Kammererite

Thanks so much for reading Kasia and Robinski. And thanks for the line by lines they will be a big help. I currently (have been all week) out east getting set up for a move, but i will reply to the comments in more full next week (and get critiquing again). I already have a few things in mind for some changes that i will make to keep the tension higher. 

Cheers. 

Here is a place for your comments. 

All comments and feedback are welcome; however i have one point i would like input on in particular.

Does the Tavern scene feel to contrived and/or coincidental?

Cheers and thanks for reading.

I enjoyed both POV's but i liked Roamwald more on a straight up comparison as i felt the conflict came though better as he was the one in danger.

That said for your story on a whole i think there is a more important question to ask.Is this the only Roamwald POV or will there be more? 

I am bias to stories with only one POV, and it feels late to be bringing in a second POV big picture wise.

So in conclusion i liked the Roamwald scene better but think the Jennie POV will be better for the story. (Yes i am no help)

Other note in the Roamwald POV: "They were the last"...that's an ominous but awesome line.

I too would like to submit this upcoming Monday. 

Very cool world building.

I think there are real world issues with rock spires exciting in a vast ocean not only in formation but in stability.

The engineering you described above for the shell city's doesn't seam reasonable to me. assuming the building material is denser then water it would sink to the bottom of the ocean and that should be a considerable depth that they cant use it for foundation (same with the ceramic rod foundation).  Also sub oceanic currents would wash away lots of the material. 

However as this is a fantasy i am able to look pass this and let it go with a hand wave.

World-ocean: This sound very Sci fi to me and tells me they have explore the entire world.

I think you over described the opening but once on the spire i think it was the right amount.

Overall:  I enjoyed it. Cool world concepts with what seems like an simple yet deep magic system. I like the mystery component although i wish there was a bigger hook. 

Thanks for reading Krystalynn. I'm Glad to know the little tidbits worked for you. 

• “addicted” – I thought this felt a little odd in the last submission because it felt so modern, but I feel more accepting of it here. I think if I’d had more of a modern techno-fantasy feel out of the first sub (a setting problem) I would have accepted it easier then.

hmm. I will have to think about how to work with this. I envisioned a tech level that is iron-ageish with suppressed metallurgy to bronze. Although there is a kind of magic renaissance that lets them get around the need for iron (which has not been discovered other then as meteorites).   

• “bark” – Why a bark? Is she an animal? Are there dogs around so that it might not be noticed by guards? Seems I’m missing something

Its kind of the bird call trope but there are not any birds in the city but dogs are very common. I might have to world build it a little more in city background noise to get the this point across.

• I did like the bit referencing the dad. It was so small that it felt like you’d used these characters in other stories or that you’d really put some thought into them.

Thanks. In fact i did use them in another story, which really helped me figure out who the characters are.  

• I really like him not realizing fully that he got shot in his fake leg. That was a nice way to end the scene on tense, but closing, note.

Thanks!

• Kang and Rakella’s following conversation runs almost too fast. While I appreciate not going to visit the redsmith if it wasn’t doing anything other than progress the plot, I do feel like the dialogue is jerking the narrative around a bit.

This Conversation is going to getting a complete rework and i am going to switch the lead to the Drakkon order to Rakella finding a record of the unique potions being sold. I think this will give me more words to get across the crucial points and extend the dialogue rather then  having more facts to get across.   

• And now they’re arresting Kang? The guards/police in this city are starting to look like idiots.

Kind of but you got to give therm some credit. What do you think would happen in Real life if a cop found you standing over the dead body of another cop. 

 

 

the grammar wasn’t as bad as last week’s…

yay improvement. 

 

Keep going to the finish, but some turns of your story may call for a little more creativity in revision to make the plot a little fresher and less tv episode-like.

I see my roots of bad tv fantasy shows/movies are starting to show through. Will have to cover them up. 

Thanks again for the awesome feedback and the encouragement.

Does anyone else ever have that problem when writing scenes of groups of 3+ characters?

I do as well. I find dialogue the hardest part as you get two people talking but forget about the third.

Your suggestion about him spotted in the distance sounds ideal to me.

Good to know. 

Hey, you know I had forgotten about his old 'habit' of thinking everything. Good job kicking that!

I would not say kicked the habit quite yet. My first draft was riddle with them but i edit most of it out. 

For the avoidance of doubt, I do enjoy your stuff. I always feel I'm in that rugged, icy, winter 'wilderness' sort of setting. I'm always able to imagine/picture a real atmosphere.

Good to here. I wasn't sure if the cold would come through but i am glad it did. 

