the group from HP!Earth? I have a couple different group makeups in mind. The first is Sirius and Remus, with Harry and maybe a couple other kids from Hogwarts. This would probably lead to the two adults trying to protect Harry and the other kids, with Harry getting annoyed because adults have never really been there for him before. They might see establishing a no-body light-eyed house that suddenly rises to financial prominence as a great prank, as well as making a place Harry can just be a kid... which he'd hate. This might even lead to Sirius needing to accept responsibility and grow up a bit... becoming a radiant in the process because Roshar.

The other group I was thinking about was the six who went to the Department of Mysteries in book five, and leaving the kids without any adults to look to for leadership. This would put Harry in charge. He'd beat himself up over his MASSIVE BLUNDER and want to protect them. And... attract an Honor spren. I am certainly open to other ideas as well. These two just lend themselves to the ever popular divergence point of the Department of Mysteries battle. But, I do want it to be a group. I believe that if there are multiple characters from Harry Potter world, it would give the story a more epic feel, rather than simply "x character in y setting."

Secondly, the obvious elephant in the room is the HP magic system and its interactions with Roshar. Simply put, it breaks things HARD. Duplicating spells. Unlocking charms. I saw one crossover(of the two on FFn) where Lumos would fill spheres with stormlight. And, while I think that's cool... it'd also be busted as all bleep. There's probably a host of other things I'm not thinking of. So, would it be prudent to have spells require stormlight on Roshar? Just claim the investiture takes a different form, and as such a different power source is required? Or, maybe you can infuse wand cores? Or... something?

There are probably a whole lot of other things I'm forgetting. But, it's getting late. And, this is getting long. So, I'll leave it here.

Thanks in advance  for any feedback or suggestions you can give me.

(This probably won't materialize until after I finish reading Rhythm of War. But, I figured I'd get an early start on planning.)

I trust Brandon to write a good story, generally speaking. But, I really hope that Kaladin's fourth oath doesn't have him chosing between Lirin and some other group. While I like the idea of his father being involved in Kaladin speaking the fourth ideal, given the lessons he's always tried to teach... I don't like the idea of it becoming a simple, cliche "chose between your duty and a loved one," scene. Plus, given how most wind runners seem incapable of speaking oaths when not in a stressful situation(except Lopin), that would lead to a lot of dead loved ones over the years... 

13 hours ago, robardin said:

"Life before death. Strength before weakness. Journey before destination. Speak again the ancient oaths and return to men the Shards they once bore."

But based on this strange object I unaccountably discovered in my office supply room at work today, perhaps there are more Words beyond "journey before destination"...?

Hotel ... Trivago 

My apologies for this quick and possibly unorganized post. I'm half-asleep and should really be going to bed. But... well. Thinking. I have no evidence for this, and it is less a theory than a question and stray thought that has been haunting my mind for a few days now: Are the Bondsmiths' Oaths more individualized than the other orders'? We've seen some level of similarity between knights of other orders. In the climax of book one, Syl speaks to Kaladin about him knowing the words. Kaladin and Teft have somewhat similar second oaths. Pattern has outright told Shallan what structure the Lightweavers' truths take. But, such a topic is never broached with Dalinar. The Stormfather has never implied anything about the oaths of the Bondsmiths. He's never said anything like "You know the words," at least as far as I can remember. And, when he speaks, they seem to almost come out of nowhere. They are fitting, mind you. I am not saying "oh his oaths are trash because they aren't ever foreshadowed" or anything like that. What I mean to say is that Dalinar seems to decide upon his own Oaths. Could all Bondsmiths be like this?

Or, could it vary based upon which "god spren" the Bondsmith has bonded?

I apologize if this topic has been discussed before. But, in my half-asleep state I wanted to know what you all thought of the possibility.

Thoughts?

59 minutes ago, Spaceferring said:

Yeah I remember that one, I think Syl is just jealous of him attracting other spren than her or her"cousins". If I recall correctly, he just drew a few of them, not abnormal amounts.

By the way, in that scene, aren't there also a ton of windspren? 

Yes, there are.

At the risk of throwing a slight wrench into the theory(though a very small one): What about that scene in OB where Kal attracts some Glory Spren and Syl hits one of them, saying "Mine!"

For clarification, this happens when Kaladin is scouting things out and he tries to save a bunch of people during the high storm.