Thanks for reading and the great feedback once again. 

II thought. Kang’s escaping the guards on his fake leg was unconvincing and the reveal of the assassin was, if I'm harsh, rather clumsy.

-During  my last few edits i was getting more worried about this but wasn't sure if it was an issue. I am thinking of changing it to him being spotted after he is already in the distance. Would this work better for you?

 

I know that Aspik doesn’t know that Kang has spoken to Lumi, but if he’s that badly wounded, why is he receiving people? Why would he pull a blind when it’s so hard for him? Just to reveal that he’s the assassin seems to be the answer.

 

I think you need to trust that reader to see the signs of Aspik’s wound, and make their reveal much more subtle. Readers are much more observant than you give them credit for here.

You are right. not sure where the line is yet.  

 

Suggestion: Personally, I would hide the first wince more, but let the reader detect it, and let Kang notice it. Then, he could ask Aspik to draw the blinds for them, that way Kang looks clever for drawing Aspik out and the blind is closed for a reason, rather than for the purposes of the plot.

 

Just my 2 cents on the plot in this submission.

I really like this, and might have to use it unless i can think of something better. As Kasia commented this reveal needs to be built up better so i will work on that for the next version. 

 

The other thing I would comment on is that Kang’s addiction could be made more of. Maybe that will come later in the story, but I wonder if it might start to affect him more at critical times. Shaking, headaches? I don’t know how it manifests, but I don’t think it’s clear how he’s using the Essence of Fire at this point, or whether he’s only taking it to control his ‘symptoms’.

Good points. The withdrawal symptoms start to play up more in the next sub, but your right on it could come a little more in this sub. 

 

I'm hoping the next submission is more convincing, but I'm still on board with the story.

So do i. 

 

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“vast open plains of the subglacial cavern” – How can a cavern have vast open plains? I don’t get it. ‘Vast plains’ sounds like mile after mile – all enclosed in a cavern?! Sounds impossible to me.

Its a paradox. No i was going for giant 5kmish cavern.  Engineering wise i think its possible but i haven done the maths.

 

 

“Might find out who forged it” – This kind of thing bothers me. It’s quite a common trope in detecting stories, searching out the origin of some piece of evidence. That dagger could have been in the killer’s family for decades, and he could have come from thousands of miles away. The chances of some smith in town being able to tag it are (or should be) tiny.

I didn't even think of the inheriting aspect. Original i was going to use the potion as a clue but thought that was to much like cheating. Maybe ill go back to that. 

 

How does Kang evade the guards when he slides down the rope? They have two legs, but he just hobbles away from them? Not convinced by that at all.

Very good point will change as noted above

 

Back to the dagger – why would any assassin trying to protect his identity use a weapon that marked out his place of origin? Not a very good assassin, unlessssss, it’s a ploy by someone else to direct attention towards another country. Hmm, okay, I hope it’s the latter, because otherwise it’s a Drakkon, it’s bit too easy.

I might have to world build this better and the answer might be explained in the next sub, although i am not sure if its sufficient to your question. I will think on this.  

 

I was confused when there are suddenly two guards in front of them. I got no sense that they were walking anywhere. Also, it’s not far away from where they met.

I'll block in some action. that should let me show passage of distance and better cement the setting.

 

“Rakella’s elbow digs into my ribs. “You’re a knight remember.”” – I don’t think you need this. All you need is Kang starting to speak then correcting himself after her nudge. It’s more subtle, slicker – I think.

Good to know. 

 

“Just the hidden blade then please” – This is a really overused trope (there must be another word for that). How many times have we seen and read it? Man is searched but has a hidden weapon. I think if you're going to use that it needs to be delivered way better. What is it supposed to tell us?

This was a very last minute change as original he was having his cane confiscated and replaced by a walking stick. however it felt wrong so i changed it but didn't want him to have a weapon. Know that i think more on it i could just have him surrender the blade upfront.  

 

“He pulls aside the heavy fur door covering and lets out a wince” – This seems to be a clear indication that he is wounded and it therefore the assassin. If it’s true, or if it’s misdirection on your part to make us think that, either way it’s still too obvious a sign. I think it should be disguised more.

will do.

 

“He…he killed himself” – This does not need saying. The reader has just observed it. I think she should say something else. She’s not that dense, surely. It’s an opportunity to deliver some other line that adds something to the scene, rather than this nothing statement.

I was going for shock. But that's a good point. 

Thanks again for all the great feedback. The good thing is at least Kang isn't constantly thinking what he is doing in this story. 

Thanks for reading Neongray, and making it to the end.  

I'm catching a lot of adverbs that are either unnecessary or where a more evocative phrase would do. Similarly, where you have speech tags at all a lot of them are very said-bookism-y. Using growl as a speech tag generally makes me check right out of a piece, eg-- it particularly stands out there because the dialogue is able to carry that particular weight. That said you're definitely avoiding dialogue tags far too much. Don't be afraid of the words 'say' and 'says', and don't be shy about including activity with a bit of dialogue; as it is the complete absence makes for a really... hmm, kind of bland feeling.

I will take a look at adding in some dialouge tags with scene action/description to energize the story.

 

 

'work out more' is a really strange phrase here.

To modern? ill try and age it. 

 

I feel like this dialogue with Lumi does not scan; to me it reads less like dialogue and more like point notes of what information neededed to be delivered to the reader in this scene.  Think about what sort of people are talking and the way they phrase things. Among other things it's too detailed and too specific, I think.

The same goes with this dialogue with Rakella. All it's doing is conveying information. It's not giving me a reason to care about the person saying it; it reads less like dialogue and more like a summary of the location from a manual.

I will work on making the dialogue less listy and more natural. 

Thanks for reading as well EoTFP

+1 on the 'portable ballista' issue, if you want to describe it as larger and heavier than your regular, standard-issue crossbow, I suggest 'arbalest'.

-I'll think on this. The idea is its a crossbow that can fire a small harpoon so much heavier then a standard. I really do not like the word arbalest. I think it is pushing the obscure side of weapons knowledge. More people knows what a ballista  is then an arbalest...i think.

 

I liked the counting seconds sequence at the beginning.

-Thanks!! Glad it worked.

 

Lumi describes the murderer as "it" all the time; I understand that you don't want to reveal at that point whether the figure is male or female, but using 'it' in a conversation in that way feels a bit contrived.

Also, since you reveal it's a man just a bit later in the same chapter, basically the first guy they talk to about it, I don't see much point in making the figure's gender a mystery.

-Good point.

 

I'm curious to see how the story will develop.

-Thanks and thanks again for reading

Interesting set up.

- I see your comment on it above but patrician really stood for me as a "what are they ?" question when reading. 

-I like the "magic system" and the personification of curses.  

-I was a little confused on the setting of these scene. i think were underground but its unclear. I am also unsure if this is a more traditional fantasy or modern fantasy tech level as graffiti instantly make me think urban. 

- Who is sen hamulus i thought they were summoning Carsus Matrax

Starting the first line with a pronoun rather then the pov's name is awkward for me. 

I felt like you spent to much time telling me how poor they where on the first pages. i liked how you showed the poverty with the flowers after that  which was very nicely done and could have stood without the lead up.

The temple was over described for me and i found myself skimming until she entered the inner sanctum.

On page 9  there is a small blocking issue for me. The priest escorting her becomes a priestess or does he depart after she reaches the alter and a priestess comes along later

Intriguing end that had me wanting to find out what the priestess wants and why she is so interested in Lasila.

Thanks for reading. some comment on your comments.

I do appreciate the grammar warning. I am thusly prepared to dive in! (P.S. - if you ever want LBL edits to help with the grammar, let me know. I can do them just as easily in Track Changes, then send you the doc back via e-mail)

This would be extremely helpful. Thanks 

 

Overall

I waiver on this submission. I like the principle idea, but the delivery was mostly dialogue with little descriptors. I also didn't get a sense of voice at all. The scenes change quite a bit, without a lot of time or description of any. It left me with reader whiplash, craving more information and becoming less and less interested in the story the farther it progressed. I think your premise is strong, but the execution could use some work. And grammar, of course, is an issue, but that can be easily repaired.

Thanks. The right balance of description is something i battle with,  

 

As I go:

- second to last paragraph on page two is getting adjective heavy.

Noted

 

- page three: in these climbing scenes, I'm having a hard time connecting. It's hard to do a climbing scene well. You might want to check out Wolfwalker by Tara K. Harper. Her climbing scenes are utterly breathless, and really give reader chills. You might be able to pick some language from there that helps add urgency to these pages.

-Thanks, ill look into it.  

 

- page 4: Lumi's description of what happens is... hard to read. You're spending time on blocking that doesn't need to be blocked, and leaving out blocking that would help. For instance, instead of all the privy blocking, just say "as I came from the privy", then expand about where and how the blood was found.

-Good to know. ill put that down to discovery writing but its no excuses for not fixing it in the edit.

 

- page 5: if the guy was bundled in a long cloak, how does she know how much damage she did?

I was going with the length of the blade,to the approximate area of the thrust. Might simplify that line. 

 

- page 7: I started skimming here, and had to go back and reread. The flow is jumping, and I need more cementing within each scene to make me want to be engaged with it. For instance, you throw in a word like 'grimories', which is very interesting and immediately makes me mind go to 'Wicked'. Talk more about this stuff. Lay the groundwork. Just dropping neat words isn't enough. I want to know their place, their history. I want to be immersed in this world.

Good ideas. i'll have to brainstorm how to do this with out over building/bloating the story. 

 

- Is there a purpose to the non-standard spellings? 'Wytch' instead of 'witch', etc.

I like the letter "y". yes it is a bad excuse.

 

- page 11: the stomach wound reveal would be more compelling if done through descriptive showing. Have the guy come in favoring a side, or holding a tray far away from his midsection. Draw suspicion. Have him brush against the edge of a high-backed chair with his front and wince, drop something. THEN have the dialogue. Build it up for tension.

-Gah. I had a little bit more in their pre-edit but cut it. why did i cut it

Thanks for all the great feedback, and advice.

Cheers

As always i enjoyed this submission. It flowed nicely and had a great action sequence. I can't think of anything that didn't work for me.

I really liked the resolution of the action, although i am a little surprised at papas reaction at being fine with a "Snatcher" holding his daughter. I though he might have been a little more torn.

Nothing of Leon stood out against me and felt in character, although it really says something abut him that he would shoot at a creature holding his niece even when corned

And for my submission Nit-pick: Rivers: I think it is very rare for a lake to outflow along two rivers (although i could be wrong) as water flows downhill via the lowest path. 

Thanks for the Sub. 

Hi all,

Great opening line.

I enjoyed the world building in the story although i wish it were a little more focus on why the family was so poor which was a big question for me rather then the other world building.

Something in Lasila and her brothers conversation felt off to me but i am not really sure what. I think it might be how all of a sudden she's acting so much younger and complaining about everything compared to how mature she acted earlier in the submission. That said i do like the conflict you are introducing in this dialogue for going forward.

I didn't have a problem picking up the transition from her brother to his name.

Good ending.

  I'm guessing from Kammerite's spelling of "centre" that he hails from overseas.  

Canada actually

I'll toss my hat in as well

I enjoyed reading this submission. There was some nice worldbuilding and character development.

Pascal: It is probably weekly reader syndrome but i thought Pascal was dead. Her appearance really threw me for a loop.

Centre of middle America: This is a very vague description to me. I assume you me the centre of middle US (also i could have swore earlier you said Araum was in the north.) but it can also because middle America might refer to Central America. 

Fifteen shares on the pings on page 6. I think there is a slight blocking issue here as he never looks at his pings with his fifteen shares displayed. Plus why would it display his daily rate not his total account. 

Kabob: How did Pascal know he bought a kabob. If she say this then she would have seen the prostitute corner him. 

"We fight the rex..": This line felt like it came from nowhere and was very jarring to me. i went back to see if i missed something but couldn't make sense of it. 

Great ending. Look forward to the next. 

Thanks for reading Spieles and all the great feedback. 

p. 1 First line is too long - I had to read it twice. I'd split the sentence in two - also, as it stands right now, it's a bit confusing so breaking it into might help.

Good point.

 

I told him not to call me that. - The full title? Or one of the specific names?

Mainly the title. 

 

I'm curious why we get the lengthy description of "a lone man with raven hair, a trim goatee and reeks of arctic lilies. He wears a red and blue quartered tunic with the crest of the textile guild emblazoned on the front" - when the man just walks away... I'm supposing we'll be seeing him again. Also, I'm wondering why Kang felt the need to approach him instead of just nursing his honey-wine. 

I got a little carried away, I'll cut it back (as with many other meaningless descriptions). He approaches because he was trying to be more social, I'll flag that. 

 

Describing everyone's clothes is starting to be a bit much. I'm more interested in the taste of the mead, the stink of perfume, the nervous movements of the room, etc.

Noted

 

I enjoyed the explanation about milking a yeti.

Thanks. 

 

On p. 6-7 for being inside Kang's head, I have no clue why he's getting so angry over what seems to be an honest expression of interest in his life - as opposed to all of the dishonest rumor mongering. It'd be more natural if he gave a surface explanation - and then they pried, maybe directly about his father - and that prying did not go over well.

Great Point! I will definitely adjust that.

Thanks for reading and the feedback Robinski. Will work some more on finding an editing process that works for me.

Summary below, straight into the inline comments. I'm not going to comment on the grammar. I laughed when I saw your explanation of the ‘G’ rating, but really, do you not read through submissions before you put them up? What is your strategy for correcting it, because grammar issues are rife through the whole text?

After words grammer check, I read through the submission  twice before putting it up. Once forwards and once backwards sentence by sentence. I have a difficult time editing as i can never read what is written on the page. I always drift to autopilot and read what i intended. If you don'y me asking what is the major grammatical error i keep repeating.

 

“examining the great tabard depicting the exile of the gods” – Okay, I had to bite on this one, since we had a whole tabard conversation a couple of weeks ago. I guess you mean tableau, or possibly even tapestry.

I meant tapestry, Must have got the words confused.

 

The opening of the dialogue between Kang and Rakella sounds like two young teenagers who’ve been raised on bad soap operas. It steers away from it a bit after the first two clichés, but thereafter there is a deluge of dialogue with barely any space for breath as different characters come and go. I thought that was a real pacing issue.

Noted, and will make it less soapy.

 

There is a lot of description, which is good up to a point, but there are a couple of places where it feels odd, and that I am reading only description and nothing else. 

Good to know, will prune with shears.

I'm fine with handwavium for the cave. I just thought i put the information out there as i find caves are missportyed all the time (especially the giant caves under cities in movies).

I will second Robinskis point about the shifting POV's I found this very disorienting. I think for the most part you are in Child's POV which i enjoyed but you occasionally pop in to the hunters POV (during action sequences) or in one case i notice the chimeras.

I now Incisors are teeth but i don't know which teeth and i don't think there pointy so this doesn't come off as scary to me like a mouth full of canines would. 

How does the hunter know how to use Child power. its very different then hers and he seams to master it like its nothing two it which seams broken to me. 

I like this gathering the best hero premise/plot

I was a little sad there was not dragonling description.

Overall, there was some good dialogue some, very cool world-building concepts and I like the plot direction at this point in time.

Thanks for reading RDP. Great grammer catches!

- If he's so dangerous, would revelers talk so candidly behind his back? 

I will think on this.  Might skew ther roomers so the ideas that most people don't think he is a real person comes across stronger.

 

- There's a little too much infodumping from Rakella, especially when Lumi enters the room. I think the reader can gather as much from Kang's reaction, and besides, it's more interesting to see why he's so nervous by her appearance. 

Good to know

 

- Having read Essence of Fire, it is really cool to see Kang developed into a full-fledged knight, yet still with a good share of nervousness and quirks.

Thanks, i was hoping it would transition well. 

 

- Overall, I really like this as a sequel to Essence of Fire, furthering Kang's development as a Knight while still keeping him rough about the edges. I can't wait to read more.

Glad you enjoyed it. 

I think if you give some more visual up front maybe it would help me see it as the cheaper alternative to wine, but I still think that the word mead alone is going to make the event seem less elegant, simply because of its use in vernacular and culture. The descriptions you did provide were clear enough, so I think you could add in a little more to make it easier to see. I didn't get anything to tell me that it's in an extreme cold environment. If there was some mention in there, I guess it's not enough because I didn't catch it.

 

I'll think on the mead. There were some very small hints to the cold environment, however since this scene takes place inside a building in a city i didn't see a good way to show it. The setting should be better revealed in the next chapter.

 

One other nitpick, a pet peeve, I really hate it when I get character eye color in a first chapter unless it's very significant, and 99% of the time it's not. It makes me think amateur writer because it smacks of school, rather than modern literature. Just my two cents. Thanks for sharing!

 

Good to know, i'll keep that in mind. 

Standalone works in an existing world are a difficult proposition. You'll have to find a balance between explaining the world enough for new readers and not so much that it becomes frustrating for those already familiar with the setting. IMO you're actually off to a decent start for that.

Thanks. Nice to hear. 

 

For me it's not so much the mead itself that clashes with the 'sophistication' of ice sculptures, but that people apparently drink from horns, which is awfully, uhm... 'rustic'.

Good point. I never even though about that. 

 

I'm not sure the easiest way to resolve the inconsistency is to class up the drinks. You know your setting better than anyone, is it necessary that they be ice sculptures? Maybe wood or stone would work equally well? 

Ice feel like it fits the setting best and hints at the cold environment. Wood would be very expensive in this setting as there are not any trees (at least not locally). Stone is an option, will think on it. 

 

Thanks for Reading and commenting EagleoftheForestPath